View Full Version : Day of Terror
BADMIHAI
03-11-2004, 06:38 PM
LONDON (CP) - The terrorist bombings that killed more than 190 people in Madrid represent a barbaric assault on Spanish democracy, world leaders declared Thursday.
The rush-hour bombings struck trains and rail stations in the Spanish capital three days before national elections. The Spanish government blamed the Basque separatist group ETA, but the leader of an ETA-linked Basque party denied that the outlawed organization was involved. Sympathy for Spain poured in from capitals worldwide, led by Spain's partners in the 15-nation European Union.
"There is a general election due in Spain on Sunday. What happened today is a declaration of war on democracy," European Parliament President Pat Cox said in the legislature in Strasbourg, France. "Let Sunday show that Spanish democracy is determined to overcome terrorism."
European Commission President Romano Prodi called the attacks "ferocious and senseless."
"This is not a political act, it is a criminal act against defenceless people . . . a perverse act of terrorists," Prodi said of the bombings that also injured more than 1,200 people.
In Ottawa, Foreign Affairs Minister Bill Graham called the attacks a tragedy.
"Canadians are appalled by these senseless attacks against innocent people and join me in expressing our profound condolences to the families of the victims," Graham said in a statement. "There cannot be any justification whatsoever for terrorism. We condemn these attacks in the strongest possible terms and hope that the perpetrators will be brought to justice."
The United States, Britain and Russia emphasized that the attacks demonstrated the need to toughen international resolve against terrorist organizations.
French border police tightened security Thursday between France and Spain following the bombings. Police stopped people on foot and searched cars and other vehicles, creating traffic jams at several checkpoints between the two countries, including Hendaye and Behobie. At the Biriatou border crossing, heavy trucks were stopped for security checks.
The French Basque region has long been a haven for militant Spanish Basques, although it has largely been spared the violence that has scarred the Spanish Basque provinces, just across the border.
French President Jacques Chirac condemned the Madrid attacks and pledged "solidarity with Spain in fighting against this abominable scourge."
"Nothing ever justifies barbarity," Chirac said. "Democracies must be - and will be - united in combatting this without weakness."
British Prime Minister Tony Blair, who along with Aznar has strongly supported the invasion and occupation of Iraq, said the Madrid massacre "underlines the threat that we all continue to face from terrorism in many countries and why we all must work together internationally to safeguard our peoples against such attacks and defeat terrorism."
In a condolence message to Spanish King Juan Carlos, Russian President Vladimir Putin said: "This senseless, barbaric action has again shown that the world community must even more resolutely combat terrorism. Today, as never before, the entire civilized world must unite in the fight against this evil."
In Washington, National Security Council spokesman Sean McCormack said President George W. Bush called Spanish Prime Minister Jose Maria Aznar "to express his solidarity with the Spanish people at this difficult time."
The news knocked share prices on stock markets worldwide, most severely in Europe. Germany's DAX index sank 3.1 per cent, France's CAC-40 fell 2.6 per cent and Britain's FTSE 100 dipped 1.9 per cent. In New York, the benchmark Dow Jones and Nasdaq lost half a percentage point within the first 30 minutes of trading.
The sports world appeared less moved. The European governing body for soccer, UEFA, announced that four UEFA Cup fixtures involving Spanish pro clubs would go ahead Thursday night. It said a minute's silence by fans would better honour the dead than postponements.
Everywhere, world leaders stressed that they shared Spain's pain and fury.
Irish Justice Minister Michael McDowell, whose country holds the rotating EU presidency, said the attacks were "perpetrated by cowards who are morally and ethically bankrupt."
"The European Union stands in solidarity with the Spanish people at this time of great shock and terrible sadness. You are not alone," McDowell said.
Italian President Carlo Azeglio Ciampi denounced the attacks as "abominable violence that wounds every principle of civil existence," but said they would promote European unity against terrorism.
In Berlin, Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder said he was "deeply dismayed by this inhuman attack." His government offered to send Spain specialists from its Federal Criminal Office, the country's equivalent of the FBI.
Pope John Paul called the attacks abominable.
"The Holy Father reiterates his firm and absolute disapproval of such actions that offend God, violate the fundamental right to life and undermine peaceful coexistence," said a message from the Vatican to Spanish church authorities.
Political representatives of the Irish Republican Army, which traditionally backs ETA's campaign, also condemned the attacks.
"This is an appalling act. It is wrong and those involved should stop," said Gerry Adams, leader of the IRA-linked Sinn Fein party, who has forged close links with Herri Batasuna, ETA's political affiliate.
Condemnation of the bombings came from around the globe. Japanese Foreign Minister Yoriko Kawaguchi called the attacks "unforgivable," while in Chile, President Ricardo Lagos predicted that Spain's population would prove resilient to the horror.
"Our Spanish friends will have to react the way they know - with the unity of the people. We should not let ourselves be intimidated," Lagos wrote to Aznar.
ROBERT BARR
© The Canadian Press, 2003
jon_s
03-11-2004, 06:43 PM
Man, I was watching that on the TV, nasty stuff indeed.
I seriously hope that nothing like that happens in London, as I am always going into and out of Londn at peak times........prime terriorist time :? It is always in the back of my mind.
