Bugatti Standing Start Video

[gangajas]

Originally Posted by TeflonTron RC: honestly, the tuner market is insignificant to the Veyron customer. No-one buying a Veyron is going to be out cruising looking for Mustangs and Supras to slay. Ultimate speed is not what makes a car great, as a great car has so much more. A 1000bhp Mustang, et al, is a one trick pony: the Veyron, Mclaren F1 etc, are in a completely other realm, and that is why they cost $1 million.

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[RC45]

Originally Posted by TeflonTron RC: honestly, the tuner market is insignificant to the Veyron customer. No-one buying a Veyron is going to be out cruising looking for Mustangs and Supras to slay. Ultimate speed is not what makes a car great, as a great car has so much more. A 1000bhp Mustang, et al, is a one trick pony: the Veyron, Mclaren F1 etc, are in a completely other realm, and that is why they cost $1 million.

What has this got to do with the question whether or not the Vagrant can actually turn a corner or not?

Doesn't change the fact that no magazine or other tester has told everyone how the Vagrant does around a road course.

[ZfrkS62]

i absolutely despise the Veyron, but holy shit, that was a quick take off.

Just goes to show that no matter what format the 1,000 HP is in, wether it be NA V8 or quadturbo W16, as long as the tires hold the tarmac, the car will launch.

I would much rather sink 10K into a 67 Camaro and launch on 2 wheels though

Bugatti, to me, seems like they are one of the most under-the-radar manufactuers out there. Especially for the price. Their cars have never really grabbed my attention or interest. I could probably point out an EB110 just because it's one of the few supercars i DON'T recognize just for the fact that i never paid attention to it.

I don't know if the Veyron is going to do what they are hoping it will, whatever the intent is, but i doubt it. I don't think that a 1000 HP over-turboed engine is going to be enough to make it worth the production delays and near project cancellations that this thing went through to see the streets. When all is said and done, the Veyron will be nothing but a flash in the pan.

[TeflonTron]

No, when all is said and done, the Veyron will be bought by very rich people who will then drive them a little and garage them a lot, the same as any other very, very expensive car. No-one drives a 250 California Spyder as a daily driver, and no-one will do so with the Veyron. Everyone should forget about the numbers here and look at the bigger picture, that Bugatti have come full circle. They started off, almost 100 years ago as the most sought after cars in the world, and now, after a HUGE period of nothingness they have made the fastest, most expensive car in the world, and that is why people will buy them: history.

[JoeHahn]

Originally Posted by RC45 The point is that while the Enzo may not have a Nurburgring time, it has many magazine and other tester times and PROOF of great handling prowess. And saying "it hides the weight well" is how you say "this car is a bucket of shit when it comes to handling" but you have been told by your editor not to write the truth I am gettign the feeling the Vagrant fanboys are really easily offended.

I'm only sticking up for what I think is right, not sticking up for a car blind. Now your take is that the magazines are praising the car instead of putting it down, like you said before and because they are praising it it must handle like crap. I dont understand. So they say it handles shit and you believe it, they say it handles brilliantly and you think its a coverup thats really saying "its terrible"

[RC45]

Originally Posted by TeflonTron and now, after a HUGE period of nothingness they have made the fastest, most expensive car in the world, and that is why people will buy them: history.

Incorrect - VW made this car, they just bought the rights to use the Bugnasty name - HUGE difference.

Besides no-one would buy a million dollar VW - this was proven when nobody bought the $90,000 VW Phaeton.
In other words - its simply an image thing.

[TeflonTron]

^No, Bugatti makes the Veyron, not VW. Volkswagon simply own Bugatti, nothing more than that. Heck, Warren Buffett owns Dairy Queen, but no-one would say that Berkshire Hathaway are in the Icecream Business, would they?

Lastly, calling the car the "Bugnasty Vagrant" does nothing more than suggest you don't have facts to support your arguement so must rely on childish name-calling. Let's have a sensible discussing here and leave everything else at the door, okay?

[RC45]

Originally Posted by TeflonTron ^No, Bugatti makes the Veyron, not VW. Volkswagon simply own Bugatti, nothing more than that. Heck, Warren Buffett owns Dairy Queen, but no-one would say that Berkshire Hathaway are in the Icecream Business, would they? Lastly, calling the car the "Bugnasty Vagrant" does nothing more than suggest you don't have facts to support your arguement so must rely on childish name-calling. Let's have a sensible discussing here and leave everything else at the door, okay?

OK - lets tackle the issue.

