New Ferrai/Pininfarina Concept Car - 612 P4/5

[iraghava]

This is the new concept car designed by Pininfarina and built on an Enzo platform with the same engine. Pictures are not yet freely available but are available on the link below which for some reason I am unable to open.

http://www.autoblog.nl/archive/2006/...a_komen_m#body

Excerpts from Pisonheads.com

Originally Posted by pistonheads.com Ferrari and Pininfarina have come up with a stunning concept car, called the 612 P4/5. Based on the Enzo, it's inspired by the famous 1960s P4 racer (see pic). The two-seater houses the Enzo's 660bhp V12 and sits on a modified version of its carbon-fibre chassis. The car's likely to be faster than the Enzo since it weighs less than the icon's 1,365kg and, according to reports, performs better in wind tunnels too. Officially a one-off, the car is said by Pininfarina to be much more than just a concept. It was created to explore the outer edges of the company's design ideas, while ensuring that the car was road-legal, with the aim of showing a possible route for Ferrari's future design. It cost some £2.6 million to develop and was initially designed by Ken Okuyama and his team. Okuyama was behind the Maserati Birdcage show car (see link below) which wowed at the Festival of Speed 2005, as well as Ferrari's forthcoming 599GTB Fiorano. The car was tough to produce, since Ferrari had to find a donor Enzo. It tracked one of the rare cars down – only 399 were ever made – at a Beverly Hills dealer and bought it for £800,000. While the 612 P4/5 is unlikely to be produced en masse, it's set to debut on 20 August at the Pebble Beach Concours d'Elegance in California. Shame it'll miss the FoS then...

Ferrari had to pay GBP 800,000 for an Enzo :shock: :shock: Am I the only one who finds it a little hard to believe?

[Zot09]

It's set to debut at the Concours d'Elegance!!! Yes!!! Thankfully I live in Monterey, yes!!! I have to go this summer haha

[RC45]

Originally Posted by iraghava Ferrari had to pay GBP 800,000 for an Enzo :shock: :shock: Am I the only one who finds it a little hard to believe?

This sound like BS - I mean they could build an FXX for everyone who wanted one,yet couldn't put together a donor Enzo for a concept car... hhhmmmm - someone is a sucker then.

[iraghava]

Originally Posted by insane Originally Posted by RC45 Originally Posted by iraghava Ferrari had to pay GBP 800,000 for an Enzo :shock: :shock: Am I the only one who finds it a little hard to believe? This sound like BS - I mean they could build an FXX for everyone who wanted one,yet couldn't put together a donor Enzo for a concept car... hhhmmmm - someone is a sucker then. Exactly what I was thinking. This sound a tiny bit fishy.

Exactly what I thought!!

Originally Posted by insane Exactly what I was thinking. This sound a tiny bit fishy.

How tiny Insane? Blue Whale tiny I am guessing !!!

[nthfinity]

ahahaha

no this is 100% real

but they have some really shitty, and bogus facts... spend some time reading the thread on ferrari chat.

i figured this wasn't worth posting till there was some real news about it

what autoweek/auto express "jurnalists" wrote about it is nothing more then what can be read about it in Ferrari chat... their member "napolis" who's name is Jim something has commissioned Pininfarina to build the P4/5 and no picture that is out is close according to him...

anyway; the thread is here

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=92754

[RC45]

IS this an accuarte Cliff's Notes that I found?

The whole story is being detailed over on ferrarichat.com Basically the car is being commissioned by a wealthy American banker who already owns a pair of original 330p3/p4/412p as well as another significant early Ferrari and a wide assortment of other rare toys! Its also interesting to note that the car pictured in auto express doesn’t look like the shots of the clay styling prototype that the cars owners has shared offline with a number of people........but they are correct in saying that this it is going to be a far far better looking car than the enzo

And look at this exchange...