Of course I saw that thanks to CNN and other channels' "braking news"... crazy day for sure... of course compared to that, the 3700 Swiss Francs I have to pay to fix a stranger's car is not that bad...
corvette97
03-11-2004, 06:45 PM
hope god that never happens again in any place
jon_s
03-11-2004, 06:46 PM
of course compared to that, the 3700 Swiss Francs I have to pay to fix a stranger's car is not that bad...
ditto for the shit lol and the flat tyre!
OK - now that Spain has had its 3/11 - maybe some of you folks will begin to realize that these guys are NOT TO BE NEGOTIATED WITH.
The tragedy of the life lost is a horrifying "I told you so" - let's hope that we can UNITE and CRUSH these animals.
Don't blame me for what I'm going to say next, but to me this is a sign from those assholes saying: "This is what happens if you help the US."
No - it is a statement saying "We know you don't have the nads to come after us - so we will terrorise you."
How naive to think you can "hug these people into submission".
corvette97
03-11-2004, 08:15 PM
you are a bit naive for your age I think.....
LOL LOL :lol: :lol:
LOL, I know your intentions are good RC45 but how the hell are you going to crush these animals????
you are a bit naive for your age I think..... :wink:
the terror network got terorist cells over the whole world and even if you demolish the whole middle east it wouldnt stop those cells that are operating out of your backyard....
It only makes them more dedicated on hurting the US and the ones supporting you... :(
One thing that could have helped your plan to stop terror is pulling your support to Israel back, that would help more in stoping terror than your crushing way... :wink:
BTW I`m not saying that the whole middle east are terrorists...
I guess your plan to not seek cells out and kill members of terrorist groups - but rather negotiate with them and pamper to their "demands" is a much better way.
I laughed at your eurotrash peacenicks when you all came to South Africa and told us to "love the terrorists - embrace the terrorists - they are really peaceful at heart"
Well we didn't - we searched out and killed terrorists where they hid in cells in Botswana, Mocambique, Zimbabwe, Angola and further ....
Know what the end results was? Slowly but surely they began t realize - Come to the negotiating table with out weapons or you will be killed.
And the final outcome?
White majority governement was rolled over to Black majority government without a civil war and relatively little bloodshed.
THE ONLY TIME THIS HAS EVER HAPPENED IN AFRICA!!!!!
But you know what - I really am close to not giving a flying fuck about eurotrash any more - much the view I used to have when still in South Africa.
Maybe you fuckers need another war in your own fucking backyard to REMEMBER that you can only protect DEMOCRACY with a GUN when DEMOCRACY is being THREATENED with a GUN.
You save the NEGOTIATIONS for after the fightings over and you have FORCED everyone to the table.
Good luck - you fuckers are gonna need it.
Now guys, not another time please...
Now guys, not another time please...
..actually - that's what y'all don't get - until you wake up and smell the bloodshed - you will always be "terrorized".
Either way - I am done, and will just have BBC world service tell me when the next event went down.
Maybe you misunderstood me.. I don't want to criticize your opinion or anybody else's.. but JW is simply not a political or sociological forum.. just a car forum... and we prefer to keep such discussions at a minimum.. and having already had some 10 pages about that this week, a second one would be to much maybe ;)
rossc83
03-11-2004, 08:48 PM
If this is indeed the work of Islamic terrorists, what on earth are they trying to achieve. Bombing innocent people randomly surely must disgust true Muslims everywhere. Sooner or later the Muslim world will turn on these madmen. That is the only way this will ever stop.
Dragging Israel into this topic is absurd. These lunatics couldn't care less about anybody, Christians, Jews, Hindu (Bali bombing) or even fellow Muslims (Marriot Hotel, Jakata).
The world would be a better place with NO religions. ( Yes I'm an Atheist, and proud of it - never do any harm to anybody)
Kangaroo Boy
03-11-2004, 09:17 PM
Terroism is for Pussys.I hope that never happends in Australia.Our Country knows what spain is going through.We had the Bali bombings a year ago,an act of evil.
Don't worry, I can understand that such discussions always leads to hard words and sometimes hard feelings between members... and that's another point that makes me dislike political debates in car forums :D
As always I prefer not to close right away... I just wonder where this discussion will be when Jabba will log on tomorrow...
geekdiggy
03-11-2004, 09:35 PM
oh here we go again...
BADMIHAI
03-11-2004, 09:48 PM
OK - now that Spain has had its 3/11 - maybe some of you folks will begin to realize that these guys are NOT TO BE NEGOTIATED WITH.
The tragedy of the life lost is a horrifying "I told you so" - let's hope that we can UNITE and CRUSH these animals.
As much as I dislike you, I must agree with you on this one. Those motherfukers must be stopped. But we're not even sure who did it. What if it was the U.S. trying to get the E.U. to join the war? Maybe they want a new crusade. And by "these animals" I assume you're referring to muslims. Am I right? I know that what I'm about to say is racist, so don't read it if you don't want to be offended. Muslims (at least 80% of them) hate us. Even the Koran tells them not to stop until they subdue and convert everyone. What do you guys think we should do? As RC already implied, you can't negociate with them. I won't express my oppinion on this matter any further, because you'd see me as the next Hitler.
