Honda to quit F1

[autohabit]

Strong rumours now circulating.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7766092.stm

[HeilSvenska]

Makes sense...

[enzoferrari]

Not cool:-(

[styla21]

Its such shit news.

[Mattk]

I'm not surprised, and rather disappointing considering they had a good first season. They had the goods to be back up there, but clearly Honda is running out of money. Not much anyone can do.

[RC45]

Good - maybe this type of action will shake F1 managment into the reality.

[arguapacha]

They hired Ross Brawn for nothing? :(

[styla21]

I'm not surprised, and rather disappointing considering they had a good first season. They had the goods to be back up there, but clearly Honda is running out of money. Not much anyone can do.

Yes, but more alarmingly, is if Honda see it as worthwhile to pull out from F1 as one of the more profitable car manufacturers - what does this mean for the others?
Toyota and Williams may be looking grim also:crying:

[F250]

I hope more manufacturers pull out of F1. How much can Bernie charge the world to watch Lewis Hamilton play with himself?

[blue8]

To reduce costs next year, Mosley has announced a new plan concerning engines:
FIA president Max Mosley has moved in the wake of Honda's Formula One exit to lay out the terms for a drastically cheaper engine offer from Cosworth that will help reduce costs in the sport.

Teams will have the option of using the standard engine, building the unit themselves or, Mosley explains, "continue to use their existing engine, with the current ban on development and requirement for engine parity still in place (noting that the engine supplied will become the reference engine for output and other performance indicators and no engine will be permitted to exceed those indicators)."
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/72324

[bluedemon]

I don't think its good for the sport to lose any teams, especially Honda even though they were not very competive but they did have hope. I wouldn't be surprised to see Williams leave soon. Stupid economy

[Mattk]

I don't think this will be a permanent thing. Honda's left and come back before. They may still live on as an engine/parts supplier. When things pick up again, they'll be sure to give it another shot. They've got too much racing pedigree to just give it up.

[mts6800]

Bummer, but maybe not surprising. Honda must have been wondering when, if ever, they would become competitive. Nick Fry said there are 3 serious inquiries to buy the team.

Now Max wants to force all the teams to use a standard transmission next year, to save costs. Not likely to save cost pushing that at the end of the year. With the KERS systems well into design the teams will incur a lot of costs to adapt them to a different transmission. I bet the biggest teams will make Max back down on that one.

As for Williams dropping ot of F1, not bloody likely. Unlike Honda, F1 is Williams only business and Sir Frank is the toughest in the business.

Not good for Rubens unless he has a sponsor with a boatload of money.

[ae86_16v]

They hired Ross Brawn for nothing? :(

Feel bad for Ross too. I mean they promised him everything, guess it would've been better if he just went back to Ferrari. . .

[zeus_2011]

Typical though, as soon as F1 becomes exciting again, with various teams fighting for race (if not championship) victory, it receives a kick in the head in the form of a depression.

[Sr Mauro]

Now Honda fans can continue saying how good, fast and reliable are their cars and race cars ...... in 1993.

[pitfield]

I hope more manufacturers pull out of F1. How much can Bernie charge the world to watch Lewis Hamilton play with himself?

No, you're right, let's watch some overweight 50 Y-O hick drive around in circles for 2 hours instead.

[HeilSvenska]

No, you're right, let's watch some overweight 50 Y-O hick drive around in circles for 2 hours instead.

Try 4. And Nascar's pretty good if you can chew through the red neck image. Just good honest racing.

[Mattk]

I personally find NASCAR and similar such races incredibly mundane, but that's just a different type of racing. F1 is about making the best cars possible using as much money as possible; there is a lot more focus on the cars than the drivers. Cost-cutting may improve racing marginally, but it's not really what F1 was originally about.

[silentm]

if you can chew through the red neck image.
i really couldn't ... sorry i guess i'm a nazi that way ;)

[styla21]

Following Friday’s meeting of its World Motor Sport Council in Monaco, the FIA has confirmed details of the cost-cutting measures agreed with the teams for 2009 and beyond.

Changes for next season - expected to save teams at least 30 percent on their 2008 budgets - include a ban on in-season testing, limiting each driver to eight engines - effectively doubling engine life - and cuts in aerodynamic research.

Cost of engines to independent teams will be halved for 2009 and drivers must use the same engine for three consecutive races, with maximum revs cut from 19,000 to 18,000 rpm.

Following moves to equalise engine performance for next season, Renault have been granted permission to make certain modifications to their V8. All other team's engines will remain unchanged.

From 2010 all teams will be able to obtain engines for less than €5 million per season, either from an existing manufacturer or from an independent supplier, and all teams are likely to use the same transmission. Refuelling and tyre warmers will be banned.

The possibility of an entirely new, more energy-efficient and road-relevant power train, likely to include an enhanced KERS system, will be investigated for 2013.

Details of further changes for 2009 and 2010 are due to be announced shortly.

The full statement from the FIA:
The World Motor Sport Council met in Monaco on 12 December 2008. The following decisions were taken:

FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP

The following measures to reduce costs in Formula One have been agreed by the World Motor Sport Council. These proposed changes have the unanimous agreement of the Formula One teams, who have played a major role in their development. The FIA is grateful to the Formula One Teams’ Association (FOTA) and its Chairman Luca di Montezemolo for their incisive contribution.

