Euro Cars vs US Cars vs Nippon Cars - which are the best?

[karmann]

What do you think are (subjectively) the best? I believe the European Cars are the most sporty (lambo, ferra, koennigsegg, f1 and lots more)- almost the whole class of supercars is european made. the japanese cars are very innovative (the nissan skyline gtr34 - those gauges, Lancer VII evo - active YAW control), well priced and some of them are even quite nice! the US cars... well guys, don`t start stoning me;)... there was a time when american muscle cars from the 60s` were really nice pieces of machinery... but now they still use those OHV engines, 2 valves per cylinder which do 6 mpg (the new corvette C6)... come`on the world wen`t ahead a little bit... and the famous viper - is it such a problem to take an 8 liter engine from a truck and stick it into anything? not to mention the engine is still 2 valve per cyl;))) WHAT ARE YOUR PREFERENCES?

[jeroen40]

the style (design) definetly comes from europe although the americans are doing their job better and better, the relaibility Ã*s japans strongpoint, they just cannot brake down and all the innovative things are fun too

Now whe need a japanese car with a good design (new nsx?) and if it's gonna be cheaper or more powerful it can stand the european competition.
As for the americans, I don't know if their engines are that bad, the ford gt and some other new cars, have really good engines I think

I'm a fan of japanese and european cars, americans somewhat less....
not really one of them are the best

[TT]

Uhm... one of the oldest car related discussions :D my conclusion is that they are simply different ;)

[RC45]

Yeah - don't compare especially when you don't have decent facts.

Karmann your diatribe was a thinly disguised "American cars are old and useless" rant - and a poorly composed one at that.

But little do you know that the very car, the C6 (and it's predecessor the C5) DO have active yaw control and get 25+mpg.

And when the entire package weighs 3100lbs (1410kg) fully gassed up and ready to go - why would the 2v OHV 5.7l V8 powertrain bother you - when the car can still pull 1g, do 0-60mph in 4s, the 1/4mile in 12s flat, run to 180mph, lap the Nordschleife in 7:56 AND cost less than the CHEAPEST Porsche...

You get one helluva super car chum. which I am able to daily drive - something you couldn't say for a lot of the other "super cars' - they are just not that user-friendly.

(To the rest of JW : not detracting from the contribution Japanese and Euro cars at all - just setting this yahoo straight)

[karmann]

to RC 45:I just can`t stand those cars which are constantly fitted with (basically) the same engine (the 5.7l V8) over those decades; their constructors claim them to be so technologically adavanced (so what that the Corvettes are made of plastic?!, that they have active yaw as you so politely claim)- come on! the european/japanese constructors could take a hell lot more HPs out of a 5.7l engine than the jankees do! you may say that the advantages of such an unstrained engine are: durability, flexibility and reliability...?;)but there are more powerful engines (n\a and charged) which have those advantages!
don`t get me wrong - I love the deep 5.7V8 thunder noise, its lack of economy (ah what the hell, its the US)and the fact that its BIG, but the recipe of the rest of the world for making cars (with equal (or far far more)amount of fun to drive is just better in so many ways. The weight, the quality, the hp/litre power, the suspension, not to mention those personal feeling that you get! (that depends on one`s prefernces)
just look at the 70\80s US cars! you see them? ok, now look at european cars! see the difference? that is a BIG difference! recently the styling has improved(which is again my personal opinion) and we get some quite nice styled retro-like cars- the new mustang, the 300 series chrysler... its quite nice! nad I was very shocked when I first heard about the new V8 Cammer engine; 4v\cyl, DOHC - oh my God they have finally woken up!!!;)

[Nemisis8u]

come on! the european/japanese constructors could take a hell lot more HPs out of a 5.7l engine than the jankees do!

