Autocar 7th of June 2005: BMW M5 beats the Ferrari F430

[Just_me]

[quote="brembo"][quote="Sir_GT"]

Originally Posted by brembo I`ll give you one thing tough, you sure fit the bill as a Bimmer boy, so you had no choice than to get your self a entry level bimmer so you could say "I got a BMW".....lol Im sure it feels great to say that for you...... Vorsprung durch technik

He might sound like a Bimmer boy but you sound like a Audi boy

[Sir_GT]

I've actually never said that to anyone ("I've got a BMW"). What for? Everyone in the UK drives a BMW anyway.

And at least I'm not going around chanting "vorsprung durch technik" like it was a spell as if I was some sort of Lord of the Rings fanatic.

[RC45]

Well - every Bimmer Boy I come across is always trying to prove a point - of some kind..

[Sir_GT]

Originally Posted by brembo Originally Posted by Sir_GT I've actually never said that to anyone ("I've got a BMW"). What for? Everyone in the UK drives a BMW anyway. And at least I'm not going around chanting "vorsprung durch technik" like it was a spell as if I was some sort of Lord of the Rings fanatic. LOL.....ok if you say so, it got to be so....but to buy a slow BMW like you have done and then preach about how well they handle sounds kind of stupid yes you got a BMW and some of them handle well and are fast, yours aint........ If you are about handling and such why dont you buy a car that actually need handling and are fast...... :roll:

I never chant "BMW = 50/50" either. I never say, or have said, anything like that. I am a big fan of ANY car that has proper weight distribution and a fantastic chassis, whether it be a Mazda MX-5 or a Maserati Gransport or a Porsche 911 GT3. I merely point out the facts.

I've never even said that my car is why BMW's are so good... It's a lovely piece of work, and it's quite nippy (but not hot hatchback nippy), but I've never called it anywhere near "best in class" for any reason whatsoever.

I've never said anything as proposterous as that.

What I find hilarious is that you actually have to get personal and sling mud at me and my car just so that you've got something to say. If you look at all my posts, you'll find that I've never criticised you, or the car you drive. I'm sorry mate, but that just shows how desparate you're becoming just to be able to back up your losing argument.

No you dont chant vorsprung, you chant 50/50 weight distribution as it seem you belive thats the only thing that makes a car fast......but by all means cling to your belife boy....

I never said that 50/50 weight distribution "makes" a car go fast either. BUT a properly balanced car does allow the driver to exploit the car's abilities better, rather than forcing him to compromise and work around it's weaknesses. Porsche 911's don't have 50/50 weight distribution, but I don't have a single sliver of doubt that a 911 will blow away an M3 on pretty much any road or circuit there is. That's just a fact.

The same way that it's a fact that stock Audi's are inferior to stock BMW's. Everybody knows it. Even the guys from Top Gear know it. Even the guys from 5th Gear know it. All the journalists know it. Even privateer circuit racers know it. That's why you have privateers joining races like the BTCC and the like with Porsche CS's and M3 CSL's.

The only time you'll ever see an Audi used by a privateer is when it has been heavily (and when I mean heavy, I mean A4 DTM - engine moved way back - driver sitting in the rear seats- heavy) modified.

If they're being raced but not heavily modded, then they're always factory run. Bloody hell, talk about evidence in court. :roll:

The whole bloody world knows it.

Audi's are so blatantly guilty of understeer they make Michael Jackson look like he goes muff-diving on old ladies.

Except for people like you who insist otherwise.

Like I said, you believe what you want to believe, but at the end of the day, Audi's are just VW's in a dress. It's still the same fat, bow-legged cow, but this time its had its hair done, and wears a Chanel gown instead of an Adidas tracksuit.

but it STILL can't dance.

[RC45]

Originally Posted by Sir_GT I never chant "BMW = 50/50" either. I never say, or have said, anything like that. I am a big fan of ANY car that has proper weight distribution and a fantastic chassis, whether it be a Mazda MX-5 or a Maserati Gransport or a Porsche 911 GT3. I merely point out the facts.

ANy car? Puhlease - I can name one that you seem to think is a POS even though it kicks arse everywhere it goes

Originally Posted by Sir_GT Like I said, you believe what you want to believe, but at the end of the day, Audi's are just VW's in a dress. It's still the same fat, bow-legged cow, but this time its had its hair done, and wears a Chanel gown instead of an Adidas tracksuit. but it STILL can't dance.