2009

Engine

• Engine life to be doubled. Each driver will use a maximum of eight engines for the season plus four for testing (thus 20 per team).

• Limit of 18,000 rpm.

• No internal re-tuning. Adjustment to trumpets and injectors only.

• The three-race rule voted on 5 November remains in force.

• Cost of engines to independent teams will be approximately 50% of 2008 prices.

• Unanimous agreement was reached on a list of proposed changes to the Renault engine for 2009; all other engines will remain unchanged. Comparative testing will not be necessary.

Testing

• No in-season testing except during race weekend during scheduled practice.

Aerodynamic research

• No wind tunnel exceeding 60% scale and 50 metres/sec to be used after 1 January 2009.

• A formula to balance wind tunnel-based research against CFD research, if agreed between the teams, will be proposed to the FIA.

Factory activity

• Factory closures for six weeks per year, to accord with local laws.

Race weekend

• Manpower to be reduced by means of a number of measures, including sharing information on tyres and fuel to eliminate the need for “spotters”.

Sporting spectacle

• Market research is being conducted to gauge the public reaction to a number of new ideas, including possible changes to qualifying and a proposal for the substitution of medals for points for the drivers. Proposals will be submitted to the FIA when the results of the market research are known.

Note: It is estimated that these changes for 2009 will save the manufacturer teams approximately 30% of their budgets compared to 2008, while the savings for independent teams will be even greater.

2010

Power train

• Engines will be available to the independent teams for less than €5 million per team per season. These will either come from an independent supplier or be supplied by the manufacturer teams backed by guarantees of continuity. If an independent supplier, the deal will be signed no later than 20 December 2008.

• This same engine will continue to be used in 2011 and 2012 (thus no new engine for 2011).

• Subject to confirmation of practicability, the same transmission will be used by all teams.

Chassis

• A list of all elements of the chassis will be prepared and a decision taken in respect of each element as to whether or not it will remain a performance differentiator (competitive element).

• Some elements which remain performance differentiators will be homologated for the season.

• Some elements will remain performance differentiators, but use inexpensive materials.

• Elements which are not performance differentiators will be prescriptive and be obtained or manufactured in the most economical possible way.

Race weekend

• Standardised radio and telemetry systems.

• Ban on tyre warmers.

• Ban on mechanical purging of tyres.

• Ban on refueling.

• Possible reduction in race distance or duration (proposal to follow market research).

Factory activity

• Further restrictions on aerodynamic research.

• Ban on tyre force rigs (other than vertical force rigs).

• Full analysis of factory facilities with a view to proposing further restrictions on facilities.

Longer term

The FIA and FOTA will study the possibility of an entirely new power train for 2013 based on energy efficiency (obtaining more work from less energy consumed). Rules to be framed so as to ensure that research and development of such a power train would make a real contribution to energy-efficient road transport.

An enhanced Kinetic Energy Recovery System (KERS) system is likely to be a very significant element of an energy-efficient power train in the future. In the short term, KERS is part of the 2009 regulations, but is not compulsory. For 2010 FOTA is considering proposals for a standard KERS system. The FIA awaits proposals.

A number of further amendments were adopted for the 2009 and 2010 Sporting and Technical Regulations. Full details will be available shortly on www.fia.com (http://www.fia.com/).

[silentm]

Ban on refueling in 2010?

what the fuck is that supposed to mean? i want to watch an hour or two of racing not just 20 minutes

man i'm really irritated by some of those "changes"

if they want to homologate so much then we can just watch the VW Polo Cup

[styla21]

Ban on refueling in 2010?

what the fuck is that supposed to mean? i want to watch an hour or two of racing not just 20 minutes

man i'm really irritated by some of those "changes"

if they want to homologate so much then we can just watch the VW Polo Cup

Bigger fuel tank ;-) The racing could remain the same duration.
In order to lug fuel rigs to each race, they are put on a 747 and flown. Along with the team. It should save some $200,000 per race.

I see it as a positive. There will still be pit stops for tyres / mechanicals.

[Mattk]

But there is this problem:
Possible reduction in race distance or duration (proposal to follow market research).

They actually believe most people want shorter races. I, for one, do not.

[styla21]

But there is this problem:


They actually believe most people want shorter races. I, for one, do not.
Agreed. I don't want shorter races either. From what I understand, FOM is conducting quite broad market research on this topic. Hopefully the masses respond with the same sentiment we share.

[FoxFour]

Smart move on Honda's part. They can claim declining economic factors to bow out, saving face in the Japanese boardroom, instead of what probably has really happened, failure to get the team going no matter how much money they poured into it.
The new rules; start of a good move. This gazillion dollar budgets were started in the early 80's and has finally crippled the series. How many teams today have you seen been banging down the doors to plunk down the tens of millions of pounds to get a spot on the grid?
These engine rules are a lot like what F1 had in the seventies- half the grid back then had Cosworth engines and Hewland or Xtrac gearboxes. The teams can still build new engines but to much more strict standards. Limits on onboard engine tuning and stricter standards on aero research, good move also.