motor

crayzayjay · 09-23-2004, 06:54 AM

I'm a little confused. If the record is 7.32, then what's this?

Originally Posted by tigerx

7:28 --- Porsche Carrera GT, Walther Röhrl, Autobild July 2004

mindgam3 · 09-23-2004, 07:05 AM

hmmm i cant believe a murc is faster than a zonda either.... a zonda has more power and better handling.

What about the Radical SR3 turbo?? That did it in 7:19

It's also for sale @ £44,500

Bargain

http://www.radicalextremesportscars.com/for_sale.php

espen · 09-23-2004, 07:27 AM

Sport Auto times are often referred to as "official", because they are well documented and pretty much directly comparable. Hence 7.32 is the reccord now.

Anyone can claim a fantastic time outside controlled conditions, all you need are some slicks and chassis tuning

zmydust823 · 09-24-2004, 02:56 AM

i think it all depends on the conditions such as the wheather too..if it is hot, turbo cars have a disadvantage..because they dont spool up as fast or somethign like that when the air is hot...when it is cold, i guess they do.

mindgam3 · 09-24-2004, 07:15 AM

all engines dont produce as much power when its hotter. Colder air is more dense and so more can fit into the cylinder at any one time than hotter air can

rob_e1 · 09-27-2004, 07:31 AM

Yep, mindgam3 is right:

http://www.radicalmotorsport.com/new...iefe/index.php

Radical SR3 Turbo, driven by Phil Bennett 7:19.

This is a fully road legal vehicle in uk, not sure about Germany. Maybe thats why they're claiming the record for the porsche? If so, then the headline should really be:

"Carrera gt fastest german car on nurburgring.. but not actually as quick as something costing a fraction of the price with only a 1500 cc engine made in the uk"

Makes very little sense to me. If you want to go fast 'round a TRACK buy a track car (radical, westfield, caterham etc) or even better, but a second hand race car and trailer it there and back. Real race cars are nasty things to drive on the street. For some reason magazines are obsessed with driving ROAD cars on tracks. If you set the car up to do well on a track it will generally be crap on the road.

The CGT is no-doubt a great car, but for fast trips around the 'ring people should look elsewhere IMO.

rob_e1 · 09-27-2004, 07:34 AM

Oh, and interesting to see an esprit time at 8:13 (Sport 350) which is quicker with only 354 PS than the Ruf 911 CTR 2 which has 520 PS ... :shock:

If only they hadn't put the engine in the wrong place...

mindgam3 · 09-27-2004, 09:18 AM

Originally Posted by rob_e1

Yep, mindgam3 is right:

http://www.radicalmotorsport.com/new...iefe/index.php

Radical SR3 Turbo, driven by Phil Bennett 7:19.

This is a fully road legal vehicle in uk, not sure about Germany. Maybe thats why they're claiming the record for the porsche? If so, then the headline should really be:

"Carrera gt fastest german car on nurburgring.. but not actually as quick as something costing a fraction of the price with only a 1500 cc engine made in the uk"

Makes very little sense to me. If you want to go fast 'round a TRACK buy a track car (radical, westfield, caterham etc) or even better, but a second hand race car and trailer it there and back. Real race cars are nasty things to drive on the street. For some reason magazines are obsessed with driving ROAD cars on tracks. If you set the car up to do well on a track it will generally be crap on the road.

The CGT is no-doubt a great car, but for fast trips around the 'ring people should look elsewhere IMO.

hehe so your saying u wouldnt buy a cgt if you had the money?

Granted for the price it doesent seem worth it when you cold buy a radical for track and something smaller and more road biased for the road, but the CGT is a pretty good comprimise between the two if the price is factored out, probably more so than the enzo because it's not as big.

rob_e1 · 09-27-2004, 09:56 AM

Ahh.. but in the real world you can never factor out price - its is always relevant.

Would i buy a CGT if i had the money? - Actually to be honest, no.

£330k or whatever it is Porsche charge for that would buy me:
- Murcielago (silver, black leather with the roadster wheels/brakes) say £170k
- Lotus Exige (black, black alcantara int, with a supercharger, great on the track and you can you drive there and back. Call that £50k
- RS6 avant for everyday. Say £60k.

That leaves £50k for fuel, insurance, speeding tickets, cocaine, hookers etc.
Still want that CGT..??