Go home ricer and never come back. Nissan Titan's engine is 5.6 litres and makes 305 hp. Dont believe me, go on their website and look for it. Toyota 4 runners is a 4.7 and makes 235 hp. You are obviously delusional

[BADMIHAI]

Oh man. This is obviously not RacingFlix. It lacks ricers. I'm so glad. If this were RacingFlix, the thread would've reached 10+ pages already ( 9 1/2 of which full of "my Honda has more hp/L). I think this thread is stupid. As TT and others have already stated, European, American ana Japanese cars are different. I couldn't say certain ones are better, because that would be ignorance. They all have their good and their bad sides. When will you understand hp/L is not what wins races. Hell...it's torque that wins races. And what matters is power/weight ratio, not hp/l. Of course a bigger engine will not have the same hp/L as a smaller engine. The LS1 however is a pretty damn light engine for its size, and the Vette is a light car, so American cars aren't all slow pigs.

[RC45]

To JW at large - I am only engaging in this debate to see just how little thise wanker knows.. ;)

to RC 45:I just can`t stand those cars which are constantly fitted with (basically) the same engine (the 5.7l V8) over those decades; their constructors claim them to be so technologically adavanced (so what that the Corvettes are made of plastic?!, that they have active yaw as you so politely claim)- come on!

You are extremely poorly read if you think that the Gen III LS1/LS6 V8 has much more in common with the previous generations of Chevy small block V8's than layout and displacement.

And yes - the Corvette is made of Fibreglass (actually plastic/fibre mastic.. but who cares ya?) and has been since day 1 and continues to as a demonstration of how a single car can with stand 50's years of history and still maintain it's strong following and eritage - world wide.

Why is Active Yaw control a good thing for euro/japanese cars, but apparently not good enough for you to elieve.

the european/japanese constructors could take a hell lot more HPs out of a 5.7l engine than the jankees do! you may say that the advantages of such an unstrained engine are: durability, flexibility and reliability...?;)but there are more powerful engines (n\a and charged) which have those advantages!

Name one - not hp/l - but actual production engine power output for a matched displacement. (oh and keep it in the same price range - because with enough money on the table all challangers will lose)


don`t get me wrong - I love the deep 5.7V8 thunder noise, its lack of economy (ah what the hell, its the US)and the fact that its BIG


Are you even aware what the fuel consumption of Italian and German supercars are?

They consume so much fuel, that in every country they are imported into, their owners are forced to pay excess fuel consumption tax. Please check facts before engaging mouth.


, but the recipe of the rest of the world for making cars (with equal (or far far more)amount of fun to drive is just better in so many ways. The weight, the quality, the hp/litre power, the suspension, not to mention those personal feeling that you get! (that depends on one`s prefernces)

Name the actual US cars and Euro/Japanese cars you think should be matched - and then lets see how wrong you really are.
No one here is claiming that US econocrap is better than Euro/Japanese econocrap.

Lets compare sports car for sports car. Please lets do.

just look at the 70\80s US cars! you see them? ok,

Have ever looked at the what the 70's/80's produced for Europe/japan? You may learn a lot - the ENTIRE world was in the doldrums - except for 3 cars - the top line Posche, the top line Ferrari and the top line Lamborghini - that's it. 3 production cars of note. (paraphrasing and condensing 25 years of auto history into a single sentnce - auto historians please forgive me.. ;) ) (at the level you are trying to talk about).

Even now look at european cars! see the difference? that is a BIG difference! recently the styling has improved(which is again my personal opinion) and we get some quite nice styled retro-like cars- the new mustang, the 300 series chrysler... its quite nice!
Again - what classes are you comparing?


nad I was very shocked when I first heard about the new V8 Cammer engine; 4v\cyl, DOHC - oh my God they have finally woken up!!!;)
And you think this is the first "cammer" engine ever produced in the USA?

as has been said already - "go home ricr"... :)

[Echo]

I vote for Euro... the fact that i own one doesn't hurt either!

[undien717]

I love euro and nippon cars. They both have very strong aspects. German cars keep pushing the lid in technology and performance while Japan is making stronger, more reliable engines. As for American cars, I like the old muscle cars much better so the new stang should be a pretty nice car.

