(Getting new Camera) Updated! Got a Nikon D50!
 

Well Im fed up with my Canon Ixus 3.2 megapixel, no don't get me wrong its a Brilliant camera, its just I want to go up a level :wink:

I have been reading topics, articles and watched many pics both on JW and on the net.

I am really thinking of buying the Canon Eos 350D, worked a lot these last couple of months and now have some money to spend.

I am a rookie really at this level of photographing, so any tips or advices from our Top Car Spotters such as TT, Dani, Pterps, MartijnGizmo and many more???

Thanks in advance :!:

We all started as rookies, and I still consider myself as a rookie with the EOS 350D, all I can say is that the 350D is fantastic camera, make sure you get some good lenses with it!
For the best tips you'd better listen to TT and Martijn.

Thanks Pterps, I have seen some of the stuff that others did/shot with that camera, really unbelievable :shock: . Its currently for sale in the neighbourhood for 625 Euro (shop is Saturn) and at the local photgraphy shop for 699 Euro. They both come with the normal package I presume, is that just the typical lense, and if so should I get a other lense aswell?

I have the standard 18-55 mm, but I don't use that a lot. I prefer to use my 75-300, wich I bought together with the camera and 18-55 at Dixons as a special offer for around € 900,-
And than there was the insurace, 1 GB card and the Bag wich brought it to € 1100,-.

And there was me thinking I nearly had the money :cry:

imo 350D is the best option :P ... as i've told you before ..

you can learn just about everyhting about digital prefessional photography with taht camera .. .that is ... if you are interested i how cameras work :P

Ok, the Memory card isn't a problem, got that already, the 75-300 lense is the standard one I understand, I see the 18-55 second hand for around 60 Euro's so thats not bad, how much was the insurance Pterps?

The 18-55 is the standard lense!

/\/\ thats what I meant :oops:

how much was the insurance?

I don't know exactly, between 50 and 100 euro's I believe, for 3 years, inlcuding damage.

ok the 75-300 lense is more around 175 Euro :x

thats not bad really

As much as I am a Canon-man, I'd advise to look into the Nikon D50. It performs even better at high ISO's and it's incredibly cheap!

I have been looking into the 350D and D50 as well and right now I can get either the 350D for 602 Euro or the D50 for 430 Euro both with lens kits. Is the 350D that much more superior with a Canon IS lens or with the D50 do the same thing equiped with a high quality Nikon lens?

(Rookie photographer wanting to learn more about taking proper pics and techniques and wanting to learn from my results instantly.)

/\/\ exactly me (except for the Boxster offcourse) 8)

Thanks MartijnGizmo, Ill have a look at the Nikon tomorrow :!:

Thanks Phobo too, if that is the case then I really should buy it at Saturn, they have only opened a job just this week and are already pricefighting the rest :shock:

Does anyone on this forum use the D50, or has experience with it?

Don't get an insurance at a electronics store, they are way overpriced. I pay €7 a month for a €5000 coverage in a "valuable goods outdoors insurance" (crappy translation) from Centraal Beheer.

Ok I see, thanks MartijnGizmo!! That Nikon really is cheaper :shock:

What are the main differences between 350D and D50 other then 8.0 and 6.0 Megapixels, I mean could you spot a real difference? :?

Sameerrao has a D50

/\/\ thanks RC!

On DPreview.com you can put them side-by-side.

Don't get too much into the 6MP vs 8MP, it's just 3456 x 2304 vs 3008 x 2000 pixels. Also the D50 uses SD-cards. Advantages of the D50 are: larger size, larger screen, less noise. If you get a body-only and buy a used 18-70 (D70-kitlens) you've got a great starterset.

So the concensus is that a D50 with a choice lense is worth the savings over a D70 with a so-so lense for the asmae price?

Or is the step fom the D50 to the D70 very much worth the extra money spent in the long term?