Another reason why these fuckers are so powerful is the U.S. government who negociated with them when they hijacked U.S. planes, and have them millions of dollars in trade for the passangers. Israel, on the other hand, didn't negociate with them. They sent in a team of 5 people, which eliminated all the terrorists, and saved all the passangers.
corvette97
03-11-2004, 10:43 PM
BADMIHAI, we are going to get a long just fine :wink:
BADMIHAI
03-11-2004, 10:58 PM
I expect a invitation when you two love birds tie the knot..... :wink:
Sorry, I'm already married to your sister. :shock:
Just playing... :wink:
I don't have a problem with you, brembo. You're cool by my book.
corvette97
03-11-2004, 11:01 PM
u too brembo :wink:
:fist: hahahahaha
You can't treat violence with violence.
And Brembo is right, first solve the problem in Isreal.
You are so wrong it is pitiful - you can ONLY treat violence with violence - and when you neighbours begin to get blown to bits and their blood and guts rain down on your front lawn, and your friends limbs litter your backyard, you will change your tune.
As much as I enjoy a good debate - and am passionate about defending Freedom and the Democratic process - I feel my passion for the free and hatred of the tyrannical (*1*) is too intense for some - and I am not going to apologize to anyone for wearing my heart on my sleeve, but may refrain from participating in future exchanges concerned with these events.
I witnessed too many lives lost in the South African struggle - innocents killed by factional terrorists planting car bombs, throwing pipe bombs with nails attached into churches filled with worshippers etc... all wasted... because the real negotiating was only able to start in ernest once these fighters were all killed or driven out... or they put away their bombs and started talking... which they did because their violence was not allowed to go by unchallenged.
I have no time for a so-called freedom fighter that has to resort to terrorizing innocents to make a point.
If you are too cowardly to come to the negotiating table without guns - you are never going to be able to participate in a democracy where freedom is valued - and I will not allow you to prosper... and will passionately support any and all efforts to hunt you down and kill you.
Period.
So many here are of the opinion that if you leave the situation alone and do nothing, perhaps these folks will leave you alone and not draw you into their conflict by killing your people - THAT is the naive view of the next victim...
...but rest assured when they bring the blood-letting to your home town - I will have empathy for the lost souls - but NOT sympathy - and will say "we told you so".
On that note - let's hope no-one we know get's hit the next time round.
(*1*) Note I am not racially classifying tyrants - the current enemy just happens to be predominantly Muslim - but that could as easily switch to Catholics if they take to terror tactics - Wait that's Northern Island...
ported_head
03-12-2004, 05:57 AM
absolutely agree with the dude. there is no point sweet talking with these bastards. the only way to stop is to wipe them through the face of the earth. i used to be pro-talks, but not anymore. i lost quite a few people in the Bombings in mumbai a few years back, as well as a couple of people that i happened to know in kashmir.
what really bugs me is that people are starting to become content with it. My country's bastardly govt stillresorts to talks and smiling faces and handshakes, keeping the media happy..and themselves. while a few lives are nearly lost everday on the border states. and quite afew others that go unreported.
rabid rantings again, all i really wanted to say is it's about time people started putting the terrorists asses on fire, Muslim or not.
stradale
03-12-2004, 08:13 AM
About ETA, they NEVER did an action on the people of spain. All their actions were political; shooting some cops, soldiers, prominent political figures, ...
When they planted a bomb somewhere, they allways called 30mins before detonation. Just enough time to evacuate the building, but not enough to search the building and dismantle the bomb. They allways called right after the attack claiming it.
You've got to be kidding me. You almost make them look sincere! Have you forgotten the bombs on the Costa Brava (targeting tourism and therefore the economy), the slaying of judges and coucil members, which are at the heart of democracy? Besides, random people have indeed been killed and wounded in actions by ETA.
The idea of fighting terrorist cells and networks appeals to me, but is not as simple as it seems. There are many practical problems that aren't easy to overcome. I'll give an example of that. To prevent terrorist attacks by arresting the suspected members is very hard if you want the trial to be succesful. We have seen this in our country. The evidence on which the allegations are based is usually either very slim or cannot be disclosed. Convicting them or for that matter even having them detained pending investigation on that basis leads to conflicts with human rights. Violating human rights is not the way we deal with things here and it should remain that way. You just can't treat one group of suspects differently from another. That is the very core of justice.
Furthermore, fighting terrorism can not be without efforts to solving the problems that lie on the basis of what makes it possible for terrorist movements to find recruits. They're not all made to at gunpoint, you know. Solving these problems is an even bigger task than dealing with the terrorists. Whole societies are involved in that. When you want to settle differences between societies, guns only worsen things. These things need to be dealt with to ensure long-term safety, fighting terrorists is only a short-term policy. So what I'm saying is, you can't focus on one or the other, you need address them both with equal urgency.
LotusGT1
03-12-2004, 11:40 AM
ETA targeted tourist in both Benidorm and Alicante. How's that for not attacking citizens ?
SPEEDKILLAR
03-12-2004, 01:16 PM
DAMN, those poor people, who can somebody actually do this... :cry:
They had nothing to do with it, I all blame It on those damn selfish politicians(not all of them). They take decisions without thinking about it, I mean why is there
terrorism in the first place, I'll tell you why, on this world there are bastards that
decide to invade any country they want, steel Its resources and then put a fuckhead at the head of the country so they indirectly can control it and take decisions for it. Don't forget the past where colonisation of a country was seen as a normal thing, well you can't keep stealing from ppl and take decisions for them.