Feel free to make up your own list but i think the basic elements of "supercar", "trackcar" and "daily car" are a good starting point

R

st-anger · 09-27-2004, 02:29 PM

...well, i think we can´t compare such cars with a Carrera GT - sorry, but IMO that´s simply not right and i think all the ppl not being a Porsche nut will agree...

i know many CGT owners and till now NO ONE told me that he bought a GT because it´s the fastest track car..
u buy a GT because of passion, the sound, the technology used in it and most of all: ppl buy a CGT to have a piece of history - not only because there are just 1500 pieces, but from what i know - we won´t see a car like this for maybe 15 to 20 years!!!
don´t worry, there´ll be again Porsche supercars - some say maybe sooner onw´ll guess

- but not a car like the 2004 Carrera GT, it´s definitely and outstanding car in Porsche history...

besides, it´s the fastest supercar for the track right now, i don´t know any test or comparison where the Enzo had been faster round a track, but on the other hand it´s not perfect, but good for daily life - not very common for supercars...

some wise words from a guy who had driven both extensively - on track and in town:

"The Enzo is an incredible machine, the only worthy Carrera GT competitor. But we looked at the CGT as a complete package, not only for the track but for the street too. And I think Porsche did the better job because you can pick up your bread at the local bakery in the CGT and afterwards drive to the track to drive the hell out of it.
Ferrari probably knew that most of their customers won't ever drive on the track or even use it as a daily commuter as some CGT customers intend to do and even on the track, the Enzo does keep up pretty well at the beginning but it's performance degrades with every round. That said, I think the CGT is the better value for the money and due to the high production number, parts and repair facilities will be much easier accessible than with the Enzo on a longterm run."

another thing - when i want a true weapon for the track, i´d buy a factory prepared GT3-RS which is able to clock a 7 flat - price...of course...but again personally i would never buy a "Radical type car"...

so my choice´d be

Carrera GT as a supercar, driveable on track and weekends or for a little vacation...
slightely tuned GT3 RS as a track car, right now my choice´d be the GT3 RSC from Cargraphic...
and finally a E60 M5 or Cayenne Turbo as a daily driver- to be honest i´d buy both because i won´t trailer the track car with a 500hp 7speed SMG saloon

, the Cayenne is just perfect for that purpose...

some might say now: nearly only Porsches!!??? - well, name me a good alternative instead of that three...

but well...unfortunately ( or luckily

) i don´t have the time for such toys...

mindgam3 · 09-27-2004, 03:00 PM

hehe i agree with both of you completely.

If the average car nut is lucky enough in life, he/she would probably buy a fast track/road car and an everyday car. Eg an 3 series and a caterham for example. But as st anger said, the CGT is so much more than just about any other car, both on road and track, and if you're going to buy one you undoubtedly have at least one other car already. But thats why to most of us its just a dream and nothing more

st-anger · 09-27-2004, 03:13 PM

Originally Posted by mindgam3

But thats why to most of us its just a dream and nothing more

...when i was 18 like u - i´d have said something like this as well, BUT, when u´re perseveringly enough to work your ass off 24/7 for some years.....everything´s possible

mindgam3 · 09-27-2004, 03:18 PM

Originally Posted by st-anger

Originally Posted by mindgam3

But thats why to most of us its just a dream and nothing more

...when i was 18 like u - i´d have said something like this as well, BUT, when u´re perseveringly enough to work your ass off 24/7 for some years.....everything´s possible

hehe my thoughts exactly, can't wait to start my engineering degree and hopefully it'll lead to good things. Only time will tell

Darkel · 09-27-2004, 03:23 PM

Originally Posted by st-anger

...when i was 18 like u - i´d have said something like this as well, BUT, when u´re perseveringly enough to work your ass off 24/7 for some years.....everything´s possible

That's what I always say before an important test at school

BTW if I had to say something about the CGT it would be "Dream machine", 10 minutes in the porsche multimedia thread and I'm completely in love 8)

zmydust823 · 09-28-2004, 10:24 PM

if i had the funds to buy a CGT i would in a heartbeat, i would take a CGT over an enzo a saleen or a ford GT...that car is a piece of history as St. Anger said..incredibly limited and being a Porsche fan, its like an obligation...porsche is special, its so unique when u drive it..ask anyone who has a driven a number of exotics and fast cars...i have driven evo's z06's m3's and a number of cars and they are nice, dont get me wrong, but they cannot compare to that of porsche...