For me it was, picked up a D50 w/ an used 18-70mm for just a shade over $600 US. Also keep in mind that Photokina will be coming in about 2 months. So if you could wait, wait it out. The D70s will definitely get replaced and probably will see an updated D50.

The 18-70mm kit lens from the D70s/D200 is an awesome lense. The 18-55 on the D50 is also very good by most accounts.

Although the D50 is targeted at a beginner segment verse the D70/D70s targeted at the amateur segment. You will see more "pro" features on the D70s. Also keep in mind that as far as direct competitors, I see the D70s more inline with the 350D than the D50. The D50 was slotted in as an entry level segment right below.

There are numerous sites that listed the features missing.

Here's one w/ side by side comparison w/ the Rebel XT 350D.

http://www.digitalreview.ca/cams/Nik...T_images.shtml

The two main advantages I see in getting a D70S over a D50 are:
a) Slightly faster burst rates (The D50 has a 2.5 frame per sec continuous shooting rate while the D70 has a 3 fps shooting rate). This would really make itself useful if you are at a race track and shooting the carnage into the first corner as in the US GP. But really this difference is minor for 99% of us
b) Slightly bigger body - The D70 is more comfortable to hold as it is a bit larger. To me the Rebel XT was too small to hold comfortably. This makes a huge difference when you have a high end lens (read heavy - 3 lb+) attached. The bigger the lens the bigger the body. The D200 or EOS 20D are perhaps the right size for the F2.8 lenses.

Ideally if you can buy a used D70S at close to a new D50 price then this is the best bet. Alternatively buy a new D50. You will be happy for sure.

Net net, I think the decision is more in line with the lenses that you buy - if you are getting into professional grade lenses then a D70 is better. Else the D50 will be more than sufficient.

Spend your money on lenses. The body is less important.

Yep - pretty much what I was thinking.

I like reading this guys honest answers http://www.kenrockwell.com/ makes a lot of sense, and even has some counterpoints that may help quash heresay and rumour.. ;)

The only real advantage that the D70(s) has over the D50 is the second wheel to adjust aperture/shutterspeed. But money spend on lenses is always better!

I'd get a D50 with good lenses, or save up for a D200. No need to get the D70s.

Lesson #1: never believe Ken Rockwell, he's totally biased and considered a clown by a lot of people.

Lesson #2: The fact that he pisses off so many wannabes and poseurs is why what he has to say is so great :)

The fact that an open view such as Ken's makes people think he is a clown, is hwy he is so great. :)

Far from being biased - he is stating folks should not be biased.

BUt then again if you are a Measurbator of course you need to join the ranks of the Ken Haters ;)

LOL ok, reading all the comments now and thanks for that guys, really appreciate it. But here is the one question, I want to shoot nice pics (obvious) and panning shots! Is it the camera that makes the difference or the lense, because if its the lense Im better off buying the cheaper Nikon.

Second question: what would put me off to buy the Canon 350D (Nikon) or yet stimulate me to get that Canon :twisted:

Great lenses will certainly help you take better pictures but technique matters a heck of lot more.

I have the D50 with great lenses Nikon 70-200 VR and 18-70DX. Now it is up to me to make sure I take good pictures. I can't make excuses about my equipment any more:)

I do, and several other guys on JW have one (dutchmasterflex, sameerrao, ae86_16v, probably others I'm not thinking of...). Its a great camera, and if you want an SLR, but don't want to spend a huge amount of cash, its a good buy. I personally have never used a D70/D70s, but if you are concerned about picture quality, I'm 90% they use the same image sensor (with maybe a few differences?) so there really isn't much difference, except that from the D70s's nicer lens. I've also looked at pics side-by-side of D70s vs D50 (with same lens), and I can't tell any difference (but I'm no expert). Its mainly that the D70s has more features, and comes standard with a very nice lens...but the D50 still comes with lots of good features. :P

The Canon 350D is obviously a great, great camera too, but for me, 6.0 MP is plenty. When you are shopping for a camera you think its a huge difference...and you want that "8.0MP", but when it comes down to actually shooting pics, its not such a big deal...I'm sure others would agree. Don't get me wrong, its certainly nice, but if you are just starting out, its not super neccessary.