Leave EVERY CULTURE as it is and don't try to change it...
BADMIHAI
03-12-2004, 01:21 PM
http://www.hispeed.rogers.com/bband/feeds/cpfix/xml/world/w03129A.jpg
Thousands of people gather in Vitoria, Spain, to protest the Madrid train bombings. Vitoria is the capital of Spain's autonomous Basque region. (AP/Jon Dimis)
MADRID, Spain (CP) - Investigators on Friday hunted for the bombers who blew up four trains, killing at least 198 people, while Spaniards lit candles and left flowers outside a station and the country mourned the victims of its worst terrorist attack ever.
Authorities blamed Basque separatists for Thursday's stunningly well co-ordinated string of 10 explosions on packed commuter trains, but they also were studying a claim of responsibility by a shadowy group in the name of al-Qaida. The death toll rose overnight from 192 to 198, deputy Justice Minister Rafael Alcala said, adding that 84 bodies remain to be identified.
More than 1,400 people were wounded Thursday as panicked commuters trampled on each other, abandoning their bags and shoes. Train cars were turned into twisted wrecks and platforms were strewn with corpses. Cell phones rang unanswered on the bodies of the dead as frantic relatives tried to call them.
Three days of mourning were declared and campaigning was called off for Spain's general election, but Foreign Minister Ana Palacio pledged that the vote would be held on Sunday as planned.
"This would be the first way to tell terrorists about our determination to go forward and that they will not succeed in their wicked cause," Palacio told Australia's Channel Nine television from Spain.
A major campaign issue was how to deal with ETA, the Basque militant group.
As day broke Friday, television and radio re-ran horrific witness accounts of flaming bodies and other carnage on four morning rush hour trains full of workers and students.
Passengers sobbed, lit candles and left flowers at Madrid's Atocha station, which was the first one hit in the attacks, and trains had to roll past wreckage left on the track.
No Canadians were known to be among the dead or injured, a Foreign Affairs spokesman said from Ottawa, but officials were continuing to check.
All the television stations placed a small red and yellow Spanish flag with a black sash in the corner of the screen. Commuter trains also travelled with black cloth on the engine cars.
Spain's benchmark Ibex-35 stock index dropped two per cent at the opening bell.
The government has called countrywide rallies for Friday evening, with Prime Minister Jose Maria Aznar and other senior officials leading one in Madrid. Millions are expected to attend around the country.
The attack occurred exactly 2½ years after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks in the United States. It also was Europe's worst since the 1988 bombing of a Pan Am jetliner over Lockerbie, Scotland, that killed 270 people.
"March 11, 2004, now holds its place in the history of infamy," Aznar said Thursday.
U.S. Homeland Security Secretary Tom Ridge said Friday he could not confirm whether al-Qaida had a hand in the bombings.
"There is no specific information" available that would point to the identities of the perpetrators, he told reporters during a visit to Thailand. "There is a lot of speculation."
The 10 backpack bombs exploded in a 15-minute span, starting about 7:39 a.m., local time, on trains along 15 kilometres of commuter line from Santa Eugenia to the Atocha terminal, a bustling hub for subway, commuter and long-distance trains just south of the famed Prado Museum. Police also found and detonated three other bombs.
"An act of barbaric terrorism has engulfed Spain with profound pain, repulsion and anger," King Juan Carlos said on national television.
Worst hit was a double-decker train at El Pozo station, where two bombs killed 70 people, fire department inspector Juan Redondo said. One corpse was blown onto the roof.
At the Santa Eugenia station, "there was one carriage totally blown apart. People were scattered all over the platforms. I saw legs and arms. I won't forget this ever. I've seen horror," said Enrique Sanchez, an ambulance worker.
The e-mail claim of responsibility, signed by the shadowy Brigade of Abu Hafs al-Masri and received by the London-based Arabic newspaper Al-Quds al-Arabi, said the brigade's "death squad" had penetrated "one of the pillars of the crusade alliance, Spain."
"This is part of settling old accounts with Spain, the crusader, and America's ally in its war against Islam," the claim said.
Spain had backed the U.S.-led war on Iraq despite domestic opposition, and many al-Qaida-linked terrorists have been captured in Spain or were believed to have operated from here.
Spain's government is studying the claim but still believes ETA is more likely responsible, a senior official in Aznar's office said.
The United States believes Al-Masri sometimes claims to be acting on behalf of al-Qaida, and it later turns out they were not. For example, they took credit for blackouts in Canada and the United States, and later in London, last year.
If the attack was carried out by ETA, it could signal a radical and lethal change of strategy for the group that has largely targeted police and politicians in its decades-long fight for a separate Basque homeland.
But after police found a stolen van with seven detonators and the Arabic-language tape parked in a suburb near where the stricken trains originated, Interior Minister Angel Acebes said: "I have just given instructions to the security forces not to rule out any line of investigation."
A top Basque politician, Arnold Otegi, denied ETA was behind the blasts and blamed "Arab resistance," noting Spain's support for the Iraq war.
The government said ETA had tried a similar attack on Christmas Eve, placing bombs on two trains bound for a Madrid station that was not hit Thursday.
The Interior Ministry said tests showed the explosives used in the attacks were a kind of dynamite normally used by ETA.
