Well said st-anger as always. It's too easy to call him "idiot", but a guy with a woman he loves and two children waiting for him at home should be carefull when driving a fast car. We don't know the details, but if he was really doing 256 on a 80 kmh road, far from me to say he deserved it (nobody does), but that was total madness from him :(
Everybody speed, sure, and we always feel like nothing can touch us. Even on track you can die as we sadly saw some time ago :(.
I don't have children myself and maybe when I will, I will still be as stupid as today, but once ppl depend on your, need you and your love, some things have to be put aside :(
That said, again, it is too easy to call him idiot and affirm he deserved it :(

Shame he died... shame about the car too

Money=Respect ???? I think not :roll:

And anybody with the money can get hold of an Enzo :?

If I died from driving 100 mph on a 2 lane highway, or if when I drove 100 on a 2 lane(never done it) I would be an idiot too.

And yet again I don't think myself perfect, but I expect that if I died cause of driving like an idiot you'd have the balls to call it as you see it and say I acted like an idiot and its my own damn fault. That I shouldnt have endangered my own and other peoples lives. I don't sugar coat things just cause the person died, and it pisses me off when people do so.

As I stated above, I feel sorry for his family.. But Im glad he only killed himself and feel had he lived he should have had his license and his car revoked.

...the level of disrespectfulness to the family calling a dead father "asshat", "idiot", ... makes me feel ashamed and some ppl here should better leave it now... :idea:

...can only shake my head when reading some "wisdoms" here, sorry.... :|

Nobody deserves this, could be anyone

RIP

Nice criteria for judging who is skilled and who unskilled driver you have

This arguing sounds silly, end of the day he was responsible for his actions. He could of been the greatest Skilled driver in the world, this wasnt a race track, someone or a vehicle could of jumped in front of him and he tried to get out of the way. You dont get sand traps on the roads, looks like he collected a pole or tree.

Skills doesnt come into it, common sense does, it wasnt a freeway/autostrada it was a normal road. If he was using common sense he would of done 80--100 like the rest of them, but he decided to give it a fang and now has paid the ultimate price for it.

If people respected others when they are alive, there wouldnt be a need to respect them when they die. :(

ill just say we all make mistakes and we dont always take the best decisions, only god and the driver knows what happened, and were no one to judge him. Who knows if he did it on purpose.
In the end he did no harm to other than his family and loved ones, and "just" in a sentimental way, and hes just responsible for that.

I don't think anyone can argue what he was doing was reckless and highly risky - and he ended up paying the price for it. It doesn't do any good calling him names after he's dead, so maybe we should just leave it.

When I was in Alice Springs in August we regularly did 300kmh+ (332kmh max) and it could all have gone horribly wrong at any moment. The big difference however is that we were on a road with no speed limits, and that was flat for miles and miles with very minimal traffic. This guy in the Enzo wasn't quite as selective in choosing the place to achieve these speeds.....

I think we can safely say he didn't kill himself on purpose. :wink:

i agree.. what's the matter with you people?

I am not going to get drawn into the discussion that has unveiled itself over the last few pages. However, I was reading the various versions of the story.

An interesting theory on a POSSIBLE cause of the crash (except the obvious..namely speed). In summary, the Enzo may have lifted off the ground (perhaps a dip/hump in the road), at which point it lost all/most downforce effects, which may have caused a spin e.t.c....... what do people think?

I does make sense, especially on a straight road with (I presume) no other traffic.



"Sunday morning near Milan a 41 years old man died because he lost control of his car."

accident happened at 256km/h ~157mph, as per the enzo's computer that records all speeds much like an airplane's "black box" flight data recorder

there is speculation as to how it actually happened, but some believe that the rear end steped off the pavement and entered a spin, with some tree/telephone pole hitting in there. others suggest something similar, but ground effects were lost quickly after leaving the road, which would mean no downforce at 155mph (as the enzo has no "traditional" downforce devices i.e. wings/spoilers, so once the car is sufficently off the ground there is no downforece created at all) the car would then spin and roll out of control, with periods of flight until friction with the ground brought the car to a stop. however it is unknow if the driver lost control, or the vehicle failed at this time. it looks like to me that the car slid into a tree/pole sideways and hit into the door (note the driver rear quarter panel looks very good considering) theis caused the monocoque to break, because all force was applied directly to the monocoque itself.

the monocoque should have held up, but this is aparently a reoccuring problem in ferraris (at least the newer ones 355, 360, enzo)

the lack of skidmarks lends to the theory that the car was airborne for some while before stopping

despite some debate this IS an enzo, leaving only 398 left in the world

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=81352

there were some explicit pictures posted but the server exceeded bandwidth, and they are no longer avaliable (from what i can find)

Interesting point. Seems quite logical considering that this was such a narrow road. Narrow roads aren't known for their extraordinary smoothness. At ~160mph any little series of ups and downs that are never noticed below 100mph could be enough to "break" that downforce by letting the enzo come just an inch or two off the ground.