[graywolf624]

its lack of economy

I missed the memo where 28 mph is poor fuel economy.

the hp/litre power,

hp/ ltr means nothing. The only thing important in performance is hp per weight. Wanna argue that the vettes 405 hp/450(est) lb engine is bad?


Just look at the 70\80s US cars!

Do realize that the top non exotic sports cars in the united states at that time were american. Must I point out that the camaro was one of car and drivers 10 best car for nearly half the decade. We can conclude one of 2 things. Either the sports market in america was very small.. Or the camaro was great.... Realizing a 79 camaro would handle like a pig and that while the 88 was great for handling of its time had only a 14.6 quarter.. perhaps you should consider the time period.

[oldsnail]

double post

[oldsnail]

i guess this is personal taste:
as for me
1) jap
2) euro

i bettter keep my statements to myself.
dont want to start huge debate. i am not bias since i once worked for bmw.

[AlienDB7]

Sometimes I wonder, will you be able to discriminate between euro, jap and american cars in 5-10 years? As we all know, gm and ford own a number of euro and jap car manufacturers. Similarly, mercedes own chrysler and renault owns nissan. There're more and more platform and parts sharing between different manufacturers. For example, the new focus, mazda 3 and S40 are all using the same platform. Should it be considered american, jap or euro? Beside platform, engines are being globalized too. The new engines used in future gm models were designed jointly with either fiat or opel. The 2.2 ecotec they're now was designed by lotus years ago. I believe mazda is responsible for designing smaller engines for ford now. Sooner or later, the difference between different cars will only be skin deep.

[graywolf624]

Sooner or later, the difference between different cars will only be skin deep.

It could be more so then you think. Dont forget the idea for the gm hybrid car recently. A car with snappable bodys.. Minivan for the soccer game, convertible for that saturday, truck for work.. the thing could be almost anything if they get the power at good levels.

[oldsnail]

Sooner or later, the difference between different cars will only be skin deep.

It could be more so then you think. Dont forget the idea for the gm hybrid car recently. A car with snappable bodys.. Minivan for the soccer game, convertible for that saturday, truck for work.. the thing could be almost anything if they get the power at good levels.

as for hybid cars itself.
only 2 manufactures have made it to mass production.
honda insight and civic ev
toyota prius and rav4 ev.

[Chingachgook]

They are built in a completely different way. I think there are Euro cars overrated, and there are Jap cars overrated.

[malaysianskyline]

japs - fun and cheap, great for track days coz its cheap.....
american - drag and the noise, classics are gorgeous......
euro - beautifull and best finished, superb engineering, an investment...... i'll have em all

[jeroen40]

japs - fun and cheap, great for track days coz its cheap.....
american - drag and the noise, classics are gorgeous......
euro - beautifull and best finished, superb engineering, an investment...... i'll have em allnothing to add 8)

[BADMIHAI]

What I don't like about this debate is that almost all of us base our opinions on nationalism, not on facts. BTW: How can you generalize a continent's (or even country's) car production as "bad" or "awesome". Don't forget that Japan, Europe and the U.S. have all had great cars (Skyline, Supra, F40, 250 GTO, Corvette, Camaro, etc), and terrible cars (recall Nissan Sunny, early Civics, Trabant, Pinto, etc.).

[yugo]

The european cars are best, and Honda. sorry but the US cars are the bad of the world.

[Arancia]

I know that with my post somebody could be hit hard...
but you can't tell me that European cars (as japan cars) are on the same level of american cars... I'm speaking about technology, not about estetic or efficiency.
Probably we need this technology while you don't, but the fact is that your cars are made with a old mentality.
You have Indy championship, while we have F1 championship.
Indy cars are the best expression of USA car tecnology, while F1 cars are the best expression of European car technology...
Have you never seen a F1 car and a Indy car?
Have you never compare them?
It's true that the tracks where they run are often different, but this is not a good reason to say that between a F1 car and a Indy car there is a crater.
Do you know someone be called Montoya or Zanardi, 2 pilots who have run with Indy and F1 cars?
They said that the F1 really is the best technology car in the world.
The truth is that ,for once, Europe and Japan can only learn you how a car have be made!!!
You are first in many things, but in the car world you are behind us!!!
As Cornuto said, Peace!