The bombers used titadine, a kind of compressed dynamite also found in a bomb-laden van intercepted last month as it headed for Madrid, a source at Aznar's office said, speaking on condition of anonymity. Officials blamed ETA then, too.
In a break with past ETA tactics, there were multiple attacks and no warning. ETA has usually gone after one target at a time and the largest casualty toll was 21 killed in 1987.
ETA has claimed responsibility for more than 800 deaths since 1968.
The United States, Britain and Russia said the attacks demonstrated the need for toughened resolve against terrorists.
Aznar was a staunch supporter of U.S.-led war that ousted Saddam Hussein and Spain sent 1,300 troops to Iraq.
Aznar, who himself survived an ETA car bombing in 1995, will step down when a new government is formed after the elections.
Revulsion over the attack could benefit Aznar's ruling conservative Popular party because of its hardline stance against ETA.
Both the Popular party and the opposition Socialists ruled out talks with ETA during the campaign.
The group - Euskadi ta Askatasuna, or Basque Homeland and Freedom - is believed by police to number perhaps only several dozen hard-core militants who are supported by a wider group of Basque nationalists.
The government had recently expressed cautious optimism that ETA was near defeat after mass arrests, seizures of weapons and explosives, increased cooperation from France and the banning of ETA's purported political front. The number of people killed in ETA attacks dropped to three last year.
DANIEL WOOLLS
© The Canadian Press, 2003
SPEEDKILLAR
03-12-2004, 01:31 PM
I guess your plan to not seek cells out and kill members of terrorist groups - but rather negotiate with them and pamper to their "demands" is a much better way..
I`m not your hug a three nut, and make love not war fool.
And aint saying that we shouldnt seek and destroy the cells that we find, but there will be a terrorist to blow the bomb the day after too.
So maybe we all should get off our high fucking horse and take a look about what we are doing, and why these things happen instead of escalating matters more by going to war cuz some cowboy got a feeling....
I laughed at your eurotrash peacenicks when you all came to South Africa and told us to "love the terrorists - embrace the terrorists - they are really peaceful at heart"..
If this is directed towards me, you are just more arrogant than whats good for you.
Who the hell are you to tell me that I embrace terrorists, and calling people eurotrash....
Well we didn't - we searched out and killed terrorists where they hid in cells in Botswana, Mocambique, Zimbabwe, Angola and further ....
And good for you,and this is being done these days too...
Know what the end results was? Slowly but surely they began t realize - Come to the negotiating table with out weapons or you will be killed.....
I totaly agree that we should give them a message, but two wars and thousands of killed people doesnt work.
Do you want to start another two....
Maybe you should try to convince Bushie boy to invade France and Germany as a part of the plan to get rid of terror and eurotrash... :wink:
And the final outcome?
White majority governement was rolled over to Black majority government without a civil war and relatively little bloodshed.
THE ONLY TIME THIS HAS EVER HAPPENED IN AFRICA!!!!!.....
Yes a good thing from my point of view too...
But you know what - I really am close to not giving a flying fuck about eurotrash any more - much the view I used to have when still in South Africa.
I dont think you actually giving a flying fuck about us europeans would change our lifes much....
Maybe you fuckers need another war in your own fucking backyard to REMEMBER that you can only protect DEMOCRACY with a GUN when DEMOCRACY is being THREATENED with a GUN..
Dont you tell us to remember the wars, we do remember them...
And whats up with all the fuckers and eurotrash stuff dude, no need to start name calling.
You save the NEGOTIATIONS for after the fightings over and you have FORCED everyone to the table.
Good luck - you fuckers are gonna need it.
And how are you gonna get thousands upon thousands of independent terrorist cells to give up on their only goal :to hurt the west or whatever their cause is???
Well this fucker is thinking that none of this would have happened if your army had gotten their ass out of the saudi wich is considered holy ground for the muslims.. :wink:
I`m sure you will be back with bigger words and more creative ways of using the word fuck, and I will read all your words.... :D
Agree with you brembo, watch out or 666fast wil bother you with BS :roll:
Even If they were there the first place they at least could acted less aggresive, I mean they knew that a lot of ppl would become angry and would react in an aggresive way. But there insolencent behaviour caused all this. RC45 when will you see that being more peaceful is the only way,
as I once said, you have to help the ppl and the ppl will bring down the terrorism Itself in an efficient way, and that way is the'll stop being members of those terrorist groups...
BADMIHAI
03-12-2004, 01:44 PM
Even If they were there the first place they at least could acted less aggresive, I mean they knew that a lot of ppl would become angry and would react in an aggresive way. But there insolencent behaviour caused all this. RC45 when will you see that being more peaceful is the only way,
as I once said, you have to help the ppl and the ppl will bring down the terrorism Itself in an efficient way, and that way is the'll stop being members of those terrorist groups...
Now I know what RC means when he says "eurotrash". You, sir, are gay. You think they'll stop if you leave them alone? They'll come back stronger. They need to be killed. That's the only viable way of stopping them.
Jabba
03-12-2004, 01:50 PM
Don't take any notice of him badmihai.... he is fast becoming the official JW "idiot"...(custom title in the works I think)...I think he is just looking for attention by making ridiculous outrageous posts after his last gender change stunt was stopped.