I'm obviously going to recommend my camera ;), but I really do think its a great SLR to start with. Another nice thing of the D50, is it has a nice 'feel' to it, and it just felt better in my hands than the Canon. That is a very personal preference though, and you should spend time in the store holding and 'shooting' whatever cameras you plan to buy.

Good luck deciding, you can't go wrong with Canon or Nikon, and hopefully we'll be seeing some SLR pics from you soon! 8)

But it is to the point of blindingly bias. I am a huge Nikon fan and hope they will continue making great products, but I will not be on Nikon's nuts if they make a bad lens or camera.

To him, everything Nikon makes is god send.

Yup, I agree. IMHO the larger body of the D50 makes a bigger difference than the 2MP makes.

ok guys, :!: Thanks again for all your great and many text containing replies WOW!!! :!:

Ive read many reviews on the net and offcourse everyone thinks the world of his own camera and the camara is personal to everyone offcourse!

But reading the many reviews and all of your comments I am thinking about taking the Nikon D50.

Now its just a question of finding the right lenses for it (for what I want to do with it) and find a nice deal!

Could any of you maybe help me with that also, please :mrgreen: ??

See if you could get a Body only, then find the 18-70mm f/3.5-4.5. That lens should be around $200 US or so.

You could also add the 70-300mm G f/4-5.6 lens for around $100 - $150 US and that will give you the reach for cheap. At that price you can't really go wrong.

If you want an all in one answer, get the 18-200mm VR II f/3.5-5.6 for around $700.

I am going to a prof shop this tuesday, are there also good online shops where I could have a look at all those /\/\ lenses etc in the meanwhile. :wink:

Even though I don't really like Ken Rockwell, he does have a comprehensive list:

http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/1870.htm
http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/70300g.htm
http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/18200.htm

Ill have a look at that, thanks :wink:

Ok I read it and wondered what lenses you guys use to shoot cars, I mean most preferrable?

How good is the lens that comes with the kit, I heared that the one that comes with the Canon kit is crap in comparision with the one that comes with the Nikon.

I will use the 18-70DX for the interior and close-up shots and the 70-200 VR for action/motion shots and also exterior photoshoots.

What do you buy?
If your budget is tight - The 18-70 is perhaps the best starter lens. Buy it and then perhaps add another lens later if it is needed.

If you have more cash rolling in the ol piggy bank, go for the 18-200 VR for more versatility with the mega zoom range and stability with the VR.

Is it worth going for the kitlens, the 18-55? I want to photograph just cars and if possible make panning shots. Or is it better to buy just the body and the 18-70 lens seperate?

My budget is a bit tight yes, don't want to spend more then 1000 Euro's if possible !

See - this is the type of nonsense I read all over the Interweb.

The Guy uses Nikon and prefers it - that makes him blindly biased?

No - OTHER people just don't like the fact he calls people with more money than talent uselss hacks.

That is why people don't like him - because he says a guy on abudget with a crappy camera and talent is BETTER than some rich arsehole with $50,000 of cameras for a hobby.

The guy is simply saying "talent and ability forst, equipment second".

This thread is a PERFECT example of what he is tlking about.

Here is a guy on a tight budget who wants to talke decent pictures, and he is MORE worried about "the equipment" than practice, talent and ability.

FFS man, just buy a camera that fis your budget and and leaves some money spare, then get out there and take lots of pictures - experiment and practice.

I have taken pictures with a D70 and a $800 lense that suck and pictures with my Kodak point and shoot that are awesome.

You [TopgeraNL] may as well buy a decent condition used body from a local camera store and then get a decent lense for your money spent.

It's after all still going to come down to the light, subject matter, ability to interpret the controls on the camera, a stead hand (or tripod) and a good eye to take a great picture.