[graywolf624]

Indy cars are the best expression of USA car tecnology, while F1 cars are the best expression of European car technology...

Ummm.. No..

Indy cars are not the best of US tech by any means.

Name one technology on a european car that at least one american company hasn't used in their own model....

Heck I wont even count the portions of the conglomerates that are european.. Thus ignoring gm's ownership of vauxhaul, opel, saab.
Ford's ownership of aston martin, volvo, jaguar.

And should I mention the blurred line between diamler chryslers chrysler dodge and mercedes.

[brian]

it seems to me all these guys posting about "who's the best" have some serious inferiority issues.

[SFDMALEX]

Indy cars are the best expression of USA car tecnology, while F1 cars are the best expression of European car technology...

Ummm.. No..

Indy cars are not the best of US tech by any means.

Name one technology on a european car that at least one american company hasn't used in their own model....

Heck I wont even count the portions of the conglomerates that are european.. Thus ignoring gm's ownership of vauxhaul, opel, saab.
Ford's ownership of aston martin, volvo, jaguar.

And should I mention the blurred line between diamler chryslers chrysler dodge and mercedes.

I see your point on technology, but fords and diamler chryslers ownership of the manufacturers mentioned does not mean much here.

Because FIAT own large portion of Ferrari doesnt really mean anything. Its not like the big owners bring the technology to the smaller manufacturers.

[graywolf624]

I see your point on technology, but fords and diamler chryslers ownership of the manufacturers mentioned does not mean much here.

Because FIAT own large portion of Ferrari doesnt really mean anything. Its not like the big owners bring the technology to the smaller manufacturers.

Actually yes it does. It goes both ways. There are fiat parts on some ferraris.you bought the 50 year ferrari vid.. dont you remember the part about the dino?
The tech flows up and down. Or need I mention how some of the recent jags are almost the same car as some fords. Or that GM is using some lotus engines. Or that the mazda 6 uses a ford engine with a mazda drive train? saab sharing parts with the wrx? Need I go on?

[SFDMALEX]

I see your point on technology, but fords and diamler chryslers ownership of the manufacturers mentioned does not mean much here.

Because FIAT own large portion of Ferrari doesnt really mean anything. Its not like the big owners bring the technology to the smaller manufacturers.

Actually yes it does. It goes both ways. There are fiat parts on some ferraris.you bought the 50 year ferrari vid.. dont you remember the part about the dino?
The tech flows up and down. Or need I mention how some of the recent jags are almost the same car as some fords. Or that GM is using some lotus engines. Or that the mazda 6 uses a ford engine with a mazda drive train? saab sharing parts with the wrx? Need I go on?

True.

But anyone can see fords influence on Jag. Most new jags I see on the street have the quality of a taurus and look like shit.

[graywolf624]

But anyone can see fords influence on Jag. Most new jags I see on the street have the quality of a taurus and look like shit.

No arguements here. However, they have improved in reliability.:)

[Arancia]

Do you know that the Fiat Panda is the car of the year?
Do you know that the multijet technology was invented by Fiat?
Do you know that the engine of the most american cars in Europe are build in Europe with european technology?
The american cars, sold in Europe, are built with european technology, otherwise nobody could buy them.
While in USA you buy the same car that we sell in Europe, in Europe we buy American car especially made for European car market.
It's true that some car parts are used for more car models, but this hasn't the meaning that a car can be equal to another one!!!!

[graywolf624]

While in USA you buy the same car that we sell in Europe, in Europe we buy American car especially made for European car market.