BADMIHAI
03-12-2004, 02:07 PM
Don't take any notice of him badmihai.... he is fast becoming the official JW "idiot"...(custom title in the works I think)...I think he is just looking for attention by making ridiculous outrageous posts after his last gender change stunt was stopped.
:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
I just noticed he/she went through a sex change. It looks like the only thing they forgot to give her is balls. :lol:
SPEEDKILLAR
03-12-2004, 02:15 PM
Don't take any notice of him badmihai.... he is fast becoming the official JW "idiot"...(custom title in the works I think)...I think he is just looking for attention by making ridiculous outrageous posts after his last gender change stunt was stopped.
Man in the first place that gender change was just for fun, and If you "think" my post are ridiculous, lets wait and see what aggresive behaviour will bring you, maybe the next target is london...
And If I am an idiot, maybe you're an old fool
Jabba
03-12-2004, 02:20 PM
And If I am an idiot, maybe you're an old fool
Yes I probably am a fool not to have banned you already...still better late than never...
SPEEDKILLAR
03-12-2004, 02:22 PM
And If I am an idiot, maybe you're an old fool
Yes I probably am a fool not to have banned you already...still better late than never...
You now why I said that, because you guys react in an aggresive way,
I think you guys just can't handle it that what I'm saying is the truth.
And don't forget this is internet, ppl don't know each other, calling each other names means nothing
SPEEDKILLAR
03-12-2004, 02:31 PM
Damn, I thought this was a place ppl could say their opinions, and everytime somebody says
something you don't like, you choose the easy way and bann him without any
warning or decent explanation
you choose the easy way and bann him without any
warning or decent explanation
I think we are not talking about the same forum :?:
SPEEDKILLAR
03-12-2004, 02:33 PM
you choose the easy way and bann him without any
warning or decent explanation
I think we are not talking about the same forum :?:
What do you mean?
I have to go now, but I'll be back in an hour... :wink:
We never banned somebody just because we didn't share his opinions.. and there is always a warning (not for serious cases of major spamming.. but we had just a couple)
SPEEDKILLAR
03-12-2004, 02:39 PM
Well Jabba then you don't know me, I'm not a hippie, anti-socialist,.....
War can be for some problems the solution, but Its not the only one
Jabba
03-12-2004, 02:46 PM
I have to go now, but I'll be back in an hour... :wink:
Or not as the case maybe... :wink:
If you are going to be banned then it will for being a general ass as opposed to your views....
I am trying to find a suitable forum for mixed up people that you might prefer to this one.
Jabba
03-12-2004, 02:53 PM
War can be for some problems the solution, but Its not the only one
And now it seems you are doing a "U-Turn" if this is a UK term it means "going back on yourself"
Can you explain to me then when war would be a solution and also what the problem would be to justify it in that case ?
bmagni
03-12-2004, 03:48 PM
pretty sad day
BADMIHAI
03-12-2004, 03:52 PM
I hope we didn't lose any of our members in those tragic accidents, and I hope they did't lose anyone.
SPEEDKILLAR
03-12-2004, 04:18 PM
War can be for some problems the solution, but Its not the only one
And now it seems you are doing a "U-Turn" if this is a UK term it means "going back on yourself"
Can you explain to me then when war would be a solution and also what the problem would be to justify it in that case ?
War is the only solution when the danger is inevitable, and when something brings the whole world in danger, like World War 1 and WW2,
and when the majority agrees to go to war. Explain me Jabba how you go to war against terrorists, there everywhere...
yg60m
03-12-2004, 04:25 PM
I have the feeling the weather is hot these days on JW :|
I join BADMIHAI and hope that nobody lost a friend or a member of his familly and i say too it was a very sad day, I hope we will soon know for sure who is the author of this tragedy
ps : i heard on french news that Georges Bush offer his condolence to Spain and that a few hours later he said on a meeting that they had a wonderful day :?: is it true ?
Cornutu
03-12-2004, 08:15 PM
"Explain me Jabba how you go to war against terrorists, there everywhere..."
The same way you get rid of any disease. Kill one, then another, then another...
Cornutu
03-12-2004, 08:19 PM
Another thing, it doesn't matter what country you are from terrorism affects us all. Cut out the our country knows better BS. Get your head out of your ass, think above your own ego
SPEEDKILLAR
03-13-2004, 06:58 AM
Another thing, it doesn't matter what country you are from terrorism affects us all. Cut out the our country knows better BS. Get your head out of your ass, think above your own ego
Yes I agree that it effects us all, but then we have to agree all and stick together to fight it, and not just one country against the whole world.
SPEEDKILLAR
03-13-2004, 07:02 AM
"Explain me Jabba how you go to war against terrorists, there everywhere..."
The same way you get rid of any disease. Kill one, then another, then another...
Kill 1, then 10 others will rise, and so on and on.
Can't you see that's not the right solution, we have to go to the source and
help the ppl by getting them to join us, the ppl have the power to bring those terrorists down.
BADMIHAI
03-13-2004, 09:47 AM
Can't you see that's not the right solution, we have to go to the source and
help the ppl by getting them to join us, the ppl have the power to bring those terrorists down.
And how are you going to get a bunch of indoctrinated people to join you, especially when they were brought up to hate you? Even if you do, the terrorist factions will not stop.
SPEEDKILLAR
03-13-2004, 09:54 AM
Can't you see that's not the right solution, we have to go to the source and
help the ppl by getting them to join us, the ppl have the power to bring those terrorists down.