Jim, You want facts - Here are, not one but 3 FACTS – and these are FACTS, not opinion!!; 1. Ferrari have stated that the chassis of 0846 does not exist. I know your response: I quote; "Ferrari's exact words, which I disclosed YEARS AGO, were "written off". "Written off" does not mean "Ceasing to exist"." (end quote) But that's YOUR opinion! Ferrari have asked you not to claim that your car is 0846, therefore it is obvious that in their opinion "written off" means "Ceasing to exist". (and I know that you are waiting/hoping that they will change their view on this, but that is their statement at this time.) 2. I have also discussed this with Mauro Forghieri. I asked him what happened to the crashed Amon car. He states “the basic chassis was destroyed and the components used, where possible.” As he was at the factory when the wreck was returned he would know better than anyone what happened to it. 3. David Piper states that he sold you a replica chassis not an original chassis of any sort. But apparently their memories are unreliable – (because they don’t agree with you?) - but your sources (Nino & Wayne) are 100% reliable? We’ve had your theory - Now you give us facts; - 1. How did this chassis get out of the factory? 2. Who took it out of the factory? 3. When did they do this? 4. Have you got anyone at Ferrari who disputes that this chassis was scrapped? 5. Which scrap-yard did it go to? 6. Who took it out of the scrap-yard? 7. How did it get to Pipers? 8. How come Piper didn’t realize that he’d been tucked up with an old scrap chassis instead of the new one that he’d paid for? Let’s have facts not supposition!

It does seem that these are just "boys with their toys" - looks and sounds like kids (very rich and spoiled kids ) squabbling - not seriously wealthy mature car collectors.

I do believe the Tifosi are all primadonnas... now we might understand why Jay Leno doesn't wanna be one of them...

[sameerrao]

I don't really care if the P3/4 is genuine or a fake. Even if it is the latter, it has been painstakingly restored with proper Ferrari P4 components in it. Its not like its got the psuedo body of a Ferrari with the mechanicals of the Jaguar.

People can dick around about VIN numbers and crap but this is a really beautiful car that I would love to see and hear in the flesh someday.

[gobs3z]

My only fear is that it'll use the F1 trans, and he's talking about being a pure drivers car that will take you back to the day, and i don't think it would fully achieve it with the F1 trans in it, i dunno if anyone has asked on the forum yet because i couldn't read through it all if it's totally Enzo based then it probably is going to have an F1 trans.

[stradale]

Originally Posted by RC45 IS this an accuarte Cliff's Notes that I found? The whole story is being detailed over on ferrarichat.com Basically the car is being commissioned by a wealthy American banker who already owns a pair of original 330p3/p4/412p as well as another significant early Ferrari and a wide assortment of other rare toys! Its also interesting to note that the car pictured in auto express doesn’t look like the shots of the clay styling prototype that the cars owners has shared offline with a number of people........but they are correct in saying that this it is going to be a far far better looking car than the enzo And look at this exchange... Jim, You want facts - Here are, not one but 3 FACTS – and these are FACTS, not opinion!!; 1. Ferrari have stated that the chassis of 0846 does not exist. I know your response: I quote; "Ferrari's exact words, which I disclosed YEARS AGO, were "written off". "Written off" does not mean "Ceasing to exist"." (end quote) But that's YOUR opinion! Ferrari have asked you not to claim that your car is 0846, therefore it is obvious that in their opinion "written off" means "Ceasing to exist". (and I know that you are waiting/hoping that they will change their view on this, but that is their statement at this time.) 2. I have also discussed this with Mauro Forghieri. I asked him what happened to the crashed Amon car. He states “the basic chassis was destroyed and the components used, where possible.” As he was at the factory when the wreck was returned he would know better than anyone what happened to it. 3. David Piper states that he sold you a replica chassis not an original chassis of any sort. But apparently their memories are unreliable – (because they don’t agree with you?) - but your sources (Nino & Wayne) are 100% reliable? We’ve had your theory - Now you give us facts; - 1. How did this chassis get out of the factory? 2. Who took it out of the factory? 3. When did they do this? 4. Have you got anyone at Ferrari who disputes that this chassis was scrapped? 5. Which scrap-yard did it go to? 6. Who took it out of the scrap-yard? 7. How did it get to Pipers? 8. How come Piper didn’t realize that he’d been tucked up with an old scrap chassis instead of the new one that he’d paid for? Let’s have facts not supposition! It does seem that these are just "boys with their toys" - looks and sounds like kids (very rich and spoiled kids ) squabbling - not seriously wealthy mature car collectors. I do believe the Tifosi are all primadonnas... now we might understand why Jay Leno doesn't wanna be one of them...