Wrong on part one right on part 2. Realizing that every car has to be changed for the american market. our cars require different crash safety and emissions. Take my mazda for example. We are the only country with a 3.0 liter for this car. Most of the american car's engines are designed in and for the america market. In fact.. top gear has whined about some cars they have tested recently that werent changed over from fitting the american market requirements.


Do you know that the Fiat Panda is the car of the year?

I snickered the first time i heard it. and Ill snicker now.. clarkson was right.. what a crock of shit.

Do you know that the multijet technology was invented by Fiat?

multi what?

Your batting about 300 there man. This isn't baseball so that isn't a good thing.

[karmann]

Dear RC45...
1. I said that it is BASICALLY the same engine; what I ment was displacement and layout.
2. Yes, I am aware that the Corvettes` bodywork is, and has always been, made of Fiberglass (which is colloquially

called plastic). I may have made a mistake by choosing the chevy corvette to convince you that US cars are (were)

not technologically advanced, and of lesser value than the euro/japanese ones. The Corvette has always been the most

technologically advanced of american sportscars (the HUD display,its fiberglass (plastic) body, electronically

adjusted chassis and the LT5 engine in the c4 ZR-1 with 4v per cyl, DOHC and a very high (even for a japanese or

euro roadcar) compression ratio of 11,25:1!-it is important to mention that the engine was designed by lotus

people;).these things distinguish it from the mass of US carppy cars,of which some may be looking damn good (ex. the

1964 mustang) but underneath they are a junk (or a standart ford falcon - which is the same thing=crap)
2.the bmw m5 e39, the 1992 bmw m5 e34, the ferrari 360 modena, the tvrs (chimaera, tuscan, cerbera, 440r, 350C). I

gave you examples of the same (or less but equally fast) output power, hence the european cars make more hp of a

litre;))). the tvrs` are quite well priced - but you are right - the vette is a cheap car (considering its

performance).
3. none of the super or hyper cars was engineered to be fuel-saving, but it is very hard for me to believe that the

vette makes +25mpg(as you claim) - maybe when its running idle.;)
4.lets not compare econocrap because we both (i believe) agree that they are not really cars...;) ok here it goes;

the recent chrysler crossfire(which is technically the benz slk, for my sake;( ) vs the bmw z4, 1992 dodge viper vs

the tvr t440r, lincoln navigator vs merc g classe or toyota lancruiser, pontiac g6 vs subaru impreza sti or

mitsubishi lancer evo 8.how is that for a comparison? ofcourse, you can find what you desperately want to find in

any of those comparisons...!?
5. in the 70s (and 80s especially) the us designers have completely lost their style which was wery distinguishable

in the 60s (yes I like (or even adore) the 60s musclecars and the style of us cars in general!!!) - the american

cars became simply ugly, bad made (the quality) and with huge lacks in performance. the same engines (basically big

displacement V8s) had to decrease power, which is easy to understand, considering the 70s` oil crisis. The best

example is the camaro which had a 90hp engine in the 80s. look at the 1980s camaro and mustang- they are

mechanically primitive and simply ugly, period.the vette has always been a good looking car, even in that infamous

period.on the other side of the atlantic ocean, the bmw developed its cheap and eonomical m3 e30 which had quite

astonishing performance (not only than, also today). the merc came with the 190E with the 2.5l cosworth engine, the

audi had its quattro drive and the famous 2.2l engine. also, those mechanisms were beautifully packed - those cars

were just nice. the conclusion - the european engineers found a way to overcome fuel problems, so did the japs. the

supra, 300zx, and earlier the datsun z-series, are the best proof.
6.i don`t know if that is the first cammer engine, it may not be.its the first that shocked me that much.;)
7. The thing that make the car fast is its chassis, drag coefficient (Cx), the weight and output power. these last

two combined give the power to weight ratio, which is so important. I am aware that this ratio is the most important,

and not the hp\l ratio. But look at it the other way: a big engine weights usually quite much(even if its made of

light alloy). a big heavy engine with relatively small hp/l ratio decreases the power-to-weight ratio, thus

decreasing vehicle`s performance and handling. It is more profitable to equip a car with a strong(hp/l),

high-revving engine or charged one, but of realtively small displacement thus making the car both light and beefy. The best

example can be every TVR or LOTUS car.
PERSONAL CONCLUSIONS
All those opinions are my personal ones, and i do not expect you to agree with them.
I presume that as a corvette owner and a fan of those(?) you know a lot more about its history and technical aspects than me, but it

does not entitle you to humiliate or abuse me in any way. It is supposed to be a friendly forum, isn`t it?