And how are you going to get a bunch of indoctrinated people to join you, especially when they were brought up to hate you? Even if you do, the terrorist factions will not stop.
I think you're the one that is indoctrinated, tell me how do you know they were brought to "hate you". That sounds like prejudice...
Jabba
03-13-2004, 10:14 AM
And If I am an idiot, maybe you're an old fool
I just noticed that you are 20 years old and yet you think that as I am 12 years older than you are that I am "old"....I think that just about somes up your mentality...
Every dead or captured terrorist is a step in the right direction....regardless of how many there are...
Lets say someone broke into your car...would you say to the police that there is no point in trying to catch the thief as unless you can catch all of the thieves then theres no point in trying....somehow I doubt it....
I suppose you would like to see the thieves given money so then they would hopefully feel that they didnt need to break into cars anymore....sadly just like terrorists like to kill..... thieves like to steal....its what they do....its sadly how the "real" world works....its always going to be an on-going battle between "good" and "evil"
BADMIHAI
03-13-2004, 10:15 AM
I think you're the one that is indoctrinated, tell me how do you know they were brought to "hate you". That sounds like prejudice...
Jeesh..let me think. I've actually been in a few Muslim countries. I've read about the Koran. I've seen what they're tought in the religious schools. Did I mention those motherfuckers were burning American flags and celebrating on 9/11? Of course, not all of them hate us. That I must admit. However, a good majority of them do hate us.
SPEEDKILLAR
03-13-2004, 10:22 AM
I think you're the one that is indoctrinated, tell me how do you know they were brought to "hate you". That sounds like prejudice...
Jeesh..let me think. I've actually been in a few Muslim countries. I've read about the Koran. I've seen what they're tought in the religious schools. Did I mention those motherfuckers were burning American flags and celebrating on 9/11? Of course, not all of them hate us. That I must admit. However, a good majority of them do hate us.
Do you ask yourself why they hate you??????
SPEEDKILLAR
03-13-2004, 10:26 AM
And If I am an idiot, maybe you're an old fool
I just noticed that you are 20 years old and yet you think that as I am 12 years older than you are that I am "old"....I think that just about somes up your mentality...
Every dead or captured terrorist is a step in the right direction....regardless of how many there are...
Lets say someone broke into your car...would you say to the police that there is no point in trying to catch the thief as unless you can catch all of the thieves then theres no point in trying....somehow I doubt it....
I suppose you would like to see the thieves given money so then they would hopefully feel that they didnt need to break into cars anymore....sadly just like terrorists like to kill..... thieves like to steal....its what they do....its sadly how the "real" world works....its always going to be an on-going battle between "good" and "evil"
Yes, It is a step in the right direction, but while we kill one, they kill 100 of innocent ppl. There must be an other way...I know this sounds corny but this is mine opinion.
yg60m
03-13-2004, 10:33 AM
Ain't you tired of this discussion ? :?:
I try to stay out of these topics because it's endless ...
Jabba
03-13-2004, 10:55 AM
Do you ask yourself why they hate you??????
Yes it is a fanatical interpretation of the Koran thats been hi-jacked by muslim extremists....basically anyone not following their strict code of religion should be killed or severely punished....as demonstrated by the Taliban...
I for one am very pleased that the one global ultra power is the United States that are the "policeman" of the world defending my freedom and allowing me to live as I choose to...I cant even imagine what it must have been like to live in a country where not growing a beard is a punishable offence...let alone televison, music and any form or western technology being banned....a woman being publicly executed for having sex before marriage...etc...etc...etc
You may think that this would be a better world for you to live in....and you are very lucky to have such a "choice" which is exactly what we are trying to defend in the first place.
SPEEDKILLAR
03-13-2004, 11:03 AM
Do you ask yourself why they hate you??????
Yes it is a fanatical interpretation of the Koran thats been hi-jacked by muslim extremists....basically anyone not following their strict code of religion should be killed or severely punished....as demonstrated by the Taliban...
I for one am very pleased that the one global ultra power is the United States that are the "policeman" of the world defending my freedom and allowing me to live as I choose to...I cant even imagine what it must have been like to live in a country where not growing a beard is a punishable offence...let alone televison, music and any form or western technology being banned....a woman being publicly executed for having sex before marriage...
You may think that this would be a better world for you to live in....and you are very lucky to have such a "choice" which is exactly what we are trying to defend in the first place.
Well nice said, you have some individuals that take it too seriously, because their illiterate, they don't understand it and make up their own rules, but I still don't see how war is the sollution when their everywhere.
I still stick to the point that getting the ppl step by step on our side, by showing them our good intentions and not invading their culture and religion, we could weaken those terrorists.
BADMIHAI
03-13-2004, 11:13 AM
I still stick to the point that getting the ppl step by step on our side, by showing them our good intentions and not invading their culture and religion, we could weaken those terrorists.
Sorry, mate, but we already invaded their culture and their lands. The was has been declared. We can't back out now. Maybe you'll change your mind if they repeated what they did in Madrid, in Brussels. I really hope that such a thing will never happen again, but it's most likely unevitable.
Jabba
03-13-2004, 11:18 AM
[quote=SPEEDKILLAR]
Do you ask yourself why they hate you??????