It could easily be possible that he regulary passed the road at 140mph or so, but ~160mph was enough to barely overcome the downforce for an instant taking all control away from him.

Ok, thanks to kawa22, I have some more infos:

it happened in Burago, near Milano (Italy as said). The owner, a 41 yo businessman was, as said traveling above 250 kmh when he lost control of the car. He hit a signpost on the side of the road which torn the car apart. As said, he died immediately and left behind him a pregnant wife :(

I second that :|

There is no monocoque (including in the racecars) that will hold in an impact to a narrow (tree, pole ...) immoveble object ... No way ...

Well - well - well.

I was - like st-anger kind of surprised by the remarks by some.

Crazy behaviour sometimes results in bad outcome... but damn... such anger and hate from fellow car enthusiats.

And 256kmh is not that fast in the grand scheme of things.

Any one of us with 400+hp cars can run to 140mph in 4th gear and 20 seconds.

150mph on that straight road is not that fast in the grand scheme of things either.

Many of us with hi-powered cars psend a lot of time in the 90 to 120mph range when we are out in the back roads and freeways. You don't blast past to many people going that speed... but hen again spinning off the road at 90mph is just as destructive as spinning off the road at 110 mph - and 140mph is only slightly more devastating.

It's like choosing between being run over by a semi-truck, a bus or a train - either way it's gonna hurt - a lot.

Back to the accident on hand.

What a sad loss for the driver's family and himslef and a startling loss for Ferrari fanclub.. another car down.. :(

BUt, for anyone to sit around online and type "why did he what did and when did he" blah blah, you are either drivign a camry all day or you have never really syepped into the realm of high performance street cars.

Because if you ever had, you would have put the pedal to the metal and got a bit of speed under your tyres.

There is no "safe place" to go fast, hell, there is no safe place to go slow - it's all a calculated risk - you look ahead, you evaluate the situaiton at the moment you hit the gas and get on it.

You focus and pay attention, but if something is going to happen, a blowout,, a bump that bottoms the suspension and skips the car across the road or a suspension tie rod lets go etc - it's gogn to happen and you just hope it doesn't.

I am a little set back by the anger and hatred and downright holier than thou comments made in this thread.

He didn't "deserve to die" - he simply paid the price for giving it stick. There is a big difference between the 2. It is also something many of us expose our selves to when we get in our cars to drive to work alongside a 40ton truck at 60mph or on a country road at 150mph.

Either is not that far fetched of a scenario to experience.

well if his skills were up to the demands he had asked the car to do then wouldnt u think hed still be alive? he asked more than he could give, unless he hit a bump or something out of his control to lose the car? Who knows but he should have been more careful... and not been going 250 on backroad!

What is wrong with a blast to 250 (which is probably an exageration anyway) - it is not that fast in the grand scheme of things... if 250 was such a big deal then why not ban all fast cars and bikes forth with and end the debate forever.

...indeed, very well said Paul, after my last comment i decided not to furthermore post in here but u fully understood - and posted - what i´m thinking personally... :!:

could elaborate myself in full detail but i think it´s all said now...

AS RC45 said ... And nothing more to add except: who does not understand that is (in my opinion) not a true (super)car enthusiast.

Uhm i dont think so I mean majority of the ferrari formula car drivers did die at the steering wheel of the ferrari and enzo took no blame he sais himself that its no the driver that used to win races but the car. Until his death that was the issue ferrari drivers dieing until schumacher came along he's beenbehind the steering wheel of the beast for 10 yrs now.

RIP :(


http://www.giornaledivimercate.it/fo...img_243694.jpg http://www.giornaledivimercate.it/fo...img_243630.jpg

:cry: sad sight indeed, incredible wreck

Where did you get that info?

Damn, actually seeing the man that died and the car he was traveling in really puts things into perspecive... :( :|

:arrow: www.giornaledivimercate.it , it's a local newspaper

Thanx!
So is there any new information on what actually happened?