Iraqi Constitution & Bill of Rights...

[RC45]

So - any other pro-Iraqi war supporters gladdened by the vindication of our support of the overthrow of Saddam Hussein?

Seems that after all the UK and USA were not trying to "invade Iraq to occupy and pillage" the country.... but were simply trying to oust a violent and dangerour dictatorial tyrant....

These are pretty powerful words in the preamble to the Iraqi Constitution...


LAW OF ADMINISTRATION FOR THE STATE OF IRAQ

FOR THE TRANSITIONAL PERIOD

8 March 2004

PREAMBLE

The people of Iraq, striving to reclaim their freedom, which was usurped by the previous tyrannical regime, rejecting violence and coercion in all their forms, and particularly when used as instruments of governance, have determined that they shall hereafter remain a free people governed under the rule of law.

These people, affirming today their respect for international law, especially having been amongst the founders of the United Nations, working to reclaim their legitimate place among nations, have endeavored at the same time to preserve the unity of their homeland in a spirit of fraternity and solidarity in order to draw the features of the future new Iraq, and to establish the mechanisms aiming, amongst other aims, to erase the effects of racist and sectarian policies and practices.

This Law is now established to govern the affairs of Iraq during the transitional period until a duly elected government, operating under a permanent and legitimate constitution achieving full democracy, shall come into being.


... and if you read the body language - quite an amazing amount of progress tht has been made in such a short time.

Perhaps Saudi Arabia should be next .... ;)


http://news.findlaw.com/usatoday/docs/iraq/30804interimconst.html

http://www.cpa-iraq.org/government/TAL.html

[aliendude012]

short amount of time? I think we have been there far too long. I was a strong opponent of this war going in, and for most of its duration. At the end, and now afterwards, I realize that (intentions good or bad) it was necessary and resulted in a good thing. But come on, we've been there for months, MONTHS, and this is finally happening? I won't tell you they were going about it wrong, because I have no better plan, but really. We founded our own country in less time and we fought an empire with NO help. They fought a single tyrannical leader and his pitiful armies with the help of the two most powerful nations in the world.


Glad to see our time and money has been well spent...

[ahmedgiyab]

US people are SOOOOOOOOOOOO NAIVE!!!!

Saddam wasn't any danger for the world....just people in the US believe the media...as usually... :lol:

OIL was the main issue!!!!

I know...I used to live in Iraq...I've been there since the Gulf war 6 times...

I feel sorry for those who believe in the media... :(

[RC45]

First:

I am not "the US people"- so I know you were not directing that comment at me... I was born and raised half a world away - and use international sources for my news.

Second:

If your age of 24 is correct - your were 10 years old at the time of the Gulf War - hardly a reliable information source. In fact you are tyhe correct age to have been brain-washed into believing what ever drivel you believe.

Third:

Explain how Iraqi oil is the issue? There are many more cheaper sources for oil in the world - Iraq is just ONE of them.

Fourth:

What part of a country NOT cowering in fear from their murdering dictator is not good?


So - lets get the facts then - as you know them - you seem to be so well informed... but I am guessing you wont have any. You will just mouth off violent rantings with no actual facts... Baghdad Bob was your uncle then?

[ahmedgiyab]

I was 12 at 1991 :wink: ...

I was in the Gulf in 1991 (since I'm from Dubai...) so I know what was going on!!!!

I said that I've been there since the Gulf war 6 times (1991-2002)....

Sorry "US people"= 24/7 watch TV... :wink:

You think that the US wants to buy the Iraqi oil???? They steal it... Iraq has the biggest oil reserves in the world...the UN didn't let Saddam to export their oil for over 10 years...so you think that Bush went to Iraq to save the Iraqi people????
Why Bush doesn't help the people in North Korea then???!!! No benefit from that country... 8)

It was all planned because of the oil...where are the chemical weapons then???!!!
With the help of the satelites and other new technologies you can find a matchbox!

Sorry if I hurted anyone...I just hate narrow thinking...!!! :x

[RC45]

I was 12 at 1991 :wink: ...

I was in the Gulf in 1991 (since I'm from Dubai...) so I know what was going on!!!!

I said that I've been there since the Gulf war 6 times (1991-2002)....

Sorry "US people"= 24/7 watch TV... :wink:

You think that the US wants to buy the Iraqi oil???? They steal it... Iraq has the biggest oil reserves in the world...the UN didn't let Saddam to export their oil for over 10 years...so you think that Bush went to Iraq to save the Iraqi people????
Why Bush doesn't help the people in North Korea then???!!! No benefit from that country... 8)

It was all planned because of the oil...where are the chemical weapons then???!!!
With the help of the satelites and other new technologies you can find a matchbox!

Sorry if I hurted anyone...I just hate narrow thinking...!!! :x

Please do a little more research than just listening to Arab propoganda if you want to debate.

Do you honestly think the Middle East holds the only oil reserves in the world?

They are simply the cheapest of the moment - but the Russians, the Canadians and by virtue of the Alaskan fields - the USA have enough oil to be self suffient if need be - it is just not currently cost effective.

Besides - your entire region is gonna be pretty much screwed as the world migrates towards alternative and hybrid fuel solutions... your wealth will drain into the desert sands forever....

BTW - the coalition forces went to Iraq to fist kick Saddams ass out - but a by product of not completely destroying the country (which could have easily bean done) is that the Iraqi people get to try a peaceful form of government.

But what would you know about democracy - you are from Dubai...

[ahmedgiyab]

Iraq has the biggest oil reserve in the WORLD!!! Ask anyone! Or should I send you some sites to check??? :lol:

Yes I'm from Dubai so what??!!! You are sooo naive! For sure you think that we live from oil as well....we go to work on camels... :lol:

Pls do a research...Dubai's oil is only 9% from the income...

Since there is no Hong-Kong anymore...multinational companies came to sattle in Dubai...because of no income taxes (also no VAT)...New for you I guess....

You want to explain to me about oil...I'm doing my third dissertation degree in MBA!

You think we are dumb??!! Check the war of '73...see what happened...the US was screwed...since that year you started to reserve the oil...Texas, Alaska...yeah there is oil in the US....but then why is the US buying form the ME???? To keep it for later...hard times...(learn from the mistakes of 73)...

I don't want to argue on this...I understand that different people...with different opinions... :)

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Sine crazy Saddam was overthrown, there has been more casualties and massacre, and please RC 45 don't say It's not for the oil, do you realy think the Bush administration cares about the ppl in Iraq, don't think so. You really think the
US would spend billion of dollars just to help the poor Iraqis, they want that money back. In fact It's the US who will chose who will be head of certain positions, etc...
I could go on and on, you just have to admit that's how It is. :wink:

[Jabba]

I can see this thread ending up being a bigger "war" then the one with Iraq in the first place :P

I would join in but I am sure RC45 can take care of himself.

[BADMIHAI]

I can see this thread ending up being a bigger "war" then the one with Iraq in the first place :P

I would join in but I am sure RC45 can take care of himself.

Since you're "The Daddy", I think you should come back from time to time change RC's diapers.

That constitution is bull shit, and all the important people will be puppets of the U.S. We all know they did it for OIL, and only RC doesn't want to admit it.

[possessed_beaver]

Sine crazy Saddam was overthrown, there has been more casualties and massacre,

sorry but we use logic and common sence here, want a masacre..
what about the attempted uprising against sadamn...?

tens of thousands, he gassed more people that died on setpember 11,

he was killing major religious factions inside iraq during his rulings, amoung the killings in his OWN FAMILY!!!
i believe he killed one of his family members while drink, and carved them up with a meat slicer....

he is a tool, but removing him is much better for iraq,
ok some ppl got very rich as a result. but alot of people are allowed freedom things we take for granted like the ability to grow long hair..

and u are aparantley a woman.. ya wana list what he done against women someone?

[Jabba]

I can see this thread ending up being a bigger "war" then the one with Iraq in the first place :P

I would join in but I am sure RC45 can take care of himself.

Since you're "The Daddy", I think you should come back from time to time change RC's diapers.



Trying to keep it light hearted....I could say that you are suggesting that the shit comes out of his ass and not his mouth then in that case. This of course isnt the case for everyone here.

[RC45]

Iraq has the biggest oil reserve in the WORLD!!! Ask anyone! Or should I send you some sites to check??? :lol:


Wrong: Saudi Arabia does - at about 25% of the known reserves - Iraq is second with less than 10% of the worlds known reserves.
and only the if you count the Kuwait reserves with the Iraqi reserves...

....and if you take into Canadas reserves - suddenly Iraq is 3rd fiddle...

[I will leave more "reserve" debate for later]

And notice how the worlds oil prices and supply has been just fine even though Iraqi supples never got back to the pre -1991 levels - ever...


Yes I'm from Dubai so what??!!! You are sooo naive! For sure you think that we live from oil as well....we go to work on camels... :lol:

Pls do a research...Dubai's oil is only 9% from the income...

Since there is no Hong-Kong anymore...multinational companies came to sattle in Dubai...because of no income taxes (also no VAT)...New for you I guess....

Fairy jaded view:

Dubai re-invented itself after 1990 - at that time (when you were a 10 year old snot nose) more than 1/3 of revenues were oli based - but as always, things change - and this case there is more money to be made as the "middleman" in various business ventures - so yes only 10% of GDP is directly oil based... however, make no mistake that the oil service and support industry oes not play a major role in the UAE GDP. Trade being import - but I digress - this is not an advertisment for "Move your business to Dubai"... it is about whether the UAE and others should have exclusive access to a peaceful way of life.



You want to explain to me about oil...I'm doing my third dissertation degree in MBA!

I call faker based on your unbalanced view of the world...


You think we are dumb??!! Check the war of '73...see what happened...the US was screwed...since that year you started to reserve the oil...Texas, Alaska...yeah there is oil in the US....but then why is the US buying form the ME???? To keep it for later...hard times...(learn from the mistakes of 73)...

You do know the breakdown behind US oil consumption right? While over half of the oil consumed, is imported, only 15% of these imports come from the Arab world... USA imports more oil from North, Central and South America, than the Middle East... ou did know this... right?


I don't want to argue on this...I understand that different people...with different opinions... :)
So it just that easy - any constitution or peaceful attempt at self-governance in Iraq must be fake and bogus and puppet... One would have thought you would be hapy an Arab neighbour will no longer be a dictator...


Either way - I gotta go visit with clients - lets see if you have anything more substantial to offer by sun down....

[RC45]

I can see this thread ending up being a bigger "war" then the one with Iraq in the first place :P

I would join in but I am sure RC45 can take care of himself.

Since you're "The Daddy", I think you should come back from time to time change RC's diapers.

That constitution is bull shit, and all the important people will be puppets of the U.S. We all know they did it for OIL, and only RC doesn't want to admit it.

Explain - in respectable prose, how that Constitution and Bill of Rights is bul shit? Please do....

And please explain the strategic gain that is to be magically gained by just staning near the Iraqi oil reserves --- you do know that Saddam let the oil production infrastructure get into disrepair while he was raping and illaging - and that Iraq could not ever habe hoped to returm to previous oil production glory without rebuilding that entire infrastructure.... but you knew that... right?

[RC45]

Sine crazy Saddam was overthrown, there has been more casualties and massacre, and please RC 45 don't say It's not for the oil, do you realy think the Bush administration cares about the ppl in Iraq, don't think so. You really think the
US would spend billion of dollars just to help the poor Iraqis, they want that money back. In fact It's the US who will chose who will be head of certain positions, etc...
I could go on and on, you just have to admit that's how It is. :wink:

Wanna open a third front? I am game for battling on all 3 fronts... but then they have to be battle worthy assaults...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Sine crazy Saddam was overthrown, there has been more casualties and massacre, and please RC 45 don't say It's not for the oil, do you realy think the Bush administration cares about the ppl in Iraq, don't think so. You really think the
US would spend billion of dollars just to help the poor Iraqis, they want that money back. In fact It's the US who will chose who will be head of certain positions, etc...
I could go on and on, you just have to admit that's how It is. :wink:

Wanna open a third front? I am game for battling on all 3 fronts... but then they have to be battle worthy assaults...

Even one front is to much for you, you know why, because your vision on
this case is blurred. Why the US and it's coallition partners are in Irak
is only for the black gold. I mean I don't see any chemical weapons,
Blair even said Saddam could use them in a matter of hours, mmmm, they
still didn't found anything did they? They had no reason at all to start the war in the first place, I mean that's why Bush is going to loose against Kerry. Because Bushy, Blairy,... lied.

