Graywolf624 vs. SFDMALEX Fight Fight Fight!

[graywolf624]

Where does getting hit in the head make you tough? It doesn't. Your assuming the boxer has a chance to actually hit the wrestler in the head.. If the wrestler is good he wont. A wrestlers whole job is to get you to the ground and control your hands and feet before you can do anything. If he imobilizes your hands it doesnt matter how good you are with taking hits to the head.. Your toast.

And yes.. Wrestlers take plenty of hits to the head. Ive been slammed on my head more times then I can count. Happens quite often when you get thrown, something that doesnt happen in boxing. You try being picked up like a rag doll, tossed, and then have someone your own weight land on top of you. Then tell me thats not tough.

[SFDMALEX]

Lastly what makes you think that a boxer will just stand there and only use his hands?

Do you really think that if I stand there and I see some guy going for my ankles Im not going to soccer kick his head?

[SFDMALEX]

Originally Posted by graywolf624 Where does getting hit in the head make you tough? It doesn't

Uhh, well I guess we just have a different idea of toughness then.

To me tough is get hit and keep standing, cause if you are on the ground knocked out or phased I can do just about anything...

If I hit you and you drop then I dont see how thats tough.

[graywolf624]

Do you really think that if I stand there and I see some guy going for my ankles Im not going to soccer kick his head?

If it were that simple to stop a wrestler.. It isn't. It takes alot of skill. I can take you down so that you cant kick me in the head.. And if you have never practiced defending it, no matter who you are.. If your not dead on with that first hit your going down. And remember.. I havent wrestled in years.. Its a simple fact.. In fighting you will only succeed against an attack if youve practiced the correct defenses against it. A boxer hasnt.. hes fucked.

[graywolf624]

To me tough is get hit and keep standing, cause if you are on the ground knocked out or phased I can do just about anything...

The problem with that arguement.. Youd be stupid to fight against someones strength.. That isn't tough, thats stupid. You use your advantages.. And tough in the end is the guy that wins, not the guy who can take punches while standing up.

6 mins on a wrestling mat would change your mind.. If you lasted 20 secs Id be amazed to be honest. Anyone who has ever done it will tell you that wrestling is easily the most intense phsical per short amount of time. Thats part of being tough. Theyd also tell you, depending on the style, some of the moves down right hurt. Punch in the head fine.. but how about I twist your ass into a pretzel so your arm almost breaks after throwing you and landing on you. If you arent in some sort of pain at that point you dont have nerve endings.

The simple fact is.. The wrestler knows how to do basic defense against a boxer.. The boxer does not know how to do basic defense against the wrestler. That means the wrestler has an edge. If hes smart, exploits it, and the boxer misses the first punch.. its over.. Once on the ground the boxer wont be able to use his fists, which means hes defenseless.

[SFDMALEX]

Originally Posted by graywolf624 Do you really think that if I stand there and I see some guy going for my ankles Im not going to soccer kick his head? If it were that simple to stop a wrestler.. It isn't. It takes alot of skill. I can take you down so that you cant kick me in the head.. And if you have never practiced defending it, no matter who you are.. If your not dead on with that first hit your going down. And remember.. I havent wrestled in years.. Its a simple fact.. In fighting you will only succeed against an attack if youve practiced the correct defenses against it. A boxer hasnt.. hes fucked.

Well we'll just never know till we see one of each go head to head will we?


All I can say is that I fought all my life, only now did I slow down. Kickbox, box, I dont have any formal grappling training but I can still wrap my legs around someones head while on the ground. And I also had my fare share of scraps outside the ring, and I dont remeber a time when someone went for my legs and I didnt get a chance to get something in on them.

[graywolf624]

any formal grappling training but I can still wrap my legs around someones head while on the ground. And I also had my fare share of scraps outside the ring, and I dont remeber a time when someone went for my legs and I didnt get a chance to get something in on them.

Then your not fighting the right people... Its visible in K1 and UFC even. The people without any grappling experience get their ass kicked. The ones that are the best at strikes go get grappling experience.. Because its a rare day in hell when a fight doesnt go to the ground.

grappling training but I can still wrap my legs around someones head while on the ground

If it were only that simple.

[graywolf624]

Well we'll just never know till we see one of each go head to head will we?

Im sure we could... A buddy of mine trains for ufc.. Im sure he could provide exhibition matches.

[SFDMALEX]

Originally Posted by graywolf624 To me tough is get hit and keep standing, cause if you are on the ground knocked out or phased I can do just about anything... The problem with that arguement.. Youd be stupid to fight against someones strength.. That isn't tough, thats stupid. You use your advantages.. And tough in the end is the guy that wins, not the guy who can take punches while standing up. 6 mins on a wrestling mat would change your mind.. If you lasted 20 secs Id be amazed to be honest. Anyone who has ever done it will tell you that wrestling is easily the most intense phsical per short amount of time. Thats part of being tough. Theyd also tell you, depending on the style, some of the moves down right hurt. Punch in the head fine.. but how about I twist your ass into a pretzel so your arm almost breaks after throwing you and landing on you. If you arent in some sort of pain at that point you dont have nerve endings. The simple fact is.. The wrestler knows how to do basic defense against a boxer.. The boxer does not know how to do basic defense against the wrestler. That means the wrestler has an edge. If hes smart, exploits it, and the boxer misses the first punch.. its over.. Once on the ground the boxer wont be able to use his fists, which means hes defenseless.

