Cool veyron video

[tforth]

To see the Vette edging so much on a GT3 RS' lap time is simply staggering... espeicially condidering that the GT3 RS has a roll cage, is completely gutted, and has DOT Legal racing slicks on; of of which, the Z06 doesn't have.

If you're referring to the 996 GT3 RS, don't forget about the extra 120 hp the Z06 has on it's side. BTW, are you implying that the roll cage provides the driver with extra confidence, or that the slight improvement in torsional rigidity makes all the difference?

A better reference for NS times will be when the 997 GT2 debuts. It should have similar power and more weight than the Z06. However, I would guess that it's lap time will approach the CGT's, getting very close to a 7:30. This would put it over 10s/lap faster than the Z06's rather questionable time with Jan Mag (i.e. what is Dan Hill's time for the Z06??).

The 997 GT2 should be able to wipe it in a straight line as well. I know, it will cost a lot more...

[RC45]

Originally Posted by tforth To see the Vette edging so much on a GT3 RS' lap time is simply staggering... espeicially condidering that the GT3 RS has a roll cage, is completely gutted, and has DOT Legal racing slicks on; of of which, the Z06 doesn't have. If you're referring to the 996 GT3 RS, don't forget about the extra 120 hp the Z06 has on it's side. BTW, are you implying that the roll cage provides the driver with extra confidence, or that the slight improvement in torsional rigidity makes all the difference?

Actually he would be reffering to the fact that the GT3 RS is gutted, has almost race-tyres.

Originally Posted by tforth A better reference for NS times will be when the 997 GT2 debuts. It should have similar power and more weight than the Z06. However, I would guess that it's lap time will approach the CGT's, getting very close to a 7:30.

So now 2 years of extra development and almost certainlt barely-street legal tyres as Porsche normally provide count for nought I suppose?

Originally Posted by tforth This would put it over 10s/lap faster than the Z06's rather questionable time with Jan Mag

WHy is the time quesitonable? It was witnessed and photgraphed..

Originally Posted by tforth (i.e. what is Dan Hill's time for the Z06??).

It's Dave Hill, and why would he be driving the car? He is not a top level driver... and contrary to Intardweb rumours the C5 Z06 time of 7m46s was set by John Heinricy not Dave Hill.

Originally Posted by tforth The 997 GT2 should be able to wipe it in a straight line as well. I know, it will cost a lot more...

And again, 2 years of extra development don't count?

[tforth]

No, obviously, as I've mentioned before, track tires do count, on any track. That being said, I don't think they'll make up for 10+s I have estimated will separate the 997 GT2 from the Z06 on the NS.

The simple point that I'm trying to get across here, is that sport 911s (GT3/RS/GT2, etc.), even with their inherently poor polar moment of inertia layout handicap (i.e. rear engine), generally have better NS laptimes than the 'vaunted' Z06, when considering power/weight ratios. And, don't fool yourself, GM has been spending lots of time on the NS developing their products recently.

Furthermore, the GT3 has no less relevant creature comforts (997 version) than the Z06. Remember, even in its 'stripped out' format, it still has as many seats the corvette. The 997 GT3 even has sat-nav!

[RC45]

Originally Posted by tforth No, obviously, as I've mentioned before, track tires do count, on any track. That being said, I don't think they'll make up for 10+s I have estimated will separate the 997 GT2 from the Z06 on the NS.

On a 4 mile track tires can equal 10s.. on a 13mile track tyres not only equal 10s, they can surpace it.

This is "perfromance car 101" and shouldn't even need to be debated.

Originally Posted by tforth The simple point that I'm trying to get across here, is that sport 911s (GT3/RS/GT2, etc.), even with their inherently poor polar moment of inertia layout handicap (i.e. rear engine), generally have better NS laptimes than the 'vaunted' Z06, when considering power/weight ratios.

Ok - instead of just trying your level best to bash the 'vaunted' Z06 - as you put it - why not try base you opinions on facts.

The Corvette does not have the decades of Northloop testing the 911 has... and why is it that you refuse to accept the 996 GT3 and the C5 Z06 have similar lap times?

Older RS variants are very much "limited street intended use" cars.. in fact this is even true for the 997 RS variants.

There is no "stripped" Corvette - you keep making this apples to oranges comparison - The 911T of each generation is the Zo6 equivelent - it is the fully street option variant of the hi-po 911.

The GT2 is quite obviously as reflected by the price, the 911 will all the trimmings and noexpenses spared.


You also clearly want to compare across generation gaps.

The point that you seem so determined to ignore it that for each generation of the Corvette going back to 1955, it has been able to natch the performance of sports cars of the same class each time - this seems to be something people refuse to accept.

And when you take the 2001~2004 and 2006~ model years the Z06 of the the day has matched toe to toe equivalent street cars - period.

Originally Posted by tforth And, don't fool yourself, GM has been spending lots of time on the NS developing their products recently. Furthermore, the GT3 has no less relevant creature comforts (997 version) than the Z06. Remember, even in its 'stripped out' format, it still has as many seats the corvette. The 997 GT3 even has sat-nav!

GM has only been spending the last 4 years or so in serious Northloop testing.

Until I make a close study of the 997GT3 RS's coming to Houston, I will reserve judgement, but previous RS's have been quite more track car than street car.. and I would also expect the 2007/8 model RS to be an improvement over the 2006 Z06 (released in 2005)... there are 2 tears in it.

Any way - I am not "defending" anything about the Z06 - I am just tired of people devoted their lives to flawed bashing.

[tforth]

On a 4 mile track tires can equal 10s.. on a 13mile track tyres not only equal 10s, they can surpace it. This is "perfromance car 101" and shouldn't even need to be debated.

Wow, so that would put the CGT time at 7:28 - (10+s) = less than 7:18s, since it's only running Pilot Sport 2s, right?