This argument is the same as the "ferrai vs Mazda Miata" one.

There are Ferrari owners who think everything else is shit, yet they couldn't lap a race track in their F-Car to save their lives, and then their are folsk in a Mazda Miata who would lap a guy in a 360CS.. ;)

Every now and again, however, you get a Ferrari owner who enjoys learning the lines in a Mazda Miata - and understands what it takes to be good... Ken Rockwell is such a man in photography terms.

;)

Don't hate him because he makes sense.. :P

Foto Konijnenberg, http://www.koopdigitaal.nl

A lot of your questions are answered already on the Dutch GoT (Gathering Of Tweakers). http://gathering.tweakers.net/forum/list_topics/71

Thanks RC, I respect your opninion!

And thanks also to Martijn, I already looked at the forums etc but am just trying to get some facts straight. Main question is is it better (for cars and panning shots) to buy the kitlens or am I better of buying the body and the 18-70 lens seperate? Im sorry to ask again its just that on the forums nothing is said about photographing cars :(

Thanks :!:

Well, you can do carshots with any lens, but the 18-70 is just a better lens than the 18-55.

Ok thanks for that, that will make a major difference in my buy :wink:

Which I agree w/ him more than anything else that the person behind the lens is more important than the equipment. I like you have seen pictures that blow me away from Camera phones. Where as I have also seen some with Canon 30Ds that doesn't stir any emotions at all.

For example I will para-phrase him: "The 18-200VR is the best lens in the world except for the Distortion." That is like saying "Otherwise than that Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"

How could distortion not matter? I don't care if it is a 18-500mm if the lens sucks it sucks.

Like I said, I read his reviews and everything that Nikon makes is the best! Which is simply not true.

If you looked at my first reponses, I told TopGear that it doesn't matter which camera he picks because both are excellent offerings. In the US the Rebel XT 350D w/ rebates has dropped down to slightly over $500. Bang for the buck, the XT is a better deal than the $599 D50 w/ Kit Lens.

Like I recommended earlier, he should just get the D50 w/ 18-70mm and a 70-300G lens.

Although don't knock the 18-55mm. It is still a very good kit lens, it is just a tad slow.

Also, I would like to point out, Ken Rockwell recommends the 18-55mm over the 18-70mm.

Here's a few more sites:

http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/index.asp
http://www.bythom.com/
http://www.dpreview.com/

/\/\ The Canon is more expensive over here in any way then the Nikon.

I have already chosen the camera I am going to buy following all of your comments and reading various reviews. Thanks for all the links which led to most of them :!:

I am going to take the Nikon D50. I already knew that even before I saw this on the net, that the D50 is currently on offer in a local camera store for 469 Euro's including lens!!

See \/\/ !
http://www.fotoklein.nl/pdf/krantweek27.pdf

Everywhere else on the net it isn't cheaper then 500 Euro's for just the body without lens!

So you understand that Ill be hauling my ass tomorrow since the offer isn't for ever, Ill probably will buy it and then save up for a lens that is better (thanks wae86_16v and MartijnGizmo!)

RC, I am a beginner at this I know, and I agree that it depends more on the person then the equipment for the outcome of the pic. But I have a bit of experience with many normal digital camera's and phones.

Update very soon, with a purchase I hope :twisted:

Good decision. I know for a fact that you'll enjoy using the D50.

Don't worry about the 18-55mm holding you back. It still takes excellent pictures. The only thing that sucks about the 18-55mm is the obvious, it doesn't have enough reach.

Like I recommended earlier, the 70-300G is a really cheap lens, but it is a good bang for the buck. Here in the US it is usually only around $150 or so. It is a slow lens too, but if you are at the track during the day, it should've be too much of a problem.

So 18-55mm lens isn't bad for panning shots either, but the 70-300 would be a better lens for the job?

Which brand would you recommend, Nikkor, Tokina etc etc ?