[aliendude012]

I think this constitution is more or less BS also. I was an opponent of the war from the beginning, because the two main reasons we entered it ended up false. We found no chemical weapons, and there is no link between Hussein and AlQaeda. He had nothing to do with 9/11. Im sure he liked watching it on tv, but no connection whatsoever. Then they decided to call it a liberation of the Iraqi people as a cover for their mistaken allegations in the first place. They killed his sons, and they captured him, which were all good things in my book, but they just stumbled upon them afterwards. It wasn't their original intent. Now we have been there almost a year(maybe more?), and we finally draft a temporary constitution? What have we been doing all this time? Oh yea, giving away rebuilding contracts to Haliburton(Cheney's 'former' oil company) and suppressing the remaining of his troops, along with riots and act-outs due to the fact that the people are glad we freed them, but like us the fuck out.


Come on, tell me we didn't go for oil. We had a huge fight with France and Germany because they wouldn't support us in the war but now wanted the spoils that come with it. And the vice president of the fucking United States' old company(which im sure he still has stake in) got most of the contracts offered! My gf's mom works for a somewhat struggling oil company here in houston that put in a lot of bids for a lot of contracts, and I'm sure they're willing to do it cheaper, they need work.

[Jabba]

Blair even said Saddam could use them in a matter of hours, mmmm, they
still didn't found anything did they?

He said they could be used in 45 minutes actually.

Remember we did find and eliminate several "weapons of mass destruction" though.

Saddam, Qusay, and Uday Hussein, Ali Hassan al-Majid "Chemical Ali" (responsible for killing 5,000 Kurds in Halabja with chemical weapons) to name but a few.

[RC45]

I think this constitution is more or less BS also.

Elaborate please - how is their new constitution BS?

Please explain - you are the 3rd person to a T touting how it's BS yet cannot explain how or why?

[ahmedgiyab]

I think this constitution is more or less BS also. I was an opponent of the war from the beginning, because the two main reasons we entered it ended up false. We found no chemical weapons, and there is no link between Hussein and AlQaeda. He had nothing to do with 9/11. Im sure he liked watching it on tv, but no connection whatsoever. Then they decided to call it a liberation of the Iraqi people as a cover for their mistaken allegations in the first place. They killed his sons, and they captured him, which were all good things in my book, but they just stumbled upon them afterwards. It wasn't their original intent. Now we have been there almost a year(maybe more?), and we finally draft a temporary constitution? What have we been doing all this time? Oh yea, giving away rebuilding contracts to Haliburton(Cheney's 'former' oil company) and suppressing the remaining of his troops, along with riots and act-outs due to the fact that the people are glad we freed them, but like us the fuck out.


Come on, tell me we didn't go for oil. We had a huge fight with France and Germany because they wouldn't support us in the war but now wanted the spoils that come with it. And the vice president of the fucking United States' old company(which im sure he still has stake in) got most of the contracts offered! My gf's mom works for a somewhat struggling oil company here in houston that put in a lot of bids for a lot of contracts, and I'm sure they're willing to do it cheaper, they need work.

You're the MAN!!! You're 19...and you know more than "someone" who is 36...JW is full of surprises!!!

[ahmedgiyab]

Blair even said Saddam could use them in a matter of hours, mmmm, they
still didn't found anything did they?

He said they could be used in 45 minutes actually.

Remember we did find and eliminate several "weapons of mass destruction" though.

Saddam, Qusay, and Uday Hussein, Ali Hassan al-Majid "Chemical Ali" (responsible for killing 5,000 Kurds in Halabja with chemical weapons) to name but a few.

Who sold that chemical weapons to Saddam in the 70's & 80's????? The old Bush did... The US supported Iraq in the Iraq, Iranian war 1980-88...

[jon_s]

hahaqhah, this thread should get interesting!

[RC45]

Why the US and it's coallition partners are in Irak
is only for the black gold.

You have stated your point - now explain why you say this?

I have already pointed out how the USA imports more oil from sources OTHER than the Middle East - so what's the next motive?

You need to be more precise - In geopolitical terms, removing an unstable megalomaniac from the Middle East was a strategic one (oe anybody half competant would have done) - that does help preserve ONE of the regional sources for oil in the future (and that was more to the point of not having Saddam attack OTHER neighours rather than let the "USA steal all the Iraqi oil for free" which is somehow what all you folks think is happening)

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Blair even said Saddam could use them in a matter of hours, mmmm, they
still didn't found anything did they?

He said they could be used in 45 minutes actually.

Remember we did find and eliminate several "weapons of mass destruction" though.

Saddam, Qusay, and Uday Hussein, Ali Hassan al-Majid "Chemical Ali" (responsible for killing 5,000 Kurds in Halabja with chemical weapons) to name but a few.

Yes but those weapons where not armed or something, and as for the Kurds I also think the fat bastard was a brutal killer. But why didn't the world interveen(is this written coorectly) during that time.
I think they had to do this in a more refind way, by assasinating Saddam
or by infiltration dismantling his gouverment,... and an other millions way.
But by going to war, they would have more control and decide how the place has to be run,...black gold remember

[RC45]

Who sold that chemical weapons to Saddam in the 70's & 80's????? The old Bush did... The US supported Iraq in the Iraq, Iranian war 1980-88...

Actually that would be German and French technology - the US simply supplied advisors, guns, munitions and missiles. ;)

I guess that somehow exonerates Hussein et al from responsibility for their actions...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Why the US and it's coallition partners are in Irak
is only for the black gold.

You have stated your point - now explain why you say this?

I have already pointed out how the USA imports more oil from sources OTHER than the Middle East - so what's the next motive?

You need to be more precise - In geopolitical terms, removing an unstable megalomaniac from the Middle East was a strategic one (oe anybody half competant would have done) - that does help preserve ONE of the regional sources for oil in the future (and that was more to the point of not having Saddam attack OTHER neighours rather than let the "USA steal all the Iraqi oil for free" which is somehow what all you folks think is happening)

Of course OTHER than the Middle East, but 15% is a lot, a lot, a lot. Mmmm, would be good for the economy,no?

[ahmedgiyab]

I'm not defending Hussein or anything...its just not fair at all!!! Like in the middle

ages... atacking a country for "no" reason??? The US is the "police" of the world???

So why is the UN there? Actually the US is controlling the UN... If they are really

the police of the world than what about North Korea??? ahhh...there is no oil... :lol:

[SPEEDKILLAR]

And by the way, why didn't you answer to ahmedgiyab remark about N-Korea,
I know why, by anwering it you'll proove all what you said is BS. Please just answer it.

[RC45]

I'm not defending Hussein or anything...its just not fair at all!!! Like in the middle

ages... atacking a country for "no" reason??? The US is the "police" of the world???

So why is the UN there? Actually the US is controlling the UN... If they are really

the police of the world than what about North Korea??? ahhh...there is no oil... :lol:

Debate facts my dear... as I said before Baghdad Bob - don't just yell out pointless chants and rants - this is not a street gathering in downtown Dubai - please inject some of your MBA-backed logic to this debate.

We are waiting...

[ahmedgiyab]

"RC45"...tell me why do the US need to imort oil...????

Alaska, Texas...enough for the US...I told you check what the Arab World did to

the US in 73...

So you are saying that the US went for the help of the Iraqi people....not for the

oil??? Simply this is the summary of what you said? If so...then no need to go

further in this topic... :roll:

[Jabba]

Yes but those weapons where not armed or something,

Who do you think gave the orders to build and use these weapons...we all know there are plenty of other countries with a chemical and nuclear capability but the difference is saddams willingness to use them on his own defenceless people. I would therefore say that the person in charge of using them is far more dangerous than the actual weapons themselves.

For me it all goes back to 9/11 and if it wasn't for what happened on that terrible day then I doubt the US and UK would be in Iraq right now.

Although it would appear that Iraq was not directly involved with 9/11 and didn't pose an immediate threat to any country other than its immediate neighbors you could have said the same thing about Afghanistan on 9/10...something not delt with properly can have a nasty habbit of coming back to kick you in the balls when you least expect it.

[RC45]

And by the way, why didn't you answer to ahmedgiyab remark about N-Korea,
I know why, by anwering it you'll proove all what you said is BS. Please just answer it.

Koreas time will come... and when it does, the true exposure of the depths of cruelty and depravation will astound the rest of the world - North Korea is not the nicest place to be an ordinary peasant... do a little research...

I am sure you are aware that N Korean school children are actually taught in their curriculum that the Korean War is still raging on - and that the South invaded the North without provocation, and that the entire rest of the world is just waiting to invade North Korea - and that is why they must hate the enemy - which in their perspective is EVERYONE not North Korean.

Now - back to the Iraqi question... let's hear what factual basis you have for all this "black gold" chanting.

[SPEEDKILLAR]

I'm not defending Hussein or anything...its just not fair at all!!! Like in the middle

ages... atacking a country for "no" reason??? The US is the "police" of the world???

So why is the UN there? Actually the US is controlling the UN... If they are really

the police of the world than what about North Korea??? ahhh...there is no oil... :lol:

Debate facts my dear... as I said before Baghdad Bob - don't just yell out pointless chants and rants - this is not a street gathering in downtown Dubai - please inject some of your MBA-backed logic to this debate.

We are waiting...

Hahahahahahahaha, to much for you, mmm; I thought you could handle it
,but no. Yaa, RC45 you can't discuss something that is obvious as it is.
Here's a piece of advice, read all the chants and rants, and then we will read yours. :wink:

[ahmedgiyab]

I'm not defending Hussein or anything...its just not fair at all!!! Like in the middle

ages... atacking a country for "no" reason??? The US is the "police" of the world???

So why is the UN there? Actually the US is controlling the UN... If they are really

the police of the world than what about North Korea??? ahhh...there is no oil... :lol:

Debate facts my dear... as I said before Baghdad Bob - don't just yell out pointless chants and rants - this is not a street gathering in downtown Dubai - please inject some of your MBA-backed logic to this debate.

We are waiting...

Do you have some shares in the "Bush" family...or what??? :snipersmile:

[Fleischmann]

Debate facts my dear... as I said before Baghdad Bob - don't just yell out pointless chants and rants - this is not a street gathering in downtown Dubai

LOL

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Yes but those weapons where not armed or something,

Who do you think gave the orders to build and use these weapons...we all know there are plenty of other countries with a chemical and nuclear capability but the difference is saddams willingness to use them on his own defenceless people. I would therefore say that the person in charge of using them is far more dangerous than the actual weapons themselves.

For me it all goes back to 9/11 and if it wasn't for what happened on that terrible day then I doubt the US and UK would be in Iraq right now.

Although it would appear that Iraq was not directly involved with 9/11 and didn't pose an immediate threat to any country other than its immediate neighbors you could have said the same thing about Afghanistan on 9/10...something not delt with properly can have a nasty habbit of coming back to kick you in the balls when you least expect it.

Well Jabba, I have to agree partially with you, but now that Saddy is gone,
there's no need to stay in Iraq is there.

[SPEEDKILLAR]

RC45, can't you write anything decent, just answer a few questions instead of using
fancy words to hide that your wrong.
Or else I'll get my dictionnary and also start using fancy words :wink:

[Jabba]

but now that Saddy is gone,
there's no need to stay in Iraq is there.

No indeed there isn't and I completely agree with you there. Before anyone mentions about Preemptive strategys being dangerous and in an ideal world they are of course....you have to think 9/11...as they say "the day the world changed forever"

[possessed_beaver]

Remember we did find and eliminate several "weapons of mass destruction" though.

i believe that they where probley blowen to shit by the powerful US bombs..
and as for oil reservs rember the us has more oil reserves than anyone!

[SPEEDKILLAR]

but now that Saddy is gone,
there's no need to stay in Iraq is there.

And I completely agree with you there.

Thanks Jabba, this is also what I wanted to show to RC45

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Remember we did find and eliminate several "weapons of mass destruction" though.

i believe that they where probley blowen to shit by the powerful US bombs..
and as for oil reservs rember the us has more oil reserves than anyone!

But a little bit more couldn't hurt could it,
blown away :? ????

[RC45]

"RC45"...tell me why do the US need to imort oil...????

Alaska, Texas...enough for the US...I told you check what the Arab World did to

the US in 73...

So you are saying that the US went for the help of the Iraqi people....not for the

oil??? Simply this is the summary of what you said? If so...then no need to go

further in this topic... :roll:

Again I point you towards the actual oil imports to the USA - The USA provided 45% of it's own oil supplies. The remaining 55% are imported. With ONLY 15% of those imports coming from the Arab world...

