Corvette C6 Topgear Track time.

[dons5]

some of u ppl are jus too dumb

[RC45]

Originally Posted by dons5 some of u ppl are jus too dumb

Really?

And you having your points picked apart one by one and disproved means you are what?

The clever one?

Oh yeah, I believe the last 360 I tangled with on the street also had a better hp/l rating... he lost that one too.. as did the last M3.. another hp/l victim..

[dons5]

ur the one whos an idiot, i didnt say an engine with a better hp/l ratio will win a drag race, ur fuckin stupid man ur prob some 16 year old kid that doesnt know shit about cars

[RC45]

Originally Posted by dons5 ur the one whos an idiot, i didnt say an engine with a better hp/l ratio will win a drag race, ur fuckin stupid man ur prob some 16 year old kid that doesnt know shit about cars

And you were proven wrong stating that a DOHC motor of similar capacity to a pushrod would be smaller and weigh less.

So while I probably may be a 16 year old kid you are definitely the dumbass in this debate.

And this question then begs asking - exactly what value does a particular hp/l rating have..???

[dons5]

i never said a DOHC motor of similar capacity to a pushrod would be smaller and weigh less, i said a smaller capacity engine would be smaller and weigh less, i never mentioned it being DOHC or pushrod so get ur shit straight before u go commenting on what other ppl say cause all ur doin is makin urself look bad

[TransAm]

Originally Posted by LotusGT1 @TransAm2001 Where have you been, and what did you like about it ?

Amsterdam, and I expect you can guess the rest... <exhales deeply>

[graywolf624]

lol, thats complete rubbish, you just basically made up an equation that doesen't and cannot exist because the units on both sides are not the same....

Man.. Please take a physics class damn it..
You convert the numbers with constants. I feel like Im talkint to a 2 year old here.

MPG IS different from the energy you extract from the fuel to give you power!

no its not.. mpg gives you the amount of gas u use.. The hp curve gives you amount of power used in that same time. That gives you hp/gas liter. Learn some algebra. Given hp/ mpg/ and mph you can compute power/liter of gas in whatever unit you want.

Power is to do with how much friction is produced by the engine, how much fuel/ait mixture it can get into the combustion chamber in each cycle and how efficiently it burns it.

Now.. power is to the output of the engine.. and the power /liter gas is the power output of engine in hp per liter of gasoline(mpg used to compute) input.

[mindgam3]

Originally Posted by graywolf624 lol, thats complete rubbish, you just basically made up an equation that doesen't and cannot exist because the units on both sides are not the same.... Man.. Please take a physics class damn it.. You convert the numbers with constants. I feel like Im talkint to a 2 year old here.

lol, but constants don't have units.... what are you talking about??

in your equation you stated gallons = horsepower

you measure power in watts or newton metres per second, they do not equal gallons.

I think its you that needs to be taking your maths and physics classes all over again

Originally Posted by graywolf624 MPG IS different from the energy you extract from the fuel to give you power! no its not.. mpg gives you the amount of gas u use.. The hp curve gives you amount of power used in that same time. That gives you hp/gas liter. Learn some algebra. Given hp/ mpg/ and mph you can compute power/liter of gas in whatever unit you want.

mpg doesen't give u the amount of gas u use. It gives you the amount of gas you use relative to the distance you travel.

Put it this way; take an engine out of a car and run it. Its still producing power but you can't get a mpg figure from it because its not going anywhere..... Think about it

Power is to do with how much friction is produced by the engine, how much fuel/ait mixture it can get into the combustion chamber in each cycle and how efficiently it burns it.

Now.. power is to the output of the engine.. and the power /liter gas is the power output of engine in hp per liter of gasoline(mpg used to compute) input.[/quote]

so your saying miles per gallon = power?

There is no way this can be true just by looking at the units on each side as i said above.

The units of miles per gallon are obvious - miles and gallons. If we were being picky we should convert them to the common physics equivalent which are metres and metres cubed. As i said power is watts or newton metres per second which are in no way shape or form equivalent to metres ^4

There is no way in hell that miles per gallon = power

[graywolf624]

lol, but constants don't have units.... what are you talking about??