Those notes are accurate. Ferrari is not involved in this project, Jim commissioned this prototype from Pininfarina. He bought a new US spec Enzo and shipped it to Italy. This is not going to be a concept car, but a well engineered, serviceable car. It will be road legal and driveable on the road. Front overhang will be small compared to the Enzo. The idea was to make a Ferrari with sexy curvy shapes that is also aerodynamically efficient. It will be lighter than the Enzo and will have more downforce.

Jim is not a primadonna, nor is he a kid. He owns a 330P4, a 412P, a Lola T70, a Ford GT40 mkIV and the oldest surviving Ferrari, the 166 Spyder Corsa (s/n 002C). All of these cars have been registered and are used on the street, which goes to show he uses them as they were intended and even beyond that. Last summer he travelled Europe with the 330P4 and the 166. He brings his cars to events all over the world, so other people have a chance to see them. In the case of the debate about s/n 0846, the 330 P4, he is the one opposing many purist experts (primadonnas if you will). IMO he is a car enthusiast of the right kind.

[inso]

nice info about this car. when you have pictures, i want to see link to them too. making a classic ferrari looking car, with great mechanicals is good, reminds me of 288gto, last classic looking ferrari, and with nice bang.

[PATo355]

Thats a cool looking car ...

[nthfinity]

Originally Posted by PATo355 Thats a cool looking car ...

but not the one we'll see at pebble beach (thankfully)

[noliebro]

here is the cover of autoweek witha picture they say is close according to the man who payed for this whole thing:

[RC45]

Originally Posted by stradale Those notes are accurate. Ferrari is not involved in this project, Jim commissioned this prototype from Pininfarina. He bought a new US spec Enzo and shipped it to Italy. This is not going to be a concept car, but a well engineered, serviceable car. It will be road legal and driveable on the road. Front overhang will be small compared to the Enzo. The idea was to make a Ferrari with sexy curvy shapes that is also aerodynamically efficient. It will be lighter than the Enzo and will have more downforce. Jim is not a primadonna, nor is he a kid. He owns a 330P4, a 412P, a Lola T70, a Ford GT40 mkIV and the oldest surviving Ferrari, the 166 Spyder Corsa (s/n 002C). All of these cars have been registered and are used on the street, which goes to show he uses them as they were intended and even beyond that. Last summer he travelled Europe with the 330P4 and the 166. He brings his cars to events all over the world, so other people have a chance to see them. In the case of the debate about s/n 0846, the 330 P4, he is the one opposing many purist experts (primadonnas if you will). IMO he is a car enthusiast of the right kind.

I think you are mixing up 2 responses in one.

SO the magazine etc saying its a Ferrari prototype are wrong, andf it is a private effort. Then that explains why a car needed to be bought.

The second bit I posted shows why i stopped reading Ferrai-Chat a long time ago - most of the time there are pages and pages of he-say she-say posts where one rich collector is bitching at another rich collector.. generally acting like kids.

if any of those folks had any profesisonalism they would take those types of discussion ofline one on one, but it seems that it's just an ego driven pissing match about who has the real this or that.

That is why I called them primadonnas - it doesn't matter who they are - it's how they act

[Mattk]

The pictures show a pretty interesting car.