You guys are NOT the single most important source for US oil - you are just one of the cheapest.

So lets say that the US invaded Iraq for the oil - now what? Are they going to steal it? Take it for free? This makes no sense... why invade a place and spend 1000000 times more money on aquiring this "secret stash" of oil - than you could by simply buying it someplace other.

Lemme guess - now you going to say that the UK and US are going to steal all the Iraqi oil and never pay for it.

15% that how much oil comes from there... not 15% of US consumption - 15% of US imports - which is 55% of consumption - which is only 8.24% of US consumption... somehow your logic doesn't really hold water does it????

So back we go again to strategic studies - if we are talking about 8.25% of US consumption coming from the Arab world, is suddenly appears that ONE of the reasons for having a peaceful Middle East would be keep the price and supply of 8.25% of oil requirements stable...

However, another great plus would be to put the fear of God into any other fuckheads that get the bright idea to try fly their planes into large buildings killing 4000 people in an act of terrorism.

The terrorists of the world now know, even hiding in caves won't save you from getting killed .... fucking cowards.

Oh and the other plus side - Iraq has a Bill of Rights, a Constitution and an Interim Government that regains 100% control on July 1 2004...

Something that was never a prospect for the last 50 years.

So - why should the UAE be peaceful without dictators and Iraq not?

[ahmedgiyab]

'RC45'...next time be well informed about a topic...(it can be avoided by watching

CNN... :lol: )...don't you know that the media is full of........s?! (they only show

what they want to show...)....I hope you know who they are... 8)

P.S. I'm waiting for your answer about North Korea! :wink:

[SPEEDKILLAR]

However, another great plus would be to put the fear of God into any other fuckheads that get the bright idea to try fly their planes into large buildings killing 4000 peoplein an act of terrorsim.


I also regret those poor 4000 ppl that had nothing to do with it, but that's still not
a reason to go to war, and causing victims that also had nothing to do with it. And you think by going to war wont put any fuckhead to do even something worser.
Doesn't seem logical wat your saying, seems like useless revenge.

[RC45]

'RC45'...next time be well informed about a topic...(it can be avoided by watching

CNN... :lol: )...don't you know that the media is full of........s?! (they only show

what they want to show...)....I hope you know who they are... 8)

P.S. I'm waiting for your answer about North Korea! :wink:

The fact that you have avoided every question goes to show you have no basis for fact in anything yousaid. North Korea is not what this topic is about.

Every single member of JW has observed how you spout out nonsense - then when asked to back it up - just redirect the line of questioning - that may be how you "debate" in the UAE - but in the rest of the world we face facts and debate them... but I have watched Al Jazeera before - I know how the Arab mind works to try misdirect from the facts - an old Nomad trick that as no place in the 21st century...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

'RC45'...next time be well informed about a topic...(it can be avoided by watching

CNN... :lol: )...don't you know that the media is full of........s?! (they only show

what they want to show...)....I hope you know who they are... 8)

P.S. I'm waiting for your answer about North Korea! :wink:

The fact that you have avoided every question goes to show you have no basis for fact in anything yousaid. North Korea is not what this topic is about.

Every single member of JW has observed how you spout out nonsense - then when asked to back it up - just redirect the line of questioning - that may be how you "debate" in the UAE - but in the rest of the world we face facts and debate them... but I have watched Al Jazeera before - I know how the Arab mind works to try misdirect from the facts - an old Nomad trick that as no place in the 21st century...

Hahahahahahaha, you're almost sounding racist, ahahahahahahahahahah

[Jabba]

but now that Saddy is gone,
there's no need to stay in Iraq is there.



No indeed there isn't and I completely agree with you there. Before anyone mentions about Preemptive strategys being dangerous and in an ideal world they are of course....you have to think 9/11...as they say "the day the world changed forever"


Thanks Jabba, this is also what I wanted to show to RC45

Because of the speed of posting I just wanted to make it clear that I don't buy into the oil conspiracy theory at all...I have said its all about 9/11 for me and a preemptive issue.

[ahmedgiyab]

"RC45"...tell me why do the US need to imort oil...????

Alaska, Texas...enough for the US...I told you check what the Arab World did to

the US in 73...

So you are saying that the US went for the help of the Iraqi people....not for the

oil??? Simply this is the summary of what you said? If so...then no need to go

further in this topic... :roll:


Again I point you towards the actual oil imports to the USA - The USA provided 45% of it's own oil supplies. The remaining 55% are imported. With ONLY 15% of those imports coming from the Arab world...

You guys are NOT the single most important source for US oil - you are just one of the cheapest.

So lets say that the US invaded Iraq for the oil - now what? Are they going to steal it? Take it for free? This makes no sense... why invade a place and spend 1000000 times more money on aquiring this "secret stash" of oil - than you could by simply buying it someplace other.

Lemme guess - now you going to say that the UK and US are going to steal all the Iraqi oil and never pay for it.

15% that how much oil comes from there... not 15% of US consumption - 15% of US imports - which is 55% of consumption - which is only 8.24% of US consumption... somehow your logic doesn't really hold water does it????

So back we go again to strategic studies - if we are talking about 8.25% of US consumption coming from the Arab world, is suddenly appears that ONE of the reasons for having a peaceful Middle East would be keep the price and supply of 8.25% of oil requirements stable...

However, another great plus would be to put the fear of God into any other fuckheads that get the bright idea to try fly their planes into large buildings killing 4000 people in an act of terrorism.

The terrorists of the world now know, even hiding in caves won't save you from getting killed .... fucking cowards.

Oh and the other plus side - Iraq has a Bill of Rights, a Constitution and an Interim Government that regains 100% control on July 1 2004...

Something that was never a prospect for the last 50 years.

So - why should the UAE be peaceful without dictators and Iraq not?

Did you know that there are differences between the Arabs and the
Kurds??? The people who were on the streets of Baghdad after capturing Saddam are Kurds...NOT Arabs!!! Its not your business that he was a dictator! Arabs were happy...till the economic sanctios(US)...no medicine, no food, all because of the US...so were the fuck will they have money for chemical weapons??? Think man...satelites can see a matchbox!

[SPEEDKILLAR]

I think you can't convince an 'relativaly' old person of the truth, too sad.
:(

[SPEEDKILLAR]

but now that Saddy is gone,
there's no need to stay in Iraq is there.



No indeed there isn't and I completely agree with you there. Before anyone mentions about Preemptive strategys being dangerous and in an ideal world they are of course....you have to think 9/11...as they say "the day the world changed forever"


Thanks Jabba, this is also what I wanted to show to RC45

Because of the speed of posting I just wanted to make it clear that I don't buy into the oil conspiracy theory at all...I have said its all about 9/11 for me and a preemptive issue.

Yes 9/11 was a sad day, but so is Irak, Palestine/Israelli conflict, etc,...

[ahmedgiyab]

North Korea.... :lol:

Its not the topic??? It has a dictator as well...but the thing is that they don't have

oil...no money...no help...! 8)

[RC45]

Did you know that there are differences between the Arabs and the
Kurds??? The people who were on the streets of Baghdad after capturing Saddam are Kurds...NOT Arabs!!! Its not your business that he was a dictator! Arabs were happy...till the economic sanctios(US)...no medicine, no food, all because of the US...so were the fuck will they have money for chemical weapons??? Think man...satelites can see a matchbox!

Ah now we get down to the REAL matter - Ethnic hatred.... so it's ok to butcher the unclean peasants ... I get it... OK.. all makes sense now.

You're a Kurd hating Arab...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Did you know that there are differences between the Arabs and the
Kurds??? The people who were on the streets of Baghdad after capturing Saddam are Kurds...NOT Arabs!!! Its not your business that he was a dictator! Arabs were happy...till the economic sanctios(US)...no medicine, no food, all because of the US...so were the fuck will they have money for chemical weapons??? Think man...satelites can see a matchbox!

Ah now we get down to the REAL matter - Ethnic hatred.... so it's ok to butcher the unclean peasants ... I get it... OK.. all makes sense now.

You're a Kurd hating Arab...

Lets not start saying things we don't know... :wink:

[Jabba]

Its not your business that he was a dictator! Arabs were happy...

What exactly are Kuwaits then ? They seemed pretty pissed off until we marched Saddam out of Kuwait...

[ahmedgiyab]

KURDS are Turkish, Persian, people!!!! They dont speak arabic!!!! Just the Islam is

common!!! Man...you must be really well informed!

[RC45]

Hahahahahahaha, you're almost sounding racist, ahahahahahahahahahah

And the Kurd vs Arab factor pointed out by our UAE contributor is not?

When are all you "oli conspiracy" clowns going to provide some proof of your rantings?

As I have shown - the actual volume of oil that Arab imports represnt is pretty small in the big picture - so where the details of the conspiracy to "steal Iraqi oil"?

[ahmedgiyab]

Its not your business that he was a dictator! Arabs were happy...

What exaclty are Kuwaits then ? They seemed pretty pissed off until we marched Saddam out of Kuwait...

Kuwait used to be part of Iraq long time ago!

[RC45]

KURDS are Turkish, Persian, people!!!! They dont speak arabic!!!! Just the Islam is

common!!! Man...you must be really well informed!

And this fact means they have less right to slef-government, peace and prosperity? is that because they are viewed as second class people then?

I think we may have struck a nerve here.....

BTW - you ever ging to provide some proof and nformation about your "oil for free" conspiracy?

[RC45]

Its not your business that he was a dictator! Arabs were happy...

What exaclty are Kuwaits then ? They seemed pretty pissed off until we marched Saddam out of Kuwait...

Kuwait used to be part of Iraq long time ago!

So that makes them fair game then I suppose?

[ahmedgiyab]

Hahahahahahaha, you're almost sounding racist, ahahahahahahahahahah

And the Kurd vs Arab factor pointed out by our UAE contributor is not?

When are all you "oli conspiracy" clowns going to provide some proof of your rantings?

As I have shown - the actual volume of oil that Arab imports represnt is pretty small in the big picture - so where the details of the conspiracy to "steal Iraqi oil"?

Everyone thinks like this: Arabs=Kurds=Persians=Afghanis

Just to make it clear...never said that I have anything against Kurds!!!

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Hahahahahahaha, you're almost sounding racist, ahahahahahahahahahah

And the Kurd vs Arab factor pointed out by our UAE contributor is not?

When are all you "oli conspiracy" clowns going to provide some proof of your rantings?

As I have shown - the actual volume of oil that Arab imports represnt is pretty small in the big picture - so where the details of the conspiracy to "steal Iraqi oil"?

RC45, even If it was a "small" amount of oil, these days every boost no matter how small is important, common you have at least to agree on that.

[RC45]

but now that Saddy is gone,
there's no need to stay in Iraq is there.



No indeed there isn't and I completely agree with you there. Before anyone mentions about Preemptive strategys being dangerous and in an ideal world they are of course....you have to think 9/11...as they say "the day the world changed forever"


Thanks Jabba, this is also what I wanted to show to RC45

Because of the speed of posting I just wanted to make it clear that I don't buy into the oil conspiracy theory at all...I have said its all about 9/11 for me and a preemptive issue.

Yep - sorry about the speed of messaging sir.. ;) - but my meeting got delayed so - why not "stir em up" I figured... :D

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Its not your business that he was a dictator! Arabs were happy...

What exactly are Kuwaits then ? They seemed pretty pissed off until we marched Saddam out of Kuwait...

The Kuwaitees were presented the bill, they paid for the rescue.

[ahmedgiyab]

KURDS are Turkish, Persian, people!!!! They dont speak arabic!!!! Just the Islam is

common!!! Man...you must be really well informed!

And this fact means they have less right to slef-government, peace and prosperity? is that because they are viewed as second class people then?

I think we may have struck a nerve here.....

BTW - you ever ging to provide some proof and nformation about your "oil for free" conspiracy?

Kurds were imigrated to Iraq mainly from Turkey...they wanted to have their own country like

in Israel!

[RC45]

RC45, even If it was a "small" amount of oil, these days every boost no matter how small is important, common you have at least to agree on that.

Meaning what? We are talking about 8.25% of the total consumption of the country... help me understand how this amount came into play?

Perhaps you can teach me something....

Try provide a logical, cost effective explanation how the cost of this war is offset by cheap oil.

Here - I will help you - the stability of the ENTIRE region is more important than the oil in Iraq... now - you come up with the rest of the story...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

but now that Saddy is gone,
there's no need to stay in Iraq is there.