Is the engine VW in origin or Bugatti?

Is the car completely engineered by Bugatti technology, money and resources or VW sourced assets?

And calling the it the Bugnasty Vagrant is no different to any other name calling that goes on un-challanged around these parts.

[TeflonTron]

Originally Posted by RC45 Originally Posted by TeflonTron ^No, Bugatti makes the Veyron, not VW. Volkswagon simply own Bugatti, nothing more than that. Heck, Warren Buffett owns Dairy Queen, but no-one would say that Berkshire Hathaway are in the Icecream Business, would they? Lastly, calling the car the "Bugnasty Vagrant" does nothing more than suggest you don't have facts to support your arguement so must rely on childish name-calling. Let's have a sensible discussing here and leave everything else at the door, okay? OK - lets tackle the issue. Is the engine VW in origin or Bugatti? Is the car completely engineered by Bugatti technology, money and resources or VW sourced assets? And calling the it the Bugnasty Vagrant is no different to any other name calling that goes on un-challanged around these parts.

It matters not a jot. The Bugatti Veyron is the Bugatti Veyron, not the Volkswagon Veyron. As for your name-calling, it's sad and two-faced.

[RC45]

Originally Posted by TeflonTron Originally Posted by RC45 Originally Posted by TeflonTron ^No, Bugatti makes the Veyron, not VW. Volkswagon simply own Bugatti, nothing more than that. Heck, Warren Buffett owns Dairy Queen, but no-one would say that Berkshire Hathaway are in the Icecream Business, would they? Lastly, calling the car the "Bugnasty Vagrant" does nothing more than suggest you don't have facts to support your arguement so must rely on childish name-calling. Let's have a sensible discussing here and leave everything else at the door, okay? OK - lets tackle the issue. Is the engine VW in origin or Bugatti? Is the car completely engineered by Bugatti technology, money and resources or VW sourced assets? And calling the it the Bugnasty Vagrant is no different to any other name calling that goes on un-challanged around these parts. It matters not a jot. The Bugatti Veyron is the Bugatti Veyron, not the Volkswagon Veyron. As for your name-calling, it's sad and two-faced.

Yeah - only 2-faced because you fail to admit that Bugatti as a company was off the map, wiped out and bankrupt by 1995/96.

which means the "new" resurrected Bugatti is simply a VW subsidiary, much like SEAT - the happen to be called Bugatti and are cashing in on the gullibilty of the easily impressed.

VW didnt buy a flourishing compnay selling hundreds of thousands of cars, as Mercedes did when they bought Chrylser, parent of Dodge - which is why the Dodge Viper is the Dodge Viper, not the Mecedes Viper...

However, no matter ho wyou slice it, any modern era Bugatti is actually a VW product

Doesn't change that it's a fast straight line product. but be honest - if it was called the VW Uber-Coupe people would make fun of it's single use and high price... but simply because they chose to build this under the Bugatti name people worship it like its a god or something - and they quite clearly could have chosen to build it under any name they wanted to - it's their money afterall.

Anyway - if all y'all have to be impressed and enarmoured by this overwieght overpriced VW so be it..

[TeflonTron]

I said that Bugatti was dead as a company: can you not read, or are you so hellbent in trying to convince people of your point of view? VW bought it, pumped hugae amounts of money into it and the Veyron is the result. I don't worship the Veyron at all. In fact, I don't particularly even like it. However, I know two people who have driven one and who both say the same thing: it destroys any car that they have driven and handles very well. Have you driven one? Do you know someone who has? Or, as I'm guessing, are you just a 60 year old man who has nothing better to do than blast something that is completely out of his league and he'll never have a hope in hell of owning, should he want to or not?

Let's leave it at this, as it seems it's the only level you'll understand: the Veyron would hammer a Z06 at the Nurburgring, at a roll-on, at a 1/4 mile, as a collector's piece, as a rarity, as an investment, as an achievement, as a piece of history, and as a watermark in car design.

[TNT]

^^^ i do wonder why no hard numbers have been published yet on the bugatti.

[TeflonTron]

Because Bugatti don't need to, in the same way that Rolls Royce don't publish detailed numbers. The client knows what they are buying and isn't THAT bothered with all of the little bits of fluff such as what the car will do from 60-120 in 4th etc.

[RC45]

Originally Posted by TeflonTron Because Bugatti don't need to, in the same way that Rolls Royce don't publish detailed numbers. The client knows what they are buying and isn't THAT bothered with all of the little bits of fluff such as what the car will do from 60-120 in 4th etc.