What? What are you smoking dude? Conversion constants always have units. Its impossible not to have units in any empirical data.

in your equation you stated gallons = horsepower

No.. I stated mpg gives you gallons gas
hp curve gives you hp over time.
if there same period of time.. then they show power/over gas usage.

mpg doesen't give u the amount of gas u use. It gives you the amount of gas you use relative to the distance you travel.

If you combine mph this gives you the gallon usage over a give time period.

Put it this way; take an engine out of a car and run it. Its still producing power but you can't get a mpg figure from it because its not going anywhere..... Think about it

while this is in fact true, assuming equal power train drive loss(which is easily assumed given same type of mechanics, it becomes an ignorable consequence for any test.

There is no way in hell that miles per gallon = power

Read what I wrote again. I never said mpg=power
I said use mpg combined with the hp curve. Two seperate pieces of information.. Observed over a given time period at a series of speed changes. This is perfectly reasonable test that proves exactly what Im talking about.

[mindgam3]

Originally Posted by graywolf624 Put it this way; take an engine out of a car and run it. Its still producing power but you can't get a mpg figure from it because its not going anywhere..... Think about it while this is in fact true, assuming equal power train drive loss(which is easily assumed given same type of mechanics, it becomes an ignorable consequence for any test. There is no way in hell that miles per gallon = power Read what I wrote again. I never said mpg=power I said use mpg combined with the hp curve. Two seperate pieces of information.. Observed over a given time period at a series of speed changes. This is perfectly reasonable test that proves exactly what Im talking about.

Ok, i understand what you trying to get at now.

You are saying that mpg gives you an idea of how efficient a car is right?

Ie when you compared 360 with vette, you said the vette has a better mpg value and therefore is more efficient correct?

Thing is, we were never comparing (with refference to HP/l , mpg and power) cars, we were comparing engines. And as i stated, mpg is affected by the whole car, not just the engine. Therefore mpg does not tell you how efficient an engine is. HP/l gives you a better idea.

[graywolf624]

Ie when you compared 360 with vette, you said the vette has a better mpg value and therefore is more efficient correct? Thing is, we were never comparing (with refference to HP/l , mpg and power) cars, we were comparing engines. And as i stated, mpg is affected by the whole car, not just the engine. Therefore mpg does not tell you how efficient an engine is. HP/l gives you a better idea.

But hp per liter doesnt reflect in any way the hp output per gallon of gas of the engine. The hp per gallon.. even when roughly approximated through my above method.. comes closer to taking into account the issue of rpm and such. Obviously while a higher liter stores more gas each cycle.. it rotates less per minute, thus meaning it has less cycles. Total gas usage over time will be a factor of cycles per minute* liters of engine. Then factoring in hp.. that would be an adequate number.

[mindgam3]

I agree with you in that hp per gallon of fuel is useful, but it is affected by the whole car. This obviously has its advantages but it does not give you a clue as to how efficient the engine is at proudcing HP compared with its size. HP/litre does

[graywolf624]

proudcing HP compared with its size.

But that isnt useful cause its not the actual size of the engine. Which means it has no effect on the end product, which is what really matters when you get down to it.

[RC45]

Actually - HP/l is only a comparative value of significance if you have 2 or more engines of the SAME capacity.

As in you may have say a 3l maximum capacity in a given racing class.

In order to make more power, the only realistic course of action left is to push more fuel through the engine in a given unit of time - right?

Since increasing capacity directly is out of the question - you need another method to do it.

So you either us FI to squeeze more fuel in the same amount of revolutions - or you turn more revolutions to move more fuel through.

In this case HP/l is a valuable indicator of what your engine can do - period - but even then it is simply as a power comparison to the other guy.

It still has no bearing on the efficiency of the engines being compared - as you may move 3 times as much fuel as the next guy, but only have a 10% increase in power due to other loss factors. - or by some miracle you may triple your power and move 30% more fuel through.

Right?

(feel free to whip your collective scientific penii out and try ream me for this one)

[SFDMALEX]

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