No indeed there isn't and I completely agree with you there. Before anyone mentions about Preemptive strategys being dangerous and in an ideal world they are of course....you have to think 9/11...as they say "the day the world changed forever"


Thanks Jabba, this is also what I wanted to show to RC45

Because of the speed of posting I just wanted to make it clear that I don't buy into the oil conspiracy theory at all...I have said its all about 9/11 for me and a preemptive issue.

Yep - sorry about the speed of messaging sir.. ;) - but my meeting got delayed so - why not "stir em up" I figured... :D

Well "sir" RC 45, If this was just stirring up, then the whole time you were
talking BS. Now I get It, hahahahahahahahahahahaha :roll:

[RC45]

Kurds were imigrated to Iraq mainly from Turkey...they wanted to have their own country like

in Israel!

And? Because of this they are fair game for genocide? BTW I am still waiting to hear about the "oil for sex" conspiracy...

[Jabba]

The other reason the oil conspiracy theory doesn't work for me is....that we could have taken the oil back in 1991 during the first gulf war if we had really wanted it...

A little more than a year after 9/11 we decide to sort out unfinished business its as simple as that...the thing about all good conspiracy theory's though is theres always some magical complicated explanation thats thought up by people with far too much time on their hands.

[RC45]

Well "sir" RC 45, If this was just stirring up, then the whole time you were
talking BS. Now I get It, hahahahahahahahahahahaha :roll:

No - not by any means - I have presented facts - you have just spouted left-wing rhetoric... let's have some informaiton to back up your claims...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

RC45, even If it was a "small" amount of oil, these days every boost no matter how small is important, common you have at least to agree on that.

Meaning what? We are talking about 8.25% of the total consumption of the country... help me understand how this amount came into play?

Perhaps you can teach me something....

Try provide a logical, cost effective explanation how the cost of this war is offset by cheap oil.

Here - I will help you - the stability of the ENTIRE region is more important than the oil in Iraq... now - you come up with the rest of the story...

SOO please tell me, why some countries have to act like the police.
Securing the region from who, Saddy was not going to attack the region.
Most important of all, securing the region for who, mmm, not for
the Arabs I presume.......you may fill in the rest.

[ahmedgiyab]

Stability in the region...? Very funny...just like in Israel...nice help...

Sorry...but i think in North Korea there is no stability...or may be CNN didn't shw

that?! :lol:

[SPEEDKILLAR]

The other reason the oil conspiracy theory doesn't work for me is....that we could have taken the oil back in 1991 during the first gulf war if we had really wanted it...

A little more than a year after 9/11 we decide to sort out unfinished business its as simple as that...the thing about all good conspiracy theory's though is theres always some magical complicated explanation thats thought up by people with far too much time on their hands.

BUSINESS that had nothing to do with 9/11, doesn't seem logical. :?

[ahmedgiyab]

RC45, even If it was a "small" amount of oil, these days every boost no matter how small is important, common you have at least to agree on that.

Meaning what? We are talking about 8.25% of the total consumption of the country... help me understand how this amount came into play?

Perhaps you can teach me something....

Try provide a logical, cost effective explanation how the cost of this war is offset by cheap oil.

Here - I will help you - the stability of the ENTIRE region is more important than the oil in Iraq... now - you come up with the rest of the story...

SOO please tell me, why some countries have to act like the police.
Securing the region from who, Saddy was not going to attack the region.
Most important of all, securing the region for who, mmm, not for
the Arabs I presume.......you may fill in the rest.

I love the way you think! I wish I would know you...to marry you... :D

[RC45]

Stability in the region...? Very funny...just like in Israel...nice help...

Sorry...but i think in North Korea there is no stability...or may be CNN didn't shw

that?! :lol:

You sure do seem to be avoiding the "oil conspiracy" you raised... why? You have no data to back up your rantings?

We are waiting....

[Jabba]

Its not your business that he was a dictator! Arabs were happy...

What exaclty are Kuwaits then ? They seemed pretty pissed off until we marched Saddam out of Kuwait...

Kuwait used to be part of Iraq long time ago!

Yes a very long time ago and since then they have been recognised as an independent state and even a member of the UN since the 1960's

[ahmedgiyab]

OK wait...but its only you...noone agrees on your opinion...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

I think really none of us can't really know why, who,....

We are all throwing some opinions that maybe be all wrong, and thats because we
can't know.
I mean think of it, there could be thousands reasons for this, we can't possibly
know what those (high powered unknown, not Bushy or Blairy)ppl decide.

I think history(in the future that is) will reveal why, who, ....When we become old,
or some of us already died of a hart failure. :wink:

[SPEEDKILLAR]

I here by rest my case :wink: Although I found it an interesting discussion.

[fedezyl]

How about the reconstruction of Iraq?? that must make a lot of money for many foreign construction companies, there's a lot of money to be made there, and it would surely help reactivating a slowing economy...

Just to be clear i'm not taking any sides in here, I just want to point out that it's not all nice and beautiful as RC45's point of view may be, nor as dark and premeditated as other's point out the coalition actions were.

I know from a good source from one of my brother's friend who works as an engineer at foreign construction company that the biggest contracts right now are in Iraq, wich make sense, it's just that sometimes i'm surprised on how premeditated some governement actions may be... :?

The other thing is that maybe part to the anger and that opposing point of view to U.S. actions is because of Mr.Bush's attitude itself, maybe being more diplomatic would have gained him some more points in other parts of the world, I surely dislike his cowboy sheriff of the world attitude and ability to show his stupidity, but he's not the whole U.S. governement and you do have some very smart people working with him..

[ahmedgiyab]

Its not your business that he was a dictator! Arabs were happy...

What exaclty are Kuwaits then ? They seemed pretty pissed off until we marched Saddam out of Kuwait...

Kuwait used to be part of Iraq long time ago!

Yes a very long time ago and since then they have been recognised as an independent state and even a member of the UN since the 1960's

I meant Arabs in Iraq...they were happy...only the Kurds were pissed! The Iraqi Arab people loved him even after 1991(when the UN/US economic embargo started)...

[Jabba]

And you think by going to war wont put any fuckhead to do even something worser.



I would say that it sure gave Mr Gaddafi something to think over...and hes done the smart thing and decided to give up his WMD....now thats not such a bad thing is it ? Especially as he was starting to move on from blowing up airliners full of incocent people (that he has since admited to). (The 1988 bombing of the Pan Am jet over Lockerbie, Scotland, killed 270 people)

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Stability in the region...? Very funny...just like in Israel...nice help...

Sorry...but i think in North Korea there is no stability...or may be CNN didn't shw

that?! :lol:

You sure do seem to be avoiding the "oil conspiracy" you raised... why? You have no data to back up your rantings?

We are waiting....

Wait untill next year, data's mean nothing, just numbers that don't show
blood, pain there is.

[SPEEDKILLAR]

And you think by going to war wont put any fuckhead to do even something worser.



I would say that it sure gave Mr Gaddafi something to think over...and hes done the smart thing and decided to give up his WMD....now thats not such a bad thing is it ?

Gaddafi has the I.Q. of a camel, he was just bluffing, he was persuaded with some other (financial,...)methodes, wich is not bad and effective.
Even If he had continiued his WMD, I don't see the US and the Coallition partners start a new war after the other still ongoing

[ahmedgiyab]

"SPEEDKILLAR"...I LOVE YOU!!!

I alwas love your comments! Very logicl words! :D

See 'RC45'...even a young pretty lady knows more than average! :)

[ahmedgiyab]

And you think by going to war wont put any fuckhead to do even something worser.



I would say that it sure gave Mr Gaddafi something to think over...and hes done the smart thing and decided to give up his WMD....now thats not such a bad thing is it ?

Gaddafi has the I.Q. of a camel, he was just bluffing, he was persuaded with some other (financial,...)methodes, wich is not bad and effective.
Even If he had continiued his WMD, I don't see the US and the Coallition partners start a new war after the other still ongoing

Gaddafi has the IQ as a Coke bottle... :roll:

That guy is an idiot...thats why noone takes him seriusly...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

"SPEEDKILLAR"...I LOVE YOU!!!

I alwas love your comments! Very logicl words! :D

See 'RC45'...even a young pretty lady knows more than average! :)

Ooooh thanks ahmedgiyab, but I'm actually a guy, didn't you see my thread that I posted on Jokes and Humor, ...
I changed into a girl too view JW through the eyes of a girl. you should check it out :wink:

[RC45]

How about the reconstruction of Iraq?? that must make a lot of money for many foreign construction companies, there's a lot of money to be made there, and it would surely help reactivating a slowing economy...

Just to be clear i'm not taking any sides in here, I just want to point out that it's not all nice and beautiful as RC45's point of view may be, nor as dark and premeditated as other's point out the coalition actions were.

I know from a good source from one of my brother's friend who works as an engineer at foreign construction company that the biggest contracts right now are in Iraq, wich make sense, it's just that sometimes i'm surprised on how premeditated some governement actions may be... :?

The other thing is that maybe part to the anger and that opposing point of view to U.S. actions is because of Mr.Bush's attitude itself, maybe being more diplomatic would have gained him some more points in other parts of the world, I surely dislike his cowboy sheriff of the world attitude and ability to show his stupidity, but he's not the whole U.S. governement and you do have some very smart people working with him..

So you on the other hand would have the world believe that by travelling 10,000 miles around the world and bombing the piss out of Iraq, the ENTIRE US economy is being given a boost by a few companies winning the bids to rebuild the country?

I knwo you said are not taking sides - and that is hwy I am not "attacking" per se... but come on ... listen to this logic already.

Apart from a few contractors and such - my standard of living is not being boosted by the rebuilding in Iraq - my standard of living is being boosted because I get off my ass everyday and provide a service for pay.

So lets ground our selves in a lttle reality...

[RC45]

Stability in the region...? Very funny...just like in Israel...nice help...

Sorry...but i think in North Korea there is no stability...or may be CNN didn't shw

that?! :lol:

You sure do seem to be avoiding the "oil conspiracy" you raised... why? You have no data to back up your rantings?

We are waiting....

Wait untill next year, data's mean nothing, just numbers that don't show
blood, pain there is.


So in other words - you have no fucking clue what you are talking about....

Next....

[Jabba]

And you think by going to war wont put any fuckhead to do even something worser.



I would say that it sure gave Mr Gaddafi something to think over...and hes done the smart thing and decided to give up his WMD....now thats not such a bad thing is it ?

Gaddafi has the I.Q. of a camel, he was just bluffing, he was persuaded with some other (financial,...)methodes, wich is not bad and effective.
Even If he had continiued his WMD, I don't see the US and the Coallition partners start a new war after the other still ongoing

Gaddafi has the IQ as a Coke bottle... :roll:

That guy is an idiot...thats why noone takes him seriusly...

Probably the people on the airliner that he had blown up took him quite seriously though.

BTW just out of interest what beverage would you rate your own IQ as ?

[RC45]

"SPEEDKILLAR"...I LOVE YOU!!!

I alwas love your comments! Very logicl words! :D

See 'RC45'...even a young pretty lady knows more than average! :)

In other words you are living in a country where sex is taboo and woman are belittled you are on the Internet to fantasize about fucking anything with a prospect of being female... pity speed is anything but...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

How about the reconstruction of Iraq?? that must make a lot of money for many foreign construction companies, there's a lot of money to be made there, and it would surely help reactivating a slowing economy...

Just to be clear i'm not taking any sides in here, I just want to point out that it's not all nice and beautiful as RC45's point of view may be, nor as dark and premeditated as other's point out the coalition actions were.

I know from a good source from one of my brother's friend who works as an engineer at foreign construction company that the biggest contracts right now are in Iraq, wich make sense, it's just that sometimes i'm surprised on how premeditated some governement actions may be... :?

The other thing is that maybe part to the anger and that opposing point of view to U.S. actions is because of Mr.Bush's attitude itself, maybe being more diplomatic would have gained him some more points in other parts of the world, I surely dislike his cowboy sheriff of the world attitude and ability to show his stupidity, but he's not the whole U.S. governement and you do have some very smart people working with him..

So you on the other hand would have the world believe that by travelling 10,000 miles around the world and bombing the piss out of Iraq, the ENTIRE US economy is being given a boost by a few companies winning the bids to rebuild the country?

I knwo you said are not taking sides - and that is hwy I am not "attacking" per se... but come on ... listen to this logic already.

Apart from a few contractors and such - my standard of living is not being boosted by the rebuilding in Iraq - my standard of living is being boosted because I get off my ass everyday and provide a service for pay.

