motor

Caps8419 · 06-21-2004, 02:27 PM

we had a radio and could listen to the pits during the race.... they should have cleaned up the track i agree, but they didnt jump out to help RS immidiatly because A. cars were coming, and B. because they were speaking with him from the pits.... he said he was ok but his back hurt and he wanted to get out of his car on his own, but they told him to stay there and they'd cut him out... thats y they waited.... but he was never unconscious. over all a fun race.... very interesting!

bobafett · 06-21-2004, 06:14 PM

Inmy mind this was the worst race yet in modern F1 history. This was an absolutel ATROCITY.

First off, the idiotic move by MS in the first lap should have had him DQed.
Secondly, his "move" for retaining P1 is pure BS.

Thirdly, RB's pit stop took WAY too long. No team orders? MY ASS. We'll just hold him there.

Fourthly, the marshalls were a disgrace. Not only did it take them EONS to get to RS, but on top of that they did not red flag the race (making the cars run TEN LAPS through the wreckage), nor did they get a sweeper onto the field (more debris and crap causing possible further accidents). The simple move would have been to run the formation THROUGH the pits. This is a prime example of why no ptting should be allowed during yellow / SC periods.

And then what about that CRAP ruling regarding JPM. They let him run SIXTY laps and then decide that his move is illegal? It is such bullshit I don't know where to begin. JPM made the right move and shouldn't have been penalized, let alone 60 goddamn laps later. The FIA should have DQed MS just as well then for his totally illegal move in L1.

All in all, Indy is a goddamn disgrace to F1. What a crock. This is exactly why they need to move it to a real circuit.

--Dan

Caps8419 · 06-21-2004, 06:45 PM

Originally Posted by bobafett

Fourthly, the marshalls were a disgrace. Not only did it take them EONS to get to RS, but on top of that they did not red flag the race (making the cars run TEN LAPS through the wreckage), nor did they get a sweeper onto the field (more debris and crap causing possible further accidents). The simple move would have been to run the formation THROUGH the pits. This is a prime example of why no ptting should be allowed during yellow / SC periods.

And then what about that CRAP ruling regarding JPM. They let him run SIXTY laps and then decide that his move is illegal? It is such bullshit I don't know where to begin. JPM made the right move and shouldn't have been penalized, let alone 60 goddamn laps later. The FIA should have DQed MS just as well then for his totally illegal move in L1.

they had to wait for shumacher for the reason i listed in the post before yours.... i do agree they should have cleaned it up and then resume racing... as for montoya's situation

imagine if they black flagged him earlier in the race and later we find out their ruling was not correct.. if they pull montoya out and are not absolutly, without a doubt, certain that the FIA rules state he had broken one of them; he would be furious to be pulled out of a race, which he could still get points for, unfairly.... they waited till lap 60 because they need to be certain that what he did was outside the rules, otherwise they would have alot to answer for if at a later date their ruling was proven false... he broke the rule and was fairly penalized.

nthfinity · 06-21-2004, 06:51 PM

All in all, Indy is a goddamn disgrace to F1. What a crock. This is exactly why they need to move it to a real circuit.

ive heard that lake senica was a good track back in the day.

the sweeper did come out, but i agree that they should not have completed 10 laps because of it.

i must say i like the course itself, but the management of the race seems to be lacking. it was still enjoyable.

nthfinity · 06-21-2004, 07:26 PM

i didnt have the best spot for taking pictures, but good enough. i also learned how dificult it is to shoot a car moving so bloody fast

bobafett · 06-21-2004, 07:33 PM

caps: i disagree with your assessment. if the rule was clear, then they should've clearly pulled him out early. If I don't care what's going on, it doesn't take SIXTY laps. Plus, I would be MORE pissed off after having raced my heart out for 3/4s of the race only to get pulled for BS at the end. Furthermore, if they did pull him out wrongly, it woudln't have mattered if it was lap 15 or 65, he still would'v ebeen pissed and contested it. And since when does the FIA give a damn what ANYONE thinks?

Not only that, having an extra car on the field unnecessarily is added liability, etc.

Piss poor marshalling.

Nthfinity: if only laguna seca had better facilities.

--Dan

goose93 · 06-21-2004, 11:00 PM

The facility management is local but the race management is F1. The same people who make the decisions @ imola or any other track during an F! race made the decisions here. The facility is great for F1. The track is difficult for both drivers and engineers. Most of the track can easily be seen by spectators. And Indianpolis speedway has a long history in racing including the world championship which brings an element of heritage to the event.