You are completly wrong to assume that a heavyweight champ is somehow less strong then an elite wrestler.

I never took anything away from wrestling, which I think is an awesome sport, which I wish I could one day train in.

MMA is just that MMA. We see MMA fights yet we see how many fights either end on the ground or standup. How wrestler loose to boxers and the other way around. This is just pure fighting with anything allowed, and the outcomes are always different.

A standup fighters gets taken to the ground and looses, or a standup fighters lands a few punches and throws the wrestler competly off his game plan.

Do I even need to mention how many times a wrester has unsuccseful take downs? Were a boxer is open to throw a hook in either direction to end the fight?


I think you are trying to proove that wrestling is this ultimate martial art which beats all others. But countless times you will be proven wrong in leagues like Pride and UFC, were its not the art, but a number of other factors which deterimine the outcome of the fight.

[nthfinity]

as a former wreastler, I'll say the two are very different from each other. Boxing is a sport of hitting and taking hits, which I enjoy much more then watching a wreastling match.

Wreastling is 1000x more civilized then UFC. Hitting somebody while they are down just really turns me off of the sport.

The best wrestler vs. the best boxer.... in an open fight, id think the wrestler would win, in a fight with a set of rules, it's a toss up IMO.

The problem with the UFC guys is it's usually only a few hits they take before they fall to the ground, at which point it's all over.

[SFDMALEX]

Originally Posted by graywolf624 Then your not fighting the right people... Its visible in K1 and UFC even. The people without any grappling experience get their ass kicked. The ones that are the best at strikes go get grappling experience.. Because its a rare day in hell when a fight doesnt go to the ground.

lol man, who do you want me to fight? The champs?

All I said is just becauase I dont have any formal wrestling training doesnt mean that I cant wrestle a little bit on instict or from what little I know about it.


Im just surprised that you think that someone who is trained to hit and not get hit is going to loose by default to someone who is not ever trained to get hit.

[graywolf624]

MMA is just that MMA. We see MMA fights yet we see how many fights either end on the ground or standup. How wrestler loose to boxers and the other way around. This is just pure fighting with anything allowed, and the outcomes are always different.

Very few if any end with purly standing.. not in the real world and not mma.

Do I even need to mention how many times a wrester has unsuccseful take downs? Were a boxer is open to throw a hook in either direction to end the fight?

The wrestler has other options as well.. A throw for example. Another option the boxer has never seen.

You are completly wrong to assume that a heavyweight champ is somehow less strong then an elite wrestler.

Pound for pound they are... Thats a given. A heavyweight champion can move out of range to get a breather. A wrestler doesnt have that option.

think you are trying to proove that wrestling is this ultimate martial art which beats all others. But countless times you will be proven wrong in leagues like Pride and UFC, were its not the art, but a number of other factors which deterimine the outcome of the fight.

Thats not my arguement. My arguement is someone without grappling experience will get their ass kicked. That doesnt mean it needs to be the ultimate martial art.. It just means in the absence of basic knowledge of this field your screwed. This has been showed in both UFC and Pride time and time again.

[graywolf624]

All I said is just becauase I dont have any formal wrestling training doesnt mean that I cant wrestle a little bit on instict or from what little I know about it.

Instinct.. LOL :roll:

No offense but youve just proved my point. Several things that are instinctive in grappling are WRONG. Several of them will get your ass beat bad. It isn't instinctive in the slightest until youve trained for years, any more then any sport. If that wasn't the case you could come from nowhere and be good. Doesn't work like that.. I dont care how heavy you are, if you want to wrestle under wrestling rules and youve never done it, Ill walk all over you.. I can guarentee that without a shadow of a doubt.

Just like if a professional boxer asked me to box Id be screwed...

[SFDMALEX]

Originally Posted by graywolf624 Thats not my arguement. My arguement is someone without grappling experience will get their ass kicked. That doesnt mean it needs to be the ultimate martial art.. It just means in the absence of basic knowledge of this field your screwed. This has been showed in both UFC and Pride time and time again.

Kinda like someone who has never been trained to hit and get hit will get their ass kicked.

[graywolf624]

But a wrestler has been trained to take hits.. Thats the parts you miss.. We take hits every match... Ive personally had concussions, bloody noses, teeth jarred, bruised ribs, broken arm, swollen disc in my back etc... many of my teammates had broken jaws or noses. That shit happens and you are trained to take hits and falls, at least at the upper levels. You have to be prepared for the eventualities to not lose your game plan.. or your screwed.

Im not saying its to the level of the boxer.. But it doesnt have to be.. it just has to be long enough to get the man to the ground.. Thats easier then you think.