So lets ground our selves in a lttle reality...

Distance means nothing, and BTW RC45, this is a long term project, that
could bring those$$$$$$.

I don't see companies travel such a "distance" If there wasn't any profit in IT. Common RC45 be logic...

[RC45]

Distance means nothing, and BTW RC45, this is a long term project, that
could bring those$$$$$$.

I don't see companies travel such a "distance" If there wasn't any profit in IT. Common RC45 be logic...

And what about the "oil connection"? I guess you are moving on from that bit of misinformation...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

"SPEEDKILLAR"...I LOVE YOU!!!

I alwas love your comments! Very logicl words! :D

See 'RC45'...even a young pretty lady knows more than average! :)

In other words you are living in a country where sex is taboo and woman are belittled you are on the Internet to fantasize about fucking anything with a prospect of being female... pity speed is anything but...

You are really good in one thing, and that's having weird ideas :wink: , I mean can't you read, you may have some trouble understanding what ppl say. That's not wat he said...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Distance means nothing, and BTW RC45, this is a long term project, that
could bring those$$$$$$.

I don't see companies travel such a "distance" If there wasn't any profit in IT. Common RC45 be logic...

And what about the "oil connection"? I guess you are moving on from that bit of misinformation...

Simple OIL TANKERS, or distributing it from there to other countries as a
way of income.

[Jabba]

OK this is getting all confused now....we have made our political thoughts known...and lets just agree to dis-agree....have a few more posts and then I am locking this.

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Probably the people on the airliner that he had blown up took him quite seriously though.


Poor ppl, may they rest in peace. But the bastard didn't receive any punishment,
only the poor ppl of Libia.

[Jabba]

Your probably right on that one.... :|

[RC45]

Distance means nothing, and BTW RC45, this is a long term project, that
could bring those$$$$$$.

I don't see companies travel such a "distance" If there wasn't any profit in IT. Common RC45 be logic...

And what about the "oil connection"? I guess you are moving on from that bit of misinformation...

Simple OIL TANKERS, or distributing it from there to other countries as a
way of income.

What the fuck are you ranting about now?

I started thsi thread to show amazement and pay respect to the fact that the various members of the Interim Iraqi government had come together, without killing each other - and hashed out a Bill of Rights and Constitution - that will pave the way to a less tyrannical form of gobernment in Iraq...

..and a couple responded that the Contituionwas BullShit because the US and the UK invaded Iraq to steal their oil and that the entire Interim Government is sham and that Saddam Hussein wqas a good guy who really shouldn't have been removed from government - and that a dempcratic style Iraq is a bad idea for the future peace of the region.

Lets get back to THAT debate - and why you and your Arab boyfriend think the "old Iraq" was better for the Iraqi people, the region and the world.

Let's see some real intelligent debate take place.

[ahmedgiyab]

And you think by going to war wont put any fuckhead to do even something worser.



I would say that it sure gave Mr Gaddafi something to think over...and hes done the smart thing and decided to give up his WMD....now thats not such a bad thing is it ?

Gaddafi has the I.Q. of a camel, he was just bluffing, he was persuaded with some other (financial,...)methodes, wich is not bad and effective.
Even If he had continiued his WMD, I don't see the US and the Coallition partners start a new war after the other still ongoing

May be more than some of you guys?! :wink:

Gaddafi has the IQ as a Coke bottle... :roll:

That guy is an idiot...thats why noone takes him seriusly...

Probably the people on the airliner that he had blown up took him quite seriously though.

BTW just out of interest what beverage would you rate your own IQ as ?

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Let's just say war has never been the solution, we used it because we are impatient, PEACE is the only way, but sadly enough also the most difficult way.

[RC45]

Let's just say war has never been the solution, we used it because we are impatient, PEACE is the only way, but sadly enough also the most difficult way.

Exactly what was PEACEFUL with regard to Iraq from from the 1960's to 2003?

Please tell us...

[Jabba]

Lets get back to THAT debate - and why you and your Arab boyfriend think the "old Iraq" was better for the Iraqi people, the region and the world.



LMAO !!! :lol: That one has got to make everyone smile.


Let's see some real intelligent debate take place.

I dont think theres much chance of seeing any of that here when were starting to compare people to bottles of coke....

[ahmedgiyab]

"SPEEDKILLAR"...I LOVE YOU!!!

I alwas love your comments! Very logicl words! :D

See 'RC45'...even a young pretty lady knows more than average! :)

In other words you are living in a country where sex is taboo and woman are belittled you are on the Internet to fantasize about fucking anything with a prospect of being female... pity speed is anything but...

Sex is taboo in Dubai...???? Are you really 36 or 16?

More than 60% of the country is Europeans, US, Australia...etc.

I love guys like you...they make me smile in "hard times"! :lol:

I think its like this: you are gay coz 20% of the US people are

Homosexuals...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Distance means nothing, and BTW RC45, this is a long term project, that
could bring those$$$$$$.

I don't see companies travel such a "distance" If there wasn't any profit in IT. Common RC45 be logic...

And what about the "oil connection"? I guess you are moving on from that bit of misinformation...

Simple OIL TANKERS, or distributing it from there to other countries as a
way of income.

What the fuck are you ranting about now?

I started thsi thread to show amazement and pay respect to the fact that the various members of the Interim Iraqi government had come together, without killing each other - and hashed out a Bill of Rights and Constitution - that will pave the way to a less tyrannical form of gobernment in Iraq...

..and a couple responded that the Contituionwas BullShit because the US and the UK invaded Iraq to steal their oil and that the entire Interim Government is sham and that Saddam Hussein wqas a good guy who really shouldn't have been removed from government - and that a dempcratic style Iraq is a bad idea for the future peace of the region.

Lets get back to THAT debate - and why you and your Arab boyfriend think the "old Iraq" was better for the Iraqi people, the region and the world.

Let's see some real intelligent debate take place.

I see in you an angry person, who is confused and shocked by what happend in the past. Man can't you see there's more to it than oil, things
common ppl like you and me can't understand and know.
Just agree that violence never was a long term solution :wink:

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Lets get back to THAT debate - and why you and your Arab boyfriend think the "old Iraq" was better for the Iraqi people, the region and the world.



LMAO !!! :lol: That one has got to make everyone smile.


Let's see some real intelligent debate take place.

I dont think theres much chance of seeing any of that here when were starting to compare people to bottles of coke....

Hahahahahahahahahaha, I actually compared him with a camel,hahahahahahahahahahahahaha :lol: :lol: :lol: :wink:

[SPEEDKILLAR]

RC45 wrote:


Lets get back to THAT debate - and why you and your Arab boyfriend think the "old Iraq" was better for the Iraqi people, the region and the world.


I think somebody is jealous...... :wink:

Don't worry I'll maybe like you too :oops: :oops: :wink:

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Please tell us...


Most difficult way, do read at all what ppl write :?

Mmmmm, no response, I guess I was write :roll: , yoahoooooo, yes, yes, whose
the man, uuhh woman. :wink:

[ahmedgiyab]

RC45 wrote:


Lets get back to THAT debate - and why you and your Arab boyfriend think the "old Iraq" was better for the Iraqi people, the region and the world.


I think somebody is jealous...... :wink:

Don't worry I'll maybe like you too :oops: :oops: :wink:

Great guy! You make this forum sooooo colorful!!! :)

Sorry for the "marrige" thing... :oops:

[Jabba]

Just agree that violence never was a long term solution :wink:

War sadly does get results though (and at a price that has to be paid some times)...if it wasnt for the war then Saddam and co would still be feeding innocent civilians into industrial shredding machines...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Sorry for the "marrige" thing...


No problemo :wink:

[RC45]

Sex is taboo in Dubai...???? Are you really 36 or 16?

More than 60% of the country is Europeans, US, Australia...etc.

I love guys like you...they make me smile in "hard times"! :lol:

I think its like this: you are gay coz 20% of the US people are

Homosexuals...

Actually the correct break down for the UAE is 65% Asian, 18% UAE nationals, 13% Arab ex-pats and 4% Europeans etc...

And last time I checked 4% of 3.5 million is less than 150,000...

Besides - with 71% of the UAE population being male - and only 29% female - I am guessing you are statistically more likely to bang a guy than I am am - I mean look how you tried to do speed over the Net earlier...

So - let's get back to the original claims you made...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Just agree that violence never was a long term solution :wink:

War sadly does get results though (and at a price that has to be paid some times)...if it wasnt for the war then Saddam and co would still be feeding innocent civilians into industrial shredding machines...

Yes but only for short term, on the other side It makes some dangerous
characters only more powerful, with negative effects

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Sex is taboo in Dubai...???? Are you really 36 or 16?

More than 60% of the country is Europeans, US, Australia...etc.

I love guys like you...they make me smile in "hard times"! :lol:

I think its like this: you are gay coz 20% of the US people are

Homosexuals...

Actually the correct break down for the UAE is 65% Asian, 18% UAE nationals, 13% Arab ex-pats and 4% Europeans etc...

And last time I checked 4% of 3.5 million is less than 150,000...

Besides - with 71% of the UAE population being male - and only 29% female - I am guessing you are statistically more likely to bang a guy than I am am - I mean look how you tried to do speed over the Net earlier...

So - let's get back to the original claims you made...

Hahahahhaaha RC45, you really crack me up, I think you need to go more
outside and see the world and understand Its not about numbers and silly
remarks :wink:

[ahmedgiyab]

Yeah...its the datas about the UAE...not Dubai...its one of the seven emirates...

I said this about Dubai... :wink:

[RC45]

Please tell us...


Most difficult way, do read at all what ppl write :?

Mmmmm, no response, I guess I was write :roll: , yoahoooooo, yes, yes, whose
the man, uuhh woman. :wink:

I read every clumsy word you wrote - and you have not explained how Iraq was better before than now - you have not explained how the "war was for oil" (and - in case you did not know - in a debate just saying "I say so so it is" is NOT presenting an argument supporting your position).

All you have said is " The war was for oil" - "it realy was" - "of corse it was" etc etc..

I am asking you to show what informaiton leads you to that conclusion... I have provided the informaiton that helps back up my claim that the amount of oil that Iraq represnts is not enough to be the sole stification for the "war"...

[Jabba]

Just agree that violence never was a long term solution :wink:

War sadly does get results though (and at a price that has to be paid some times)...if it wasnt for the war then Saddam and co would still be feeding innocent civilians into industrial shredding machines...

Yes but only for short term, on the other side It makes some dangerous
characters only more powerful, with negative effects

Thats the idea to remove the dangerouse characters and I would say the hussain family were quite dangerous and a good start....as will be the next one on the list...Osama Bin Laden

[Jabba]

Sadly I have to leave for home now...I hate to think how big this thread will have become the next time I check it...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Just agree that violence never was a long term solution :wink:

War sadly does get results though (and at a price that has to be paid some times)...if it wasnt for the war then Saddam and co would still be feeding innocent civilians into industrial shredding machines...

Yes but only for short term, on the other side It makes some dangerous
characters only more powerful, with negative effects

Thats the idea to remove the dangerouse characters and I would say the hussain family were quite dangerous and a good start....as will be the next one on the list...Osama Bin Laden

And then what, another Osama, and then another Sady, this way it will never stop, and who is suffering the innocent civillions. While the politicians
and terrorist leaders have a fight...

[Jabba]

And then what, another Osama, and then another Sady, this way it will never stop, and who is suffering the inocent civillions. While the politicians
and terrorist leaders have a fight...

Yes sadly there is no perfect solution but getting rid of saddam is a step in the right direction thats for sure....

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Please tell us...


Most difficult way, do read at all what ppl write :?

Mmmmm, no response, I guess I was write :roll: , yoahoooooo, yes, yes, whose
the man, uuhh woman. :wink:

I read every clumsy word you wrote - and you have not explained how Iraq was better before than now - you have not explained how the "war was for oil" (and - in case you did not know - in a debate just saying "I say so so it is" is NOT presenting an argument supporting your position).

All you have said is " The war was for oil" - "it realy was" - "of corse it was" etc etc..

I am asking you to show what informaiton leads you to that conclusion... I have provided the informaiton that helps back up my claim that the amount of oil that Iraq represnts is not enough to be the sole stification for the "war"...

I really appreciate it that at least you have readed my (Oooh, touchy)"clumsy" words.

