motor

jeroen40 · 01-24-2004, 02:47 PM

I'm a big fan of vintage motorracing and a little while ago I was exploring honda's bike history.
They produced some serious racing machine's

a LITTLE example:

50 cc RC116

Difference between the RC115 and the RC116 is a new bore and stroke, now being 35.5 x 25.14 mm. Power output is 16 bhp at 21,500 rpm. This means 320 bhp per litre and a Pme of nearly 16 kg/cm2 ! As regards bhp per litre, this is a figure that has never been surpassed by any naturally aspirated four stroke engine, and even today's formula 1 cars cannot hold a candle to it. I know this is not a totally fair comparison, but it gives an idea of the level of four stroke technology nearly 40 years ago. This engine is the most advanced of all the Honda engines. Red line at 22,500 rpm. Carburettors have flat slides. The gearbox contains a nine speed cluster. Dry weight of the bike is 58 kg. The piston pin has a diameter of 9 mm and weighs 6 g. The inlet valve head is 13 mm, the exhaust valve head is 11.5 mm, and the stems are 3.5 mm diameter. Weight of the exhaust valve: 6 g.

That's what I call some fine little engineering

zevolv · 01-24-2004, 03:05 PM

that doesn't make it the most powerfull Naturally Aspirated engine though.
It still only makes 16HP

jeroen40 · 01-24-2004, 03:09 PM

sorry,
I mean specific power.... hp/l

320 hp/l is the highest rate for a N/A engine

veilsidebr · 01-24-2004, 03:15 PM

N/A engine? Maclaren F1 V12 627 horsepowers, with no turbo and blower. This is awesome.

AlienDB7 · 01-24-2004, 03:22 PM

That still doesn't make sense. Engine efficiency doesn't scale up/down linearly so you can't compare things like that.

Having said that, I wish they put this technology into good use so people can finish mowing their lawn and blowing the leaves faster. Probably less pollution too.

yg60m · 01-24-2004, 03:34 PM

In terms of specific power, the 500 cc of the bike Championship developped more than 200 bhp for only 500 cc, that's more than 400bhp/litre, and i don't know the figures for the 125/250 cc but i imagine it's even higher. Of course they were/are two strokes engines but they were/are N/A too

Concerning the F1 engines, they are not far (regarding the claiming power from manufacturers) from 320 bhp/l but, it's true that it took them 40 years to get it.

graywolf624 · 01-24-2004, 03:37 PM

"I mean specific power.... hp/l
"

I've said it before and I'll say it again. hp/liter says nothing for performance or any other real world numbers. At very least look at power per weight.

racer_f50 · 01-24-2004, 03:42 PM

Originally Posted by veilsidebr

N/A engine? Maclaren F1 V12 627 horsepowers, with no turbo and blower. This is awesome.

Ferrari Enzo V12 660 hp.

kawa22 · 01-24-2004, 03:45 PM

Originally Posted by yg60m

In terms of specific power, the 500 cc of the bike Championship developped more than 200 bhp for only 500 cc, that's more than 400bhp/litre, and i don't know the figures for the 125/250 cc but i imagine it's even higher. Of course they were/are two strokes engines but they were/are N/A too

Concerning the F1 engines, they are not far (regarding the claiming power from manufacturers) from 320 bhp/l but, it's true that it took them 40 years to get it.

Nsr 500 Big Bang...190bhp but it's 2T,for 4T i think that v-tec engine is the best.Honda!!!!

jeroen40 · 01-24-2004, 03:47 PM

I remind you that it's not a vtec,
just a normal 50cc twin-cilinder four stroke... imagine the japanese knowledge even 40 years ago! they were only racing motorbikes for less then 10 years!

antonioledesma · 01-24-2004, 03:55 PM

graywolf624 is correct, but what i think jeroen40 wants to say is...
for example, you have a vw old beetle, the "new" engine, 1.6 liters, 44 hp. (I know it's a boxster engine, air cooled, older than anything), and... a honda civic si 1999 or 2000(or sir as i knew it in my country), the same displacement of 1.6 liters, and you had 160 hp.

in the beetle you have 27hp/liter
in the civic you have 100hp /liter

this numbers don't mean this engine or their cars will be slow or fast, only the long way manufacturers have come to milk a 1.6 engine from 44 hp, to a good 160 hp.

of course what you're looking for is the power-weight ratio the engine has alone and in a car

hope i made an useful contribution, if not... sorry

scubywrxr · 01-24-2004, 04:47 PM

a williams F1 V10 is regarded as being the most powerful NA engine - over 900bhp for almost 2hours of flat racing

chernobyl · 01-24-2004, 05:07 PM

Originally Posted by scubywrxr

a williams F1 V10 is regarded as being the most powerful NA engine - over 900bhp for almost 2hours of flat racing

I would actually say that towards the end of the last season they were upwards of 950bhp but with the new engine rules i can see a relatively large loss of that power for most of the season.

Chingachgook · 01-24-2004, 06:37 PM

Teh V12 of the TVR Cerbera Speed 12. The real power isn't known

Vansquish · 01-24-2004, 06:46 PM

But it was a monstrous 7.7L unit...the question is what was the highest specific output for a naturally aspirated engine...I think I have the answer (at least in terms of actual cars that people can sit in with a roof over their heads) the F50 GT1 produced 720bhp from a 4.7L NA V12...i.e. 153.19 bhp/L which is higher than the current record-holder the Honda S2000 (prior to it's reworking into a 2.2L engine), as it only had 120 bhp/L. Still, neither is a patch on a Formula 1 engine or a bike engine. F1 engines produce something in the neighborhood of 300bhp/L.