ACtually - if anything, VW's are dressed down Audi's

Oh - and I just got back from the Home Depot (was out buying some pink lawn flamingo's ) and on the way home - what happenes when I get to the stop light into our subdivision - why, it's a BMW Kid - uhm - I mean BMW Man and his 540i - I have no idea what he was thinking, but by the time we got the second stop sign, he wouldn't even look over to my side hehe

It could have been the fact that not once, but twise I gave a 2 car lead from a standstill and passed him as I shifted into second.

BMW dreamers..

[Sir_GT]

Originally Posted by RC45 Originally Posted by Sir_GT I never chant "BMW = 50/50" either. I never say, or have said, anything like that. I am a big fan of ANY car that has proper weight distribution and a fantastic chassis, whether it be a Mazda MX-5 or a Maserati Gransport or a Porsche 911 GT3. I merely point out the facts. ANy car? Puhlease - I can name one that you seem to think is a POS even though it kicks arse everywhere it goes

Such as?


...I'm not going to even bother commenting on the rest of your post. You could've run into any other car with the same type of driver anyway.

[RC45]

^^Well - have you ever given credit for the fantastic balance, poise and chassis that the C5 Z and C6 Z have?

[Just_me]

Originally Posted by RC45 ^^Well - have you ever given credit for the fantastic balance, poise and chassis that the C5 Z and C6 Z have?

is it the only good thing with vettes?

[RC45]

Originally Posted by Just_me Originally Posted by RC45 ^^Well - have you ever given credit for the fantastic balance, poise and chassis that the C5 Z and C6 Z have? is it the only good thing with vettes?

In a perfromance car, that is all that counts - can it g fast, turn and stop - better than others.

Posing, "interior appointments" and other shit is reserved for BMW lovers

[Sir_GT]

Originally Posted by brembo Originally Posted by Sir_GT The same way that it's a fact that stock Audi's are inferior to stock BMW's. Everybody knows it. Even the guys from Top Gear know it. Even the guys from 5th Gear know it. All the journalists know it. Even privateer circuit racers know it. That's why you have privateers joining races like the BTCC and the like with Porsche CS's and M3 CSL's. The whole bloody world knows it. Audi's are so blatantly guilty of understeer they make Michael Jackson look like he goes muff-diving on old ladies. but it STILL can't dance. I find it strange that you say the guys at Top gear knows it when a STOCK Audi s4 beat a STOCK BMW M3 with close to one second around that small track..... :roll: :fist: I dont throw shit at you or your car any more than you are throwing shit at me and my car, you claim my car undeerster so bad its almost undriveable as its not a heavy modified Audi...still EVO magazine praised its handling and cornering abilities when they tested it......you my friend are nothing more than a poser, and until you learn something about the cars you are about to discuss, you really shouldnt.......now go check out the new prada handbags for men collection....

RS Audi's are as STOCK as M-tuned BMW's.

Those aren't "stock" cars, IMO.

An E55 isn't a stock E-class. An M5 isn't a stock 5-series. The RS6 isn't a stock A6. Those cars aren't produced alongside their regular "stock" counterparts on conveyor belts.


Which is why I've NEVER criticized YOUR car.


*shrugs*

If anything, it's you who needs to learn more about cars.

[Sir_GT]

Originally Posted by RC45 ^^Well - have you ever given credit for the fantastic balance, poise and chassis that the C5 Z and C6 Z have?

That's a touch unfair. I've never criticized those cars for their balance, poise, and chassis. I do find the suspension a bit archaic, but so is the 05 Mustang's, and I love that car.

[Sir_GT]

I'll try to explain what I mean in bullet form...

• standard Audi's (A2,A3,A4,A6,A8) are rebodied VW's.
  
• standard BMW's (1-series, 3-series, X3, X5, 5-series, 6-series, 7-series) are superior to standard Audi's.
  
• RS Audi's aren't standard cars. Neither are M cars, or AMG's. You can drive them everyday, but that doesn't mean they are standard/stock cars.
  
• I have nothing but respect for Audi in the realms of motorsport.
  
• According to Top Gear, 5th Gear, et al... standard BMW's are better than standard Audi's.
  
• According to Top Gear the S4 is quicker than an M3. By the same token, the M5 destroys the S6.
  
• I never criticised, or intended to criticise, your car.
  

Capiche?

Originally Posted by brembo And yes I need to learn more about cars, thats why I spend parts of my sparetime building cars, tuning cars, taking them to the track and in general getting dirty learning about them.....

Isn't this why we're all jabba members?

You my friend need to get some nice matching shoes to go with that prada bag.....