But to be honest, what did you gave us, data this, blalalalalababab, look I have written a difficult word, what do you have to say now.
:roll: :roll: :roll:
Please RC45, try to act a little bit more like an adult. I understand what you have to say, but you're WRONG, and lets say thats my opinion and of the rest of the world... :wink:

[RC45]

Yeah...its the datas about the UAE...not Dubai...its one of the seven emirates...

I said this about Dubai... :wink:

Actually Arabian Gigolo - the stats for Dubai are suprisingly similar - with about 80% of the 1 million or so souls inhabiting Dubai being made up of 80% Asians and Europeans - and if Dubais own census numbers are to be believed about 80% of this number is again Asian... but why should I be telling you facts about your own home...???

I was hoping you stop beating the women in the neighbourhood long enough to actualy make a factual and intelligent statement.

[Jabba]

and lets say thats my opinion and of the rest of the world... :wink:

Well it sure isnt my opinion.

[SPEEDKILLAR]

And then what, another Osama, and then another Sady, this way it will never stop, and who is suffering the inocent civillions. While the politicians
and terrorist leaders have a fight...

Yes sadly there is no perfect solution but getting rid of saddam is a step in the right direction thats for sure....

Yes I agree for the time being, there's no perfect solution, but as humans
we are resourceful and I HOPE(you know what HOPE is RC45 :? ) one day we will be able to diminuish these kind of acts.

[ahmedgiyab]

Please tell us...


Most difficult way, do read at all what ppl write :?

Mmmmm, no response, I guess I was write :roll: , yoahoooooo, yes, yes, whose
the man, uuhh woman. :wink:

I read every clumsy word you wrote - and you have not explained how Iraq was better before than now - you have not explained how the "war was for oil" (and - in case you did not know - in a debate just saying "I say so so it is" is NOT presenting an argument supporting your position).

All you have said is " The war was for oil" - "it realy was" - "of corse it was" etc etc..

I am asking you to show what informaiton leads you to that conclusion... I have provided the informaiton that helps back up my claim that the amount of oil that Iraq represnts is not enough to be the sole stification for the "war"...

I really appreciate it that at least you have readed my (Oooh, touchy)"clumsy" words.

But to be honest, what did you gave us, data this, blalalalalababab, look I have written a difficult word, what do you have to say now.
:roll: :roll: :roll:
Please RC45, try to act a little bit more like an adult. I understand what you have to say, but you're WRONG, and lets say thats my opinion and of the rest of the world... :wink:

Tottaly Agree on that!

[RC45]

and lets say thats my opinion and of the rest of the world... :wink:

Well it sure isnt my opinion.

Nor mine...

I too am out - and am dreading trying to catch up later... ;)

[SPEEDKILLAR]

and lets say thats my opinion and of the rest of the world... :wink:

Well it sure isnt my opinion.

I was being sarcastic :roll:
:wink:

[SPEEDKILLAR]

I was hoping you stop beating the women in the neighbourhood long enough to actualy make a factual and intelligent statement.


Somebody is prejudice, go travel around and make some Arab friends, I have Arab
friends and the're really fun...just an advice, be more open to other cultures :wink:

[Jabba]

I was hoping you stop beating the women in the neighbourhood long enough to actualy make a factual and intelligent statement.


Somebody is prejudice, go travel around and make some Arab friends, I have Arab
friends and the're really fun...just an advice, be more open to other cultures :wink:

Including or not including Israelis ?

[ahmedgiyab]

Yeah...its the datas about the UAE...not Dubai...its one of the seven emirates...

I said this about Dubai... :wink:

Actually Arabian Gigolo - the stats for Dubai are suprisingly similar - with about 80% of the 1 million or so souls inhabiting Dubai being made up of 80% Asians and Europeans - and if Dubais own census numbers are to be believed about 80% of this number is again Asian... but why should I be telling you facts about your own home...???

I was hoping you stop beating the women in the neighbourhood long enough to actualy make a factual and intelligent statement.

I feel sorry for your family...they should embaressed of you...poor people

a guy(36) who is very low educated...must be the black sheep in the

family... :roll:

Really your mind works with "petrol"...maybe this is the only thing that

you are good at...driving automatic cars at 30mph... 8)

[RC45]

I really appreciate it that at least you have readed my (Oooh, touchy)"clumsy" words.

But to be honest, what did you gave us, data this, blalalalalababab, look I have written a difficult word, what do you have to say now.
:roll: :roll: :roll:
Please RC45, try to act a little bit more like an adult. I understand what you have to say, but you're WRONG, and lets say thats my opinion and of the rest of the world... :wink:

What is it I am wrong about? That Iraq is on a good path to constitutional liberty and equlity for it's citizens? Wrong about the proof of the war being about oil not being there?

And you are so adamant to make these claims - what makes YOU right? All you did was make a statement - with NO BACKUP as to WHY you think that way.

Please let the rest of the world know why YOU think Iraq is worse off now, that the people of Iraq do not deserve constitutionally protect rights.. and please let us know what PROOF you have that the war was all about oil.

So far - you provide none.

That my EU-nazi is NOT how a debate proceeds.

I too made a statement - but at least I provided logical reasons WHY my idea has MORE MERIT than yours.

I would have hoped you would have at least THAT much knowledge...

[graywolf624]

Some facts:
The US do not and have not imported oil from iraq since before 1991 (including post war iraq).
The primary importers of oil from iraq were france, germany, and russia.
The primary military infrastructure and chemical weapon stuff came from France and Russia.
They have proven that the russian govt, chiracs banker, the main opposition to blair on the issue, and several other anti war un people were illegally buying oil from Iraq as middle men (during the oil for food time period).
Saddam offered money to the familys of any suicidal bomber.
Iraq did at one point have wmd and refused to allow wmd inspections towards the end.
North Korea has China backing them up to the point where invasion is not an option.
Saddam commited genicide.
While the military has been there a long time we cannot simply just pack up and leave either. Someone must suggest a reasonable plan of jump starting the new govt, then we must leave. The new constitution unfortunately is useless unless we can get people to follow it.
The last time we were in iraq we did not invade, we did what we had UN approval for.
Halbitron has no link to Bush. It does have a link to our VP but even that link is something that hasn't been direct in the last 5 years. Furthermore, halbitron handled the oil fires and issues during the gulf war and already had a presence in the middle east. As such they could act quicker then other options.

I am not a Bush supporter. I do support the war as something that had to happen eventually. I do feel that once we leave Iraq we should quit being the police world wide and only keep our troops local.

[ahmedgiyab]

I was hoping you stop beating the women in the neighbourhood long enough to actualy make a factual and intelligent statement.


Somebody is prejudice, go travel around and make some Arab friends, I have Arab
friends and the're really fun...just an advice, be more open to other cultures :wink:

Including or not including Israelis ?

As far as I remember...Israelis are Jews...or you ment Palestinians???

[SPEEDKILLAR]

I was hoping you stop beating the women in the neighbourhood long enough to actualy make a factual and intelligent statement.


Somebody is prejudice, go travel around and make some Arab friends, I have Arab
friends and the're really fun...just an advice, be more open to other cultures :wink:

Including or not including Israelis ?

Man Jabba, how can you even say that, don't know if ther's any use telling this but I also had a Israeli girl in my school a few years ago, and we are still best friends...
Why did you take that excample... :?

[Jabba]

I was hoping you stop beating the women in the neighbourhood long enough to actualy make a factual and intelligent statement.


Somebody is prejudice, go travel around and make some Arab friends, I have Arab
friends and the're really fun...just an advice, be more open to other cultures :wink:

Including or not including Israelis ?

As far as I remember...Israelis are Jews..???

and your point being ?

[SPEEDKILLAR]

I really appreciate it that at least you have readed my (Oooh, touchy)"clumsy" words.

But to be honest, what did you gave us, data this, blalalalalababab, look I have written a difficult word, what do you have to say now.
:roll: :roll: :roll:
Please RC45, try to act a little bit more like an adult. I understand what you have to say, but you're WRONG, and lets say thats my opinion and of the rest of the world... :wink:

What is it I am wrong about? That Iraq is on a good path to constitutional liberty and equlity for it's citizens? Wrong about the proof of the war being about oil not being there?

And you are so adamant to make these claims - what makes YOU right? All you did was make a statement - with NO BACKUP as to WHY you think that way.

Please let the rest of the world know why YOU think Iraq is worse off now, that the people of Iraq do not deserve constitutionally protect rights.. and please let us know what PROOF you have that the war was all about oil.

So far - you provide none.

That my EU-nazi is NOT how a debate proceeds.

I too made a statement - but at least I provided logical reasons WHY my idea has MORE MERIT than yours.

I would have hoped you would have at least THAT much knowledge...


Hhahahahahaha, here he goes again, blblalalalala this, balalalallblb that.
Yes RC45 you're doing very well, :roll: :roll: :roll:

There have been more troops injured and killed than during the war, and
lets not forget those poor, poor ppl, RC45 thinks about, what a heart... :roll:

[SPEEDKILLAR]

I really appreciate it that at least you have readed my (Oooh, touchy)"clumsy" words.

But to be honest, what did you gave us, data this, blalalalalababab, look I have written a difficult word, what do you have to say now.
:roll: :roll: :roll:
Please RC45, try to act a little bit more like an adult. I understand what you have to say, but you're WRONG, and lets say thats my opinion and of the rest of the world... :wink:

What is it I am wrong about? That Iraq is on a good path to constitutional liberty and equlity for it's citizens? Wrong about the proof of the war being about oil not being there?

And you are so adamant to make these claims - what makes YOU right? All you did was make a statement - with NO BACKUP as to WHY you think that way.

Please let the rest of the world know why YOU think Iraq is worse off now, that the people of Iraq do not deserve constitutionally protect rights.. and please let us know what PROOF you have that the war was all about oil.

So far - you provide none.

That my EU-nazi is NOT how a debate proceeds.

I too made a statement - but at least I provided logical reasons WHY my idea has MORE MERIT than yours.

I would have hoped you would have at least THAT much knowledge...


Hhahahahahaha, here he goes again, blblalalalala this, balalalallblb that.
Yes RC45 you're doing very well, :roll: :roll: :roll:

There have been more troops injured and killed than during the war, and
lets not forget those poor, poor ppl, RC45 thinks a,d cares about, what a heart... :roll:

[RC45]

I feel sorry for your family...they should embaressed of you...poor people

a guy(36) who is very low educated...must be the black sheep in the

family... :roll:

Really your mind works with "petrol"...maybe this is the only thing that

you are good at...driving automatic cars at 30mph... 8)
For keeeeeerisssssakes man - at least write in complete sentences and thoughts... Good God man......

Can you do anything except sound like an Aj Jazeera sound bite that is spouting absolutely useless rhetoric.... You have yet to post a response that is either on topic or factual.

What the fuck are you trying to say?

[ahmedgiyab]

I was hoping you stop beating the women in the neighbourhood long enough to actualy make a factual and intelligent statement.


Somebody is prejudice, go travel around and make some Arab friends, I have Arab
friends and the're really fun...just an advice, be more open to other cultures :wink:

Including or not including Israelis ?

As far as I remember...Israelis are Jews..???



and your point being ?

????

[Jabba]

I was hoping you stop beating the women in the neighbourhood long enough to actualy make a factual and intelligent statement.


Somebody is prejudice, go travel around and make some Arab friends, I have Arab
friends and the're really fun...just an advice, be more open to other cultures :wink:

Including or not including Israelis ?

Man Jabba, how can you even say that, don't know if ther's any use telling this but I also had a Israeli girl in my school a few years ago, and we are still best friends...
Why did you take that excample... :?

It probably means more to ahmedgiyab than you in that case..

[ahmedgiyab]

I feel sorry for your family...they should embaressed of you...poor people

a guy(36) who is very low educated...must be the black sheep in the

family... :roll:

Really your mind works with "petrol"...maybe this is the only thing that

you are good at...driving automatic cars at 30mph... 8)
For keeeeeerisssssakes man - at least write in complete sentences and thoughts... Good God man......

Can you do anything except sound like an Aj Jazeera sound bite that is spouting absolutely useless rhetoric.... You have yet to post a response that is either on topic or factual.

What the fuck are you trying to say?

By saying that "beating up the women" you judge a nation of more than

20 countries...including me!

You do that when there is nothing more bullshit to say????

Adults... :lol:

[Jabba]

As far as I remember...Israelis are Jews...or you ment Palestinians???

Please explain to me why you would think I meant Palestinians then ?

