CSL on the Nürburgring

[RC45]

Originally Posted by LotusGT1 C5 Z was never available in Germany.

Yet there is a waiting list for people in Europe trying to buy and import used C5 Z's... and they selling the few C6 Z's as soon as they land

[Just_me]

Originally Posted by RC45 Originally Posted by Just_me Originally Posted by RC45 [ Interesting read - however that 7m50 with semi-slick tyres is not that impressive alongside the 7m54 of the much cheaper and mass produced C5 Z on full tread street tyres.. ] Every time he mention comes from sportauto, your s is a factory time. What is the time for CSL done with the factory driver? Its a shame Sportauto never tested C5 Z06, Im so looking forward to see sportauto test C6 Z06 around the ring. PS AC shnitzer drove M3 CSL (modified chassisettings) on nordschleife in 7.36 min But do remember the "factory time" was set by a US company that risks severe legal ramifications if they make false claims. That alone is incentive to not lie - Mazda had to swallow a lot of money just because they misquoted the RX8 power output by a few KW. The times provided by GM (and validated by independent observers - one of which is a JW contributor.. ) are the real deal.

I only listen to sportauto I trust them better than factory times but if factory times is more valid for you then I wont force you to change your mind

Maybe this is something for you:

2007 CTS Super V, powered by a 7.0-liter 505-hp LS7 V8 lifted directly from the Corvette Z06

The Super V also features custom bodywork, huge rear tires, larger exhaust pipes and an engine sound unlike any other CTS.

With the new CTS slated for arrival as a 2008 model, speculation is that Cadillac will offer this exclusive model as a last hurrah for the exiting first-generation CTS.

If that’s not powerful enough, wait for the next-generation CTS Super V, which is rumored to be equipped with the LS9 engine—a supercharged 6.2-liter V8 with 600 hp. But you’ll be waiting at least until the 2010 or 2011 model year for that one.

[RC45]

^^ Old news already posted in Musclee Car Section - but it is good that you are taking note

Afterall, GM is about to go bankrupt and will soon be bought by a Euro auto maker (see Daimler Chrysler ) and then you will no longer be able to "hate" on Yank Cars - as they will probably be owned by a Euro brand... hehe

[LotusGT1]

Originally Posted by RC45 Originally Posted by LotusGT1 C5 Z was never available in Germany. ... and they selling the few C6 Z's as soon as they land

Same applies for the Bugatti Veyron and the Kia Sorento. Nice benchmark you have

[dirim]

I like the leveled discussion with several interesting viewpoints. Have some comments on different points being brought up.

Trunk floor:
Someone asked whether the trunk floor of the CSL was really cardboard thus not useable? Cardboard is Jeremy Clarkson's humorous was of saying it's special lightweight material. The technical name of the material is paper-honeycomb sandwich. It's used in aircraft industry a lot and is quite strong. No problems with the shopping bag. Actually there are several lightweight materials used intelligently where it really makes a difference to keep the costs low as opposed to going Carbon Fiber everywhere.

Sport Auto vs Factory:
The interesting thing about Sport Auto tests, in addition to them taking this seriously and being objective that the same driver (H. v Saurma) drives all the cars eliminating driver bias. When you compare factory times, you will always have some bias.

Semi-slick Tires:
Semi-slick cup tires is believed to make about 4 sec difference at the ring. Note that many other hard core sports car are also tested with that tire. There is always the debate whether this is fair or not. IMO if it's standard on the car, it is. Otherwise, you can argue that the ceramic brakes are not fair as well if you see my point.

Reliability:
All BMWs have the same warranty and the CSL is not less reliable than other models. I know people who had driven their CSLs more than 10K Km on the ring. Of course the wear and tear is higher on hi-revving, fast cars compared family cars.

More HP etc.
Like anything else in life, there is no perfect car. They're all compromises of some sort. CSL comes from a sedan coupe. Seats 4 people comfortably and does a good joob as a sports car. Some other cars, are designed as two seaters, with less or no luggage space etc. It all depends on what you expect/need in a car. Different strokes for different folks.

For those asking for more power, 360hp is more that what most people can effectively use already. I really would like to see a trend to reduce car weight instead of increasing HP. A 1200Kg 300hp car is much more interesting and fun than a 1700Kg 500Hp car.

Best Regards,

[RC45]

Originally Posted by dirim I like the leveled discussion with several interesting viewpoints. Have some comments on different points being brought up. Trunk floor: Someone asked whether the trunk floor of the CSL was really cardboard thus not useable? Cardboard is Jeremy Clarkson's humorous was of saying it's special lightweight material. The technical name of the material is paper-honeycomb sandwich. It's used in aircraft industry a lot and is quite strong. No problems with the shopping bag. Actually there are several lightweight materials used intelligently where it really makes a difference to keep the costs low as opposed to going Carbon Fiber everywhere.

This makes sense.

We have a balsawood/resin sandwich floor in our cars, so light weight strong material is better than a sheet metal

[Just_me]

Originally Posted by RC45 ^^ Old news already posted in Musclee Car Section - but it is good that you are taking note

but i asked if it was something for you? No answer?

[RC45]

Originally Posted by Just_me Originally Posted by RC45 ^^ Old news already posted in Musclee Car Section - but it is good that you are taking note but i asked if it was something for you? No answer?

Yes it is.. however I am not going to buy any car newer than 2003 - especially not a GM car... far too many opportunities for "big brother" data aquisition with the new systems

As it is people think OnStar is all fun and games, ut considering the service can unlock you car, sending other signals to tamper with/aletr or manipulate the car is a short step away.

Having your driving patterns recorded and observed is also not a good idea.

There is no need for anyone to monitpr where I go, how soon I got there or how fast I traveled between stops

Not to mention accident reconstruciotn from screeds of on-board stored data..

So - a 1st generation CTS-V is as far as I would go...

[nthfinity]

^^^
with a second generation motor

[bmwdriver]

cool link
Tkx

[RC45]

Originally Posted by nthfinity ^^^ with a second generation motor

That's a given.. 408 stroker LS2.. AFR heads.. MTI tuned... 540 N/A RWHP
[homer]Hhhhhmmmmm push-rods... [/homer]

[Kiran]

The CSL might not have enough torque but it still is an extremly fast car. Look at the Sportauto time it puts down on the NS. I don't remember it exactly but I thought it was something like 7.52.

Not every car has to be a 500hp machine.

I'll give it a month before you'll be saying that Smart's should be equipped with at least a V8

[RC45]

Originally Posted by Kiran The CSL might not have enough torque but it still is an extremly fast car. Look at the Sportauto time it puts down on the NS. I don't remember it exactly but I thought it was something like 7.52. Not every car has to be a 500hp machine. I'll give it a month before you'll be saying that Smart's should be equipped with at least a V8

This comeback is a little late.. a CSL owner already quoted NS times and trunk space

And it's amazing how people will use the "power is not everything " when defending a car, yet in the same breath worship the ground a another of their hero cars roll on because itt has "more power".. AMG for example... hehe