I honestly never knew that they made prada bags for men. In fact, it's quite amusing that you did.


...although I do need new sneakers. Any suggestions?

[pharzo]

The s4 may have beaten the m3, and the rs4 will also beat the m3, but the bmw equivalent of the rs4 is the m3 csl. The csl was 3 seconds faster around the track than the s4...it's 300 kg's lighter than the rs4. It's a thoroughbred racer with a history that is long and distinguished. The rs4 is a beetle with awd...

Brembo you must stop with the handbag nonsense...its only making one person here look fruity

hint:it's not sir_gt

[Sir_GT]

Originally Posted by brembo I guess this is where we have to agree to disagree, cuz I look at the RS and M models as standard cars....a modified one would have to be done something to, and I mean more than a exhaust and chip that doesnt qualify as a mod IMO..... By this and the fact that you nowhere stated that you didnt count S and RS models in when you compared them to BMW`s and said they where inferior to the BMW`s you talked down every Audi including the S and RS ones.....wich are superior.... I have said several times that I dont call it an true Audi if it lacks quattro (convertibles aside)

This is where we will have to agree to disagree. To me, an Audi, even with Quattro, is inferior to a BMW, and they can only match them if they're modded (S or RS).

I dont care if you talk crap about my car really, what bugs me are you made a statment where you included all Audi`s as undeerstering crap.....wich are far from the truth and the S models can hang with the bimmers easily while the RS models kills the M..... So talking every day beater you think the BMW are the best, but when it comes to the cars that should really perform the Audi are the best ones???

Again we'll have to agree to disagree. I do feel that standard Audi's (Quattros included, S and RS ones excluded) possess inferior handling compared to BMW's.

Also, it's a touch unfair to compare RS with M models. The real comparisons are between the S and M models. That's the reason why the S models are simlarly priced to the M models, and why the RS models are nearly £10,000 more expensive.

With that in mind, like I've said, the S4 may have beaten the old M3, but the old M5 did beat the old S6. Thing is, I highly doubt that the current S4 will beat the upcoming M3, and there I also doubt that the current S6 will beat the M5. That's just my opinion, and until we get some proper comparison tests, it would be pointless to argue about it.

What WILL be a disappointment is if the new RS4 doesn't eclipse the upcoming M3. Then the £10,000 price excess will end up unjustified. With that, we'll have to wait and see.

ok works for me.... ..I dont care if its a BMW or an Audi,I dont plan on getting me a boring slow non handler anytime soon .....

So... what would you equate as a boring slow handler? The Mazda MX-5 has fantastic handling, but the 120d is quicker than that, and has the chassis, engine, and suspension found in the E90 320d... which is superior to the equivalent Audi A4.

LOL on the prada bags, you know there are more brands with bags than your thrusted Versace one.....and I dont think you would mind having a girls bag either since you went for the chick car...... sorry just had to give you a little one....

Sorry, but That doesn't hold water at all.

Keep in mind that CAR magazine even included the 120d in their PCoTY, making top 5, and edging out pretty much everything save for the performance cars. EVO magazine said that the 120d is pretty much the best performing small hatchback in its class, and Top Gear magazine chose it over its rivals as well.

I think the biggest difference is that because you hate the badge (BMW) and the design, you refuse to acknowledge what a good car they have in the 1-series, whereas I have nothing against the Audi badge, or their design, but I will always rather invest in the best car I can get for the money.

And according to the test drives, and to those who are more knowledgeable than we, the best was the 120d.

That and the fact that the wife didn't like the A3's look, and if we were to choose the Golf GTI, the dealership service would've been rubbish, and both the Audi and Golf would've cost the same as the 120d in the end, but would've lost more in the depreciation.

[bmwdakias]

You are saying that BMW is being destroyed when we see BMW's sales rising constantly. This fact clearly depicts the acceptance of the new design direction introduced by the American designer. The infamous E65 has been the best selling 7 series up to date and sales of the whole range have been strong. You might not like BMWs when looks come into consideration but saying that they dont handle well anymore! thats totally outargeous. They might be getting heavier for the shake of the increasing demand for luxury gimmicks and safety features but they will still outhandle anything in their segment not matter which category you look into. If you dont like the BMW interiors at all,just have a look at the new s class and you ll notice that it reminds you of something. In the near future everything will simply make sense, BMW has brought in a new era in the interior design and others are simply immitating,(AUDI-Mercedes) introducing their own versions of i-drive, placing the screen on the same height as the rest of the other instruments etc.