[RC45]

Some facts:
The US do not and have not imported oil from iraq since before 1991 (including post war iraq).
The primary importers of oil from iraq were france, germany, and russia.
The primary military infrastructure and chemical weapon stuff came from France and Russia.
They have proven that the russian govt, chiracs banker, the main opposition to blair on the issue, and several other anti war un people were illegally buying oil from Iraq as middle men (during the oil for food time period).
Saddam offered money to the familys of any suicidal bomber.
Iraq did at one point have wmd and refused to allow wmd inspections towards the end.
North Korea has China backing them up to the point where invasion is not an option.
Saddam commited genicide.
While the military has been there a long time we cannot simply just pack up and leave either. Someone must suggest a reasonable plan of jump starting the new govt, then we must leave. The new constitution unfortunately is useless unless we can get people to follow it.
The last time we were in iraq we did not invade, we did what we had UN approval for.
Halbitron has no link to Bush. It does have a link to our VP but even that link is something that hasn't been direct in the last 5 years. Furthermore, halbitron handled the oil fires and issues during the gulf war and already had a presence in the middle east. As such they could act quicker then other options.

I am not a Bush supporter. I do support the war as something that had to happen eventually. I do feel that once we leave Iraq we should quit being the police world wide and only keep our troops local.

Nice factual response.

[SPEEDKILLAR]

This is running out of proportions, we are talking about other for the moment being
non significant thoughts.
It seems we wont be able to agree on this subject, so lets rest our case, I'm happy
i could say my thoughts at JW , and hearing other ppl opinions :wink: :wink: :wink: See you all next time I HOPE :wink: :wink:

[ahmedgiyab]

I was hoping you stop beating the women in the neighbourhood long enough to actualy make a factual and intelligent statement.


Somebody is prejudice, go travel around and make some Arab friends, I have Arab
friends and the're really fun...just an advice, be more open to other cultures :wink:

Including or not including Israelis ?

Man Jabba, how can you even say that, don't know if ther's any use telling this but I also had a Israeli girl in my school a few years ago, and we are still best friends...
Why did you take that excample... :?

It probably means more to ahmedgiyab than you in that case..

What are you pointing at? (just to make it clear...I'm Hungarian...living in

Dubai) :wink:

[Jabba]

Did anyone else know that or did I miss something ?

[SPEEDKILLAR]

I am not a Bush supporter. I do support the war as something that had to happen eventually. I do feel that once we leave Iraq we should quit being the police world wide and only keep our troops local.


Well said :wink:

[ahmedgiyab]

As far as I remember...Israelis are Jews...or you ment Palestinians???

Please explain to me why you would think I meant Palestinians then ?

I think Israel was Palestine once... :wink:

And they are the only arabs there...

[jon_s]

lol, this post is growing at a rate of knots!!!!!

[graywolf624]

Adults...

I guess the fact that adults have wisdom and experience escapes you?

[RC45]

[
By saying that "beating up the women" you judge a nation of more than

20 countries...including me!

You do that when there is nothing more bullshit to say????

Adults... :lol:

Bullshit? You seem to think Iraq was just fine the way it was - complete with the oppression of women, and TOTAL lack of rights they suffered un Saddam for 35 years - so you do support "beating up women"... Unless I misunderstand your willingness to leave Saddam in power...

[SPEEDKILLAR]

lol, this post is growing at a rate of knots!!!!!

Damn you're right, didn't even noticed it was this much(4 ppl to blame :wink: )

[ahmedgiyab]

Did anyone else know that or did I miss something ?

ahmedgiyab is only a user name... :wink:

Living in Dubai for more than 15years... :wink:

[SPEEDKILLAR]

MMmmm its in the hands of JABBA to stop this from becoming a huge post :wink:

[RC45]

What are you pointing at? (just to make it clear...I'm Hungarian...living in

Dubai) :wink:

Well - it would seem you have spent your formative years surrounded by pro-Hussein supporters and have adapted their views...

[Jabba]

As far as I remember...Israelis are Jews...or you ment Palestinians???

Please explain to me why you would think I meant Palestinians then ?

I think Israel was Palestine once... :wink:



Yes and I think I bought you up to date on the history of Kuwait no longer being part of Iraq anymore...are you living in some sort of time warp or something ?

[SPEEDKILLAR]

"beating up women"...


Ooooh Its only in the Arab world they beat up women, now RC45 with the big heart cares also for the women, I love you man :wink:

[TT]

LOL I guess it's impossible to stop this topic.. or better.. we could stop this one, but as always in a couple of days another topic will raise the same old discussions :D

[ahmedgiyab]

[
By saying that "beating up the women" you judge a nation of more than

20 countries...including me!

You do that when there is nothing more bullshit to say????

Adults... :lol:

Bullshit? You seem to think Iraq was just fine the way it was - complete with the oppression of women, and TOTAL lack of rights they suffered un Saddam for 35 years - so you do support "beating up women"... Unless I misunderstand your willingness to leave Saddam in power...

Man! Have you ever been there???

I was there 6times since 1991...I have friends in Baghdad! This is what

you see on TV...

Saddam built up the country from oil...although he was an ass hole!!!

Schools, hospitals, highways, offices....all from oil export in the 60's!

I agree on the fact that the was an ass!!! But he accomplished something

for his people(not for the imagreted Kurds).

[SPEEDKILLAR]

LOL I guess it's impossible to stop this topic.. or better.. we could stop this one, but as always in a couple of days another topic will raise the same old discussions :D

Well If that happens count me out, once is enough... :wink:

[Jabba]

LOL I guess it's impossible to stop this topic.. or better.. we could stop this one, but as always in a couple of days another topic will raise the same old discussions :D

Your only worried because I am catching your post count up (in my dreams)...LOL....J/K....

[RC45]

Man! Have you ever been there???

I was there 6times since 1991...I have friends in Baghdad! This is what

you see on TV...

Saddam built up the country from oil...although he was an ass hole!!!

Schools, hospitals, highways, offices....all from oil export in the 60's!

I agree on the fact that the was an ass!!! But he accomplished something

for his people(not for the imagreted Kurds).

I have a lot more MilInt info commited to memory than you would want to know... [that's another story ...]

Wow - so according to you downtown Baghdad in the 1980's looked like downtown Dubai in the 1990's... :roll: - the coutry was prosperous and powerful - when in 1991 the USA just rolled in and smashed it all to bits for no reason what so ever.

Sure he built up the country with oil sales - WTF else is there? :roll:

But then I guess he attacked Iran in and started fighting with them - just because he needed real estate for a fw new gas stations.

You are living in such denial it is frightening - as you even claim to be MBA-level educated... :shock: :shock:

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Man! Have you ever been there???

I was there 6times since 1991...I have friends in Baghdad! This is what

you see on TV...

Saddam built up the country from oil...although he was an ass hole!!!

Schools, hospitals, highways, offices....all from oil export in the 60's!

I agree on the fact that the was an ass!!! But he accomplished something

for his people(not for the imagreted Kurds).

I have a lot more MilInt info commited to memory than you would want to know... [that's another story ...]

Wow - so according to you downtown Baghdad in the 1980's looked like downtown Dubai in the 1990's... :roll: - the coutry was prosperous and powerful - when in 1991 the USA just rolled in and smashed it all to bits for no reason what so ever.

Sure he built up the country with oil sales - WTF else is there? :roll:

But then I guess he attacked Iran in and started fighting with them - just because he needed real estate for a fw new gas stations.

You are living in such denial it is frightening - as you even claim to be MBA-level educated... :shock: :shock:

You are funny, no wait , you are a joke, yes thats what you are a joke
HAHAHahahahahahahahahah
You are the only one who lives in denial, you probably spend your days
with your computer locked in your room, man as I said go out and make some friends, see the WORLD, it's not all bad... :wink:

[RC45]

not a single mature word in response to anything.

It must be Tuesday...

[ahmedgiyab]

SPEEDKILLAR...nice comment!

'RC45'...Just one last word! You are too primitive to reply on your comments!!!

With the age of 36...you don't even know what happened between 1980-88???

Shame on you...

Iraq won that war with the help of the US...but never mind...no need to tell you

anything...Simply you are a Primitive Idiot!

Must be a successful man with this shity logic...won a quiz on CNN???

[SPEEDKILLAR]

not a single mature word in response to anything.

It must be Tuesday...

Hhahahahahaa, man how you keep up doing these kind of things, I know:
old+ no friends+boring fellow+no girl+ no car= a lot of spare time

This result shows us that you have so much free time, you constantly think
how not to say something stupid, wich you do all the time, maybe not on purpess(Yo RC45 is this written right :roll: )
As my English teacher once said, I shall trod you on the bottom :wink:

[666fast]

Oil Conspiracies :roll:

Please explain how spending damn near $100billion dollars on the war with Iraq is going to get us cheap oil.
If we wanted cheap oil, why the hell would we spend that kind of money to get it?

Speedkillar and ahmedgiyab, niether one of you have come up with anything that holds any grounds in this debate. You both have posted the same thing over and over again and don't answer any questions asked of you. Yet you somehow think you are smarter or more successfull. :roll:
When argueing, it helps to know what it is you are argueing about. Opinions don't matter one bit in this debate.
You keep calling this constitution bullshit, care to explain why? Or am i just gonna get insults thrown at me?

What I think is terrible is that people think Saddam should still be in power because he built schools and hospitals, etc..
Let me get this straight, if I build some schools and stuff, I'm free to do whatever the hell I want? When do I get my chemical weapons to drop on who ever I want. :roll:

Everybody likes to point out the bad things the United States has done. Those same people like to ignore the fact the many other countries do the same. Those same people also like to ignore what the United States has done for other countries.

Japan is about to hang a man, Shoko Asahara, founder of the apocalyptic Aum Shinrikyo cult, for supposedly masterminding the 1995 Nerve Gas attack on a Tokyo subway. I can't help but think of what the world would say if the United States were to hang a man.

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Damn, I think RC45 has left the building, couldn't take it any more I guess.

Maybe we were to hard on the poor old guy, well RC45 I still think you are wrong,
but for me you'll always stay that boring guy on JW, take care man, see you next time. :wink:

You too ahmedgiyab, It was a lot of fun with youn take care, see ya :wink:

[666fast]

old


Maybe compared to you, but in all reality, he isn't old at all


no friends


I can't comment as I don't know


boring fellow


He has managed to entertain me over and over again on these forums


no girl


He's married, I believe he also has chidren


no car


Read his signature. A Z06 and what I believe are two bikes.

It's amazing what one could learn if you would read instead of trying to insult others over and over.

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Oil Conspiracies :roll:

Please explain how spending damn near $100billion dollars on the war with Iraq is going to get us cheap oil.
If we wanted cheap oil, why the hell would we spend that kind of money to get it?

Speedkillar and ahmedgiyab, niether one of you have come up with anything that holds any grounds in this debate. You both have posted the same thing over and over again and don't answer any questions asked of you. Yet you somehow think you are smarter or more successfull. :roll:
When argueing, it helps to know what it is you are argueing about. Opinions don't matter one bit in this debate.
You keep calling this constitution bullshit, care to explain why? Or am i just gonna get insults thrown at me?

What I think is terrible is that people think Saddam should still be in power because he built schools and hospitals, etc..
Let me get this straight, if I build some schools and stuff, I'm free to do whatever the hell I want? When do I get my chemical weapons to drop on who ever I want. :roll:

Everybody likes to point out the bad things the United States has done. Those same people like to ignore the fact the many other countries do the same. Those same people also like to ignore what the United States has done for other countries.

Japan is about to hang a man, Shoko Asahara, founder of the apocalyptic Aum Shinrikyo cult, for supposedly masterminding the 1995 Nerve Gas attack on a Tokyo subway. I can't help but think of what the world would say if the United States were to hang a man.

Here we go again, "you said nothing,blalblbllla", please did you read everything, as I said It is not only about the oil, thats one reason, there
is a new world opening for companies,$$$$$o£££££.Position in the M-E,...

Common cut the crap, Bushy doesn't give a damn about those ppl.
He should solve problems situated in the US, like crime, etc...
instead of going to war and causing anger, pain and death

[SPEEDKILLAR]

old


Maybe compared to you, but in all reality, he isn't old at all


no friends


I can't comment as I don't know


boring fellow


He has managed to entertain me over and over again on these forums


no girl


He's married, I believe he also has chidren


no car


Read his signature. A Z06 and what I believe are two bikes.

It's amazing what one could learn if you would read instead of trying to insult others over and over.

Well, well 666fast to the rescue, I think RC45 is "old" enough to react himself :roll:

And btw you still didn't answer who that person is on your avatar.

