motor

79TA · 09-09-2008, 05:15 PM

http://www.autoblog.com/2008/09/09/c...-gt2-programs/

In the last two years, the ALMS GT1 Corvettes have rarely had anyone in their own class to compete with. Because of the lack of success and cowardice of Ferarri, Porsche, Viper, and Saleen teams in GT1, Corvette has decided to move down to GT2 after one more shot at the GT1 title at the 24 Hours of LeMans.

Spiffu · 09-09-2008, 05:22 PM

I don't know why they haven't done this earlier, I'd be embarrassed to be only racing my own team mate in a classed based series.

Hell, I'll look forward to them mixing up the Ferrari vs Porsche war always going on in GT2.

79TA · 09-09-2008, 05:35 PM

'05 wasn't that long ago. Back then they had decent competition. Then they lost the Viper teams. Then it seemed only the Acemco Saleen was around. Then the DBR9's had a go and enjoyed some success but despite much handicapping in their favor still couldn't take a manufacturer's title.

I should also note that they had plenty of competition at the real event, the 24 Hours of LeMans, each year. Aston nabbed the last two GT1 victories since they had their reliability issues sorted out. If I were running any GT team, I wouldn't be all that satisfied with the 2nd class GT win.

One would think the likes of Ferrari and Porsche could perhaps pose a challenge to the Corvette, especially given the way the owners talk about their production cars. Porsche enjoyed their dominance of GT2 so I can see the reason for their inaction but why Ferrari decided to shoot low is beyond me.

Here's a more thorough story from the ALMS site.

http://www.americanlemans.com/News/Article.aspx?ID=4783

79TA · 09-09-2008, 05:39 PM

I need to figure out a way to make my Trans Am legal to race in the ALMS GT1 class. Not only will I be guaranteed a podium, but eventually a win!

I think the new Camaro would make an awesome yet slightly humorous entry for the GT2 class. It'd send a nice message to the Porsche, Ferrari, and Panoz competition.

HeilSvenska · 09-09-2008, 05:49 PM

There's still plenty of competition in the FIA GT1 series. Unfortunately, differences in FIA/ACO restrictions mean that FIA GT1 winner Maserati MC12's not able to fight the Corvettes and Astons in both ALMS and at Le Mans.

79TA · 09-09-2008, 05:56 PM

It seems the midengined cars are always hindered and over handicapped. The Saleen S7's only really had a shot the first year, but then had all sorts of bugs to work out. The fact that the engine made the power it did while breathing through two holes the size of a quarter is pretty incredible. I'd love to have an unlimited S7R. Even more tragic, is that there were only 15 S7R's ever built!

There were some races where the Acemco S7 had a shot against the C6R's, but the 'vettes pretty much beat it in the turns.

nthfinity · 09-09-2008, 07:23 PM

its my understanding that the GT1 program is reduced to GT2 because dev. costs are less than 1/4th, while the "outright" speed is not that different... and, w/out competition, it really is pretty pointless anyway.

79TA · 09-10-2008, 12:44 AM

There's competition everywhere else in the world, just not in the ALMS. Anyway, there's talk of combining the GT classes into one big class anyway so in the long run it might not make a huge difference.

Spiffu · 09-10-2008, 01:02 AM

Audi is putting P2 cars in next year, and Acura is putting in P1's in as well.

Though none are removing any from respective classes.

WMUCarGuy · 09-10-2008, 03:40 AM

Originally Posted by Spiffu

Audi is putting P2 cars in next year, and Acura is putting in P1's in as well.

Though none are removing any from respective classes.

State your sources on an Audi P2. I see almost NO chance of that happening. Audi is all about winning at Le Mans, the ALMS and LMS are afterthoughts. Winning LMP2 at Le Mans, well doesn't really mean anything, and with the way the regulations are headed (and the way they're currently supposed to be now, LMP1 is for manufacturers, and LMP2 is for privateers, so an Audi LMP2 doesn't really make much sense.

Audi WILL have an all new car next year, and there are rumors that Audi (at least in a full factory sense) may significantly dial back its ALMS/LMS involvment in 2009. I'd expect the car to be a coupe seeing as the aero advantages are quite large, and I'd expect it to be a diesel (althogh I've heard rumblings of going back to the FSI V8 from the R8).

WMUCarGuy · 09-10-2008, 03:47 AM

And I wouldn't call it "cowardly competition" at all. GT1 just doesn't work in this day and age. You can run a top flite LMP2 program for about the same as a GT1 program, and most teams don't have that kind of capital/would have a hard time convincing sponsors to shell out HUGE cash to be in the GT classes.

Expect to see just 1 GT class from 2010 in ACO competition.

WMUCarGuy · 09-10-2008, 03:48 AM

Originally Posted by 79TA

There's competition everywhere else in the world, just not in the ALMS. Anyway, there's talk of combining the GT classes into one big class anyway so in the long run it might not make a huge difference.

ALMS and LMS both have pathetic GT1 entry lists.

79TA · 09-10-2008, 05:55 AM

GT1 has gone downhill everywhere in the last 5 years. ALMS is the worst example with NO competition for the Corvettes in almost every race. LMS isn't on the same level when it comes to lacking competition. If I could get my own car somehow qualified in GT1, I could take a podium.

It's not like GT2 has always been so diverse either. Until Ferrari's arrival, it was just a Porsche vs. Panoz show as far as ALMS was concerned. The addition of Ferarri and upstart privateer teams (Drayson's Aston, Primetime's Viper, and the Richardson Ford GT etc) has made the class suddenly much more interesting.

It wasn't so long ago that Corvettes, Vipers, S7's, and 550's were all competing in the same race.

I'd like to see the pendulum swing back the other way so GT1 was competitive again, but I think it's more likely that there will just be one big GT class in the future. At least that will prevent more capable teams from settling down to become the big fish in the small GT2 pond.

And yes, I maintain that a manufacturer that is as highly regarded as Ferrari shooting low for second tier racing is cowardly. It's not as if they have no competition in GT2, but the likes of Flying Lizard and Farnbacher Loles aren't as imposing as the Pratt & Miller factory 'vettes. I suppose it's because this is one of those series where other cars aren't handicapped for not being red. As much as I enjoy watching Melo and Risi Competizione prevail over the Porsches, that team should be capable of running in GT1. For goodness sake, they had to downsize the F430's engine to 4 litres in order to qualify down to GT2 standards.

Woohoo · 09-10-2008, 06:21 PM

"Cowardly competition"? Are you serious?

Porsche has 16 overall wins at Le Mans. Ferrari is the most sucessful team in F1 history.

GM has a few class wins at Le Mans.

I don't know...

graywolf624 · 09-10-2008, 10:20 PM

GM has a few class wins at Le Mans.

Bit more then a few there man.. Try 5. Not to mention 7 consecutive alms championships. I don't know about cowardly but from a worldwide perspective corvette has been gt1 for almost a decade.

Corvette racing has won 71 percent of all events theyve run in since their founding in 1999. Thats 71 races.