I still stick to the point that getting the ppl step by step on our side, by showing them our good intentions and not invading their culture and religion, we could weaken those terrorists.
I am sure there are some that could possibly listen to a voice of reason but sadly when you have terrorists like the ones that flew the jet airliners full of innocent civilians into the World Trade Centre believing that this was their gateway to paradise with 88 virgins waiting for them...then I doubt somehow whether they would interested in coming over to our "side"
SPEEDKILLAR
03-13-2004, 11:53 AM
[quote=SPEEDKILLAR]
Do you ask yourself why they hate you??????
I still stick to the point that getting the ppl step by step on our side, by showing them our good intentions and not invading their culture and religion, we could weaken those terrorists.
I am sure there are some that could possibly listen to a voice of reason but sadly when you have terrorists like the ones that flew the jet airliners full of innocent civilians into the World Trade Centre believing that this was their gateway to paradise with 88 virgins waiting for them...then I doubt somehow whether they would interested in coming over to our "side"
Then I doubt If they will be scared by millitary actions...
I find this a real tough and sensitive point to continue talking about It,
I think now that's all part of our lives and we should all try not to be consumed by hate, but keep one enjoying life(corny, I know)
callen
03-13-2004, 12:33 PM
"chop off its head and the giant will fall" if osama can be caught, then i think this would be a giant leap in the right direction. I understand that by no means will this stop terrorism(defined by "the systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion"). Terrorism has been around for ever. when the english raped, stole, and pillaged from the scottish in feudal times this was terrorism. hitler was a terrorist. Ghangis Khan was a terrorist. neways the only way to defeat such organizations is to successfully decimate its leadership. if u dont have anyone to train u and tell u "kill these mofos and u can fuck ur brains out in heaven" or whatever they believe in, then we are gold. now as much as we are told that the USA is our 'global policing faction' thats semi bullshit. what in the fuck were u bums doin in iraq besides wasting money and time. we all know that there are much bigger fish to fry(still many problems in africa , specific countries i am unsure of and dont want to spend the time to research; with their warlords and civil wars.) there are reports of the taliban slowly creeping back into power as the money hungry bush admin pillage the iraqi economy. money is the root of all evil and as much as i dont want to believe it, the decisions of our "western" leaders have in a way made these terrorists stronger. i think things are now only goin to get worse before they get better. I feel this way because who is goin to join the "global policeman" mr bush after his fuckup in iraq(and his dads fuck up 10 yrs before, their mistakes in africa that decade, and to add salt to t he wound, in vietnam.) and u americans wonder why us "stupid igloo building, snows all yr round up there and they cant shovel themselves out" canadians dont support ur governments bone fuck decisions. get a clue and get a real leader. or maybe some other country should take over for bush and his 'police duties' i am sure most other countries could do a better job, probably even china!(or not i dunno but u get my point) :cry:
I find this a real tough and sensitive point to continue talking about It,
I think now that's all part of our lives and we should all try not to be consumed by hate, but keep one enjoying life(corny, I know)
...maybe if you just light up another joint there waffle-boy... "let's see. it's gotta be Tuesday so let's go make some friends with the terrorists.. I am sure they are really nice folks - maybe we can teach them knitting..."
...maybe if you just light up another joint there waffle-boy... "let's see. it's gotta be Tuesday so let's go make some friends with the terrorists.. I am sure they are really nice folks - maybe we can teach them knitting..."
So far the really mature comments of a 36 yo.
You sir are the dumbest fucktard ever -- no I mean EVER to ACK a SND from my TCP stack... :roll: ;)
First off - the above is an example of sarcasm - and secondly, if you pulled your stupid head out of your ARSE long enough to catch a dope-free-breath you would be able to make the implied connection between that comment, this discussion, you peaceniks and the pot thread.... -- you can assemble 5 or more apparently random thoughts and unconventionally mentally link them together - can't you?
My god - the "future" of the world appears to be in the hands of some of dumbest muthafuckers to ever drag a knuckle over the graduation podium - does any school system teach general knowledge, comprehension and life skills... ??? anywhere?
:)
I am sure there is Russian insult that appropriatly summarises my response in 3 words or less... lemme go check that website... :P
Jabba
03-13-2004, 03:46 PM
...maybe if you just light up another joint there waffle-boy... "let's see. it's gotta be Tuesday so let's go make some friends with the terrorists.. I am sure they are really nice folks - maybe we can teach them knitting..."
So far the really mature comments of a 36 yo.
You sir are the dumbest fucktard ever -- no I mean EVER to ACK a SND from my TCP stack... :roll: ;)
First off - the above is an example of sarcasm - and secondly, if you pulled your stupid head out of your ARSE long enough to catch a dope-free-breath you would be able to make the implied connection between that comment, this discussion, you peaceniks and the pot thread.... -- you can assemble 5 or more apparently random thoughts and unconventionally mentally link them together - can't you?
My god - the "future" of the world appears to be in the hands of some of dumbest muthafuckers to ever drag a knuckle over the graduation podium - does any school system teach general knowledge, comprehension and life skills... ??? anywhere?
:)
I am sure there is Russian insult that appropriatly summarises my response in 3 words or less... lemme go check that website... :P
Looks like RC45 gets the last post on this one.
vBulletin® v3.8.7, Copyright ©2000-2025, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.