I do agree that many mistakes were made, but the USGP should stay @ indy for the racers, the fans, and F1's marketing in the US. If F1 can grab the attention of the US fans again, an entirely new era in F1 will be born.

graywolf624 · 06-21-2004, 11:52 PM

The issue with jpm was related to him getting off the track before 15 seconds from launch with the rules clearly state. I think they should have called him earlier then that, but I dont think it should have been lap 2. It definitly had to be reviewed to check timing of when he got off the track. Rules are rules, and this one is definitly a good one. Can you imagine someone running across the field at the start to get another car and the race starts while their crossing?

bobafett · 06-22-2004, 05:54 AM

If rules are rules, then MS' move into turn 1 should have had him DQed or penalized as well, no?

As for Indy: I still disagree. The track layout is considered to be one of the most uninteresting by drivers (one of my F1 mags from last year about the subject), and the "illustrious" history of Indy isn't all that fantastic.

F1 making a hold of the US viewership would be great. I don't think a track will do this, but an American team, or at least an American driver (hello Gordon) will do it in spades. In the meanwhile, Indy needs to be relocated to someplace much more like a european road circuit. Laguna Seca, barring the fact that it just hasn't got the facilities right now, would be absolutely perfect.

Hopefully this will be reason for consideratin given that Indy's contract is up for renewal.

--Dan

yg60m · 06-22-2004, 08:05 AM

Originally Posted by bobafett

If rules are rules, then MS' move into turn 1 should have had him DQed or penalized as well, no?

As for Indy: I still disagree. The track layout is considered to be one of the most uninteresting by drivers (one of my F1 mags from last year about the subject), and the "illustrious" history of Indy isn't all that fantastic.

F1 making a hold of the US viewership would be great. I don't think a track will do this, but an American team, or at least an American driver (hello Gordon) will do it in spades. In the meanwhile, Indy needs to be relocated to someplace much more like a european road circuit. Laguna Seca, barring the fact that it just hasn't got the facilities right now, would be absolutely perfect.

Hopefully this will be reason for consideratin given that Indy's contract is up for renewal.

--Dan

I agree that the F1 at Laguna Seca would be great, they "choose" Indy because it is famous in the american mind for the Indy 500 and it is maybe a nice track but Laguna would be even better

Mers · 06-22-2004, 03:45 PM

I agree that the F1 at Laguna Seca would be great, they "choose" Indy because it is famous in the american mind for the Indy 500 and it is maybe a nice track but Laguna would be even better

Just imagine F! cars in the corkscrew....insane...
but laguna is an extremely "real-carish" track...its not as fast as indy....

The thing with indy is, there are walls...walls are very dangerous...i bet that if ralph hit one of those tyre barriers, or those special walls that are used for nascar (the ones that dismount and brake the car) he would have gotten less hurt...

jon_s · 06-22-2004, 04:50 PM

Originally Posted by mrmojo77

What are your opinions on the matter that Schumi broke the rules, when he overtook Barrichello right after the safety car went to the pit. It's against the rules to overtake someone on the same lap and Schumi passed the start line before Barrichello. They were driving neck-to-neck, but still Schumi was over the line first.

I thought that the computer showed that they were over the line at exactly the same time? NOt only that, but RB was shown to lead that lap, therefore MS did not overtake?

nthfinity · 06-22-2004, 10:22 PM

I thought that the computer showed that they were over the line at exactly the same time? NOt only that, but RB was shown to lead that lap, therefore MS did not overtake?

interesting, very... risky move nonetheless

graywolf624 · 06-22-2004, 10:29 PM

"If rules are rules, then MS' move into turn 1 should have had him DQed or penalized as well, no? "

Well that depends on what you call moves. I only saw 1 real move because the rear car(sato if I recall) was not in passing position but instead far enough back that it seemed more like ms was placing himself back on a line.

Furthermore, the rule jpm violated is a safety rule. My real issue with this weekend still lies with how long they took to get to schumacher.

philios55 · 06-23-2004, 12:17 PM

Originally Posted by Mers

Can anyone tell me if the safety car is an SLK or SLR?? i have a bet with a friend that it's an slk, since i didn't see tose side air intakes..but i have to know for sure...
Also, WTF happened to the Marlboro signs in Ferrari cars?

definetely the new SLK AMG!