[SPEEDKILLAR]

old


Maybe compared to you, but in all reality, he isn't old at all


no friends


I can't comment as I don't know


boring fellow


He has managed to entertain me over and over again on these forums


no girl


He's married, I believe he also has chidren


no car


Read his signature. A Z06 and what I believe are two bikes.

It's amazing what one could learn if you would read instead of trying to insult others over and over.

Oooh yes, now I should believe you, well guess what I don't.
Did you know I have a Pagani Zonda, 20 children, 5 wives,blabalbalabl...
:wink:

[TT]

Oh yes, although not involved in the discussion, you managed to get all wrong about RC45 LOL, as pointed out by 666 :D

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Oh yes, although not involved in the discussion, you managed to get all wrong about RC45 LOL, as pointed out by 666 :D

Well lets say that's how I think he is, and I based these thought by the way he answers and refusing to engage a conversation on both side's,
instead of uni-lateral.

[SPEEDKILLAR]

It's amazing what one could learn if you would read instead of trying to insult others over and over.


Ooooh, 666slow, do you know the theorie, action-reaction, for excample when ppl
insult you that your looking ugly, you say something back, logical no? If you have any questions just ask, btw whose on the avatar :? .Just say if you don't want to answer.
:wink:

[TT]

He already said who is the guy on his avatar (in the past).. it's basically some mister nobody he found on the net

[SPEEDKILLAR]

He already said who is the guy on his avatar (in the past).. it's basically some mister nobody he found on the net

Thanks for answering TT :wink: , but may I ask why???I thought it was :? him.

[TT]

Well I think because he is kinda funny :D

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Well I think because he is kinda funny :D

And ugly :lol: :wink:

[Junk2006]

I find it quite interesting that a bunch of white people are commenting on something they frankly know nothing about the only person after skimming through this thread that seems to know what he is talking about is the guy from Dubai while the rest of you are all fools commenting on something you know nothing about

[Jabba]

It's amazing what one could learn if you would read instead of trying to insult others over and over.


Ooooh, 666slow, do you know the theorie, action-reaction, for excample when ppl
insult you that your looking ugly, you say something back, logical no? If you have any questions just ask, btw whose on the avatar :? .Just say if you don't want to answer.
:wink:

First look at the confusion your own gender status has caused...listing yourself as a female (that has since been corrected)....and therefore obviously the picture you chose for your avatar wasnt you either. So why the big deal about the avatar 666fast has ?

I can confirm that RC45 is one of the few posting members here that is actually married and if my memory serves me correctly she is quite a babe as well....in addition there were some pictures of his young daughter as well.

Another case of getting your facts mixed up I believe.

[666fast]

Well lets say that's how I think he is, and I based these thought by the way he answers and refusing to engage a conversation on both side's,
instead of uni-lateral.


It's exactly what you are doing, you still haven't answered any questions RC45 has asked you. Are you going to, or are you just going to continue being an ass?


And btw you still didn't answer who that person is on your avatar.


How was I suppose to give an answer to a question you never asked? Besides, I don't know who it is. If I did, I'd tell you.


Oooh yes, now I should believe you, well guess what I don't.
Did you know I have a Pagani Zonda, 20 children, 5 wives,blabalbalabl...


Wow, you are so mature it's unbelievable.


Ooooh, 666slow


Wow, you are so clever! You must be the envy of all your friends! Dont' tell me you came up with that all by yourself? You are so funny! I can't believe how funny you are. Too come up with something like that, it must be pure genious. You are so smart, and so funny. haha It's so fresh, I've never heard that before! You are so funny. Got any "you are the weakest link" jokes while you are at it? :roll:


Another case of getting your facts mixed up I believe.


Sadly, it probably won't be the last time for him either.

[aliendude012]

Jesus Christ! Where did this thread go? I read as much as I could, skimmed some parts that looked rather useless. There's a lot of personal oppinion flying around here, a lot of misinformed people, etc. I expressed my opinions earlier on, and I feel its obvious that many of you agree with me. But what the hell do I know? What do any of us know? As much as I feel Bush's reasoning for war made no sense and must be covering a hidden motive, who's to say what that was? I feel it was for oil. No, RC45, we do not import oil from the middle east, or at least not much. We get most of it from right here in the South/Central Americas, good job. But oil is not a replicating organism. It will dissapear one day, and as of now our society(as a planet) is pretty much solely reliant on oil. We will need future sources of oil, which is why the oil from Alaska and Texas is mostly being saved. When the oil in South America runs out, where will we turn? Our reserves? America is a greedy country, why use something of our own when we can steal it from somewhere else? It'd be extremely convenient to have control of an oil reserve in the middle east. But thats just my opinion. I don't actually know what Bush was thinking when he decided to declare war on a tyrannical leader that his father created. Maybe he wanted to fix daddy's mistake? I dunno. And as somebody mentioned earlier, why would we spend $100billion on this war only for oil? Well, now I ask you, why would we spend that much on a war at all? World War I cost the country $32billion. We tripled that on a war that didn't last nearly as long, and we had even less reason for being in. Many have said it above, and I agree, we are not the world Police, we have things like the UN for that.



I find it quite interesting that a bunch of white people are commenting on something they frankly know nothing about the only person after skimming through this thread that seems to know what he is talking about is the guy from Dubai while the rest of you are all fools commenting on something you know nothing about


Thank you! I am not going to get into any discussions about the differences between Arabs, Kurds, Persians, and anything else. Nor whoall was happy with Saddams regime or who wasnt, what Baghdad was like before the first Gulf War, or anything else. The fact is, I dont know. I'm not there, I don't have any experience, nor do I know anyone personally who does. I could tell you that Saddam killed thousands at will. Which he may have, and in fact probably did. But I dont know if he did any good. and RC45, you have no right to say Al Jazeera portrays the news in such a way to brainwash its Arab audience into thinking certain things. You think when you turn on the news at night you're getting the whole story? You may be in local things, but when it comes to National and World politics/events/problems, we know next to nothing. We have a freedom of the press in this country, yes, but that doesn't mean they tell us everything. The press is free to tell us whatever it knows, but they don't necessarily know everything. So don't assume that because you're watching World News Tonite, or *gulp* CNN that you know more than somebody in Dubai tuning into Al Jazeera every night.



I'm not going to post anymore in this thread, its a waste of my time. I may come back and read what little bits of 'coherent' information you may like to attack me with, but don't expect a response. You aren't worth my time, and neither is the Iraqi war.

[SPEEDKILLAR]

Well lets say that's how I think he is, and I based these thought by the way he answers and refusing to engage a conversation on both side's,
instead of uni-lateral.


It's exactly what you are doing, you still haven't answered any questions RC45 has asked you. Are you going to, or are you just going to continue being an ass?


And btw you still didn't answer who that person is on your avatar.


How was I suppose to give an answer to a question you never asked? Besides, I don't know who it is. If I did, I'd tell you.


Oooh yes, now I should believe you, well guess what I don't.
Did you know I have a Pagani Zonda, 20 children, 5 wives,blabalbalabl...


Wow, you are so mature it's unbelievable.


Ooooh, 666slow


Wow, you are so clever! You must be the envy of all your friends! Dont' tell me you came up with that all by yourself? You are so funny! I can't believe how funny you are. Too come up with something like that, it must be pure genious. You are so smart, and so funny. haha It's so fresh, I've never heard that before! You are so funny. Got any "you are the weakest link" jokes while you are at it? :roll:


Another case of getting your facts mixed up I believe.


Sadly, it probably won't be the last time for him either.

Don't mixe up what i'm trying to say, 000slow, and look it seems the rat
has come out of his hole to give a little bit comment, well keep your
"smartass" 5 year old comments to yourself, you were'nt there to give any
ideas or comments at the beginning of this thread. It seems you only roam
the site to see if there's a person in distress and you can rescue, don't kiss
RC45 ass by coming to his rescue, you don't know each other in real life, right :? btw RC45 said he could do it by his one, you moron, next time read everything that has been written, not only when we gave remarks to each other, EACH OTHER :wink: and with no hard feelings off course.

[666fast]

Don't mixe up what i'm trying to say


I don't have to, you are doing it yourself.


or are you just going to continue being an ass?



000slow, and look it seems the rat
has come out of his hole to give a little bit comment, well keep your
"smartass" 5 year old comments to yourself



btw RC45 said he could do it by his one, you moron,


Damn, I predicted the future. I wonder how I knew you would just continue being an ass?


you were'nt there to give any
ideas or comments at the beginning of this thread.


That would be becuase I was sleeping and I have this thing called a job. A bit hard to join in on a thread when I'm not on the internet.


It seems you only roam
the site to see if there's a person in distress and you can rescue, don't kiss
RC45 ass


Yea, I roam the site. :roll: I've been here since the day it opened, been a participating member since. If anyone is the troll, you are. I'm not kissing anyones ass. You decided to post what is none other than an insult to RC45 using info that was completely wrong. I corrected you. Setting the record straight isn't kissing someones ass.


you don't know each other in real life, right btw RC45 said he could do it by his one


Just another reason I'm not kissing his ass. If I supposedly troll the boards looking to help those in distress, why the hell would I help someone who doesn't need it?

It's unbelieveable what a fucking hypocrite you are. You keep telling me to keep my smartass comments to myself. Yet, you continue to try and insult me and anyone else who disagrees with you. :roll:


next time read everything that has been written,


I did. How do you think I knew you have been saying the same thing over and over again without any facts to back up your claims?

[Junk2006]

666fast and Speedkillar wtf are you 2 arguing about if it is Iraq fine keep on doing
But by the looks of it you guys are just flaming each other
So I say this create your own thread or get back to Iraq

[TT]

Uhm.. the right way to flame eachother would be backchannel :roll: ;)

Anyway yes, I think it's time to do chose of the following options:

- go back on track and try to go on with the endless discussion (because there is really no end to it)
- let this topic die as the others in the past and wait for the next one to pop up ;)
- stay off-topic for another while untill the topic will magically become "closed" :D

[666fast]

Sorry guys, it started as a debate about Iraq, but quickly degenerated into flaming.
Instead of answering my questions, he decided to just call me names.

[SFDMALEX]

I kind of agree with aliendude012 last post.

In my view there defenetly was something behind this war that would benefit US. Now when people say they just went there to bomb just for peace sake and freedom of the Iraqy people I find that silly. First off American people would not want their tax money to go some place like Iraq half a world away to free some people from Saddams regime. They dont give a fuck, just like 90% of people on this forum and in the world in general dont give a fuck about what is going on half the globe away from our houses.

Now why US went there? Obviously the first and most logical answer would be OIL. It may be the reason, or maybe its not. We dont know.

My final say is that US did go there for some other reason besides freeing some people. They could have used that 100billion on something more productive on their own grounds.


Anyway Im not an expert on the subject of American politics, and this is only my view.





And PS. I got nothing against America or Americans. Im planing to move there. So you may consider this view as pro american.

[geekdiggy]

i knew this thread would turn into a double-digit page war

[RC45]

Well lets say that's how I think he is, and I based these thought by the way he answers and refusing to engage a conversation on both side's,
instead of uni-lateral.

I will "engage" both sides - but then we need to have YOU participate as well.

What that means is, that I as the debate starter, pose a view - backed by information that supports my view.

Then you counter with your view BACKED UP BY INFORMATION that supports your view.

Then I reply, and if I have information that refutes your claims - provide said information, bolstering my view, and reducing the effect of yours.

Then you would counter my points with further FACTS and INFORMATION that would counter my statements, there by bolstering yours.




That is how educated people debate.




What you were doing was nothing close - and there are a number of witnesses who pointed this fact out to you - but to no avail.

This actually quite sad - as it indicates the real lack of intellect that the majority of citizens of the world seem to possess.

If this is how you debate serious geo-political issues all is lost - How can one expect you to even come to a mature informed conclusion about what matters of the day that might be on a ballot that may deserve attention when you excercise your franchise.


What a waste of an education and a vote.

[RC45]

Sorry guys, it started as a debate about Iraq, but quickly degenerated into flaming.
Instead of answering my questions, he decided to just call me names.

I feel your frustration - I can feel the room temperature drop to these cretins IQ level (in degrees C) when they sign on to the forum....

[Jabba]

I was just waiting for you to make your post brembo...and you know I wont agree with most of it....however I do respect your opinions and it is indeed one of the better posts in this thread. 8) 8) 8)

I think its fair to say that everyone has had their say on this subject now and rather than repeating the same points over and over it might be better to finish it here.