If this is true, then why all the fanfare about the top speed? The one performance spec almost NO owner will experience... hhhmm...

Originally Posted by TeflonTron I said that Bugatti was dead as a company: can you not read, or are you so hellbent in trying to convince people of your point of view? VW bought it, pumped hugae amounts of money into it and the Veyron is the result.

I am not hell bent on anything, but you sure seem to be angriliy trying to force me to agree with your view point - hhhmmm - I guess the same rules don;t apply to you then

In other words, had the chairman of VW decided to build the "Veyron" as an Audi he could have - the Bugatti company is a wholely owned and created and funded subsidiary - that just happens to be called Bugatti.

Period.

This makes the Bugatti Veyron as related to the Bugattis of old - as say, the BMW Mini.

Originally Posted by TeflonTron I don't worship the Veyron at all. In fact, I don't particularly even like it. However, I know two people who have driven one and who both say the same thing: it destroys any car that they have driven and handles very well.

Call me a skeptic but I call BS to this - because I am guessing unless I missed the posts you made about it, this is the type of thing an enthusiastic JW member (as you appear to be) would want to share with JW early on. As we say here Pics of STFU

Originally Posted by TeflonTron Have you driven one? Do you know someone who has?

No - If I did I doubt they would tell me it handled well - as the folks I know actually know a thing or 2 about handling, and may say "it handles surprisingly well for a great big heavy 4WD car" - a little different to "handles well" - after all, if all you needed to handle well was 4000lbs, 1000hp and 4WD, then ALL racing cars would follow this formula wouldn't they.

Originally Posted by TeflonTron Or, as I'm guessing, are you just a 60 year old man who has nothing better to do than blast something that is completely out of his league and he'll never have a hope in hell of owning, should he want to or not?

Ah - and finally we get down to brass tacks - you seem so shallow as to have to measure yourself and everyone by their material holdings - and as such you can only worship and pander to all the super rich and their playthings.

Considering they only plan to build what 300 cars - and there is not exactly a waiting list, it would seem most of the worlds wealthy who could afford one don't want one either - so that sort of negates that rather juvenile point - doesn't it.

Originally Posted by TeflonTron Let's leave it at this, as it seems it's the only level you'll understand: the Veyron would hammer a Z06 at the Nurburgring,

Well - lets leave car names out of it - as you are obviously rather frustrated and trying to be aright prick about it all - so you honestly believe that the Veyron will lap the Nurburgring faster that 7m42s?

If you say so.... whats next - simply because it costs a million quid it must be able to pull a 7m05s lap - ok - new rumour - Bugatti Veyron laps Nurburgring in 7m05s - sends Porsche reeling - all these years they tried to lighten their car, when it seems all they needed is more weight and more power. :roll:

Originally Posted by TeflonTron at a roll-on, at a 1/4 mile, as a collector's piece, as a rarity, as an investment, as an achievement, as a piece of history, and as a watermark in car design.

It's not the rarest car in history, not the best automotive investment, not really historic, and not that much of a watermark in design - that type of distinction is limited to the Model T, the Beetle, the Mini and such like.

Oh - and again, the car really has no more roll-on, acceleration nd topend than any other 1000hp car... so maybe an achievement in your eyes, but will be rather forgotten foot note in history within 5 years.

All in al, a rather fast single use auto - obviously impressing the pants of you.. other wise you wouldn't have taken the time to be so verbose and insulting in your dissertation.

[tforth]

Let's be clear on one thing: the current Bugatti was created by VW group. The only common ground with it's predecessor is the name. This is also true, albeit to a lesser extent, with Lamborgini.

Ironically, the engine from one of Piech's biggest achievements (he claimed that the Phaeton was his greatest) is the VR6, which he wanted to axe when he first came over from audi, to head VW group. While at audi, he oversaw development of their 60° 2.8L V6. This was one of the few examples were his politics blinded him (at least initially), in that even with variable intake geometry, and a way larger footprint, the audi V6 didn't produce any more power than the VW developed 2.8L VR6.

Lastly, regarding the Veyron, it sounds like most of you really have no clue the engineering challenge inherent in developing a car with the performance of the Veyron; that also meets typical international OE durability requirements. This cannot be said for the likes of TVR, Koenigsegg, Pagani, and the enzo for that matter. Admittedly, VW screwed it up, on the first go-around, but at least they didn't make the bigger mistake by giving into the pressure and releasing something that didn't work - thanks Thomas!