[dylan99]

Europe is by far the best automobile maker/creator and the USA is more over the top, I mean what we can do with a 3 liter engine they need 6 liter. Car companies from Asia are from my point of view copycats.

[karmann]

lest not make it europ-us battle, ok? clarkson is enugh xenophobic and nationalistic for us all...;)! but come on look just at the diesel engines development - the MULTIJET(and common rail technology generally) technology which Arancia so gladly mentioned (and graywolf624 never heard of;))) is so advanced, and makes the diesel engined car so fast, economic, and silent. For Your information (i am talking to us people) in europe the diesel engines are also used to power passenger cars, not only trucks as in the US. In fact 60% of all new cars in France are sold with diesel engine!!!
I am a fan of petrol engines, and have always been a strong adversary of diesel engines, until I drove one with common rail! Its simply brilliant! Anmd cheap too!

[graywolf624]

gave you examples of the same (or less but equally fast) output power, hence the european cars make more hp of a

Lets compare cars from the 60s and 70s in america to european cars form the 90s and 2000.. then let us say the european cars are better.


In fact 60% of all new cars in France are sold with diesel engine!!!
I am a fan of petrol engines, and have always been a strong adversary of diesel engines, until I drove one with common rail! Its simply brilliant! Anmd cheap too!

And thus explains why I dont know about it. We don't do diesel. We arent allowed diesel for the most part because our diesel has higher particulates per gallon then yours and our emissions care more about things like sulfur.


the LT5 engine in the c4 ZR-1 with 4v per cyl, DOHC and a very high (even for a japanese or

Can you at least look at the c5?


but it is very hard for me to believe that the

vette makes +25mpg(as you claim) - maybe when its running idle

ok youve proved you dont know anything about cars. At idle a car would get worse mpg then on the highway. A car is most inefficient when on gasoline at idle.

a big engine weights usually quite much(even if its made of

light alloy

except the current corvette engine weighs less then similar speced engines from mercedes for example. The ls1 may be bigger.. but at 5.7 liters it is lighter then fords 4.6.
Do you realize that a pushrod engine is inherintly lighter then a overhead cammed engine. Did you also realize that overhead cam engines are not a new technology. They have been around for many decades.

[Leo_M3]

My favourite would defintely have to be the Euros.
American is great but Japs dont do it for me, they lack a proper prestigous image.

And gawd..........I HATE THE JAPENESE INTERIORS :shock:

[AlienDB7]

but it is very hard for me to believe that the

vette makes +25mpg(as you claim) - maybe when its running idle

ok youve proved you dont know anything about cars. At idle a car would get worse mpg then on the highway. A car is most inefficient when on gasoline at idle.

Do you mean he doesn't know math? MPG = miles per gallon. WHen you're idling, you're going 0 mile per hour yet you're burning gas. As a result, you're doing 0 MPG.

:mrgreen:

[graywolf624]

Do you mean he doesn't know math? MPG = miles per gallon. WHen you're idling, you're going 0 mile per hour yet you're burning gas. As a result, you're doing 0 MPG.

Smartass..;)
Actually.. if your idling and you pull the parking brake in neutural...:)

[nismodave]

I laugh at how europeans talk about the poor quality of American cars. Considering that renault and Alfa were so lousy they are not even sold in America anymore.

Volkswagens and SAAB are sone of the most unreliable cars sold here. You have to set aside half the amount of the original price of a BMW in case anything ever goes wrong with it.

America, Europe, and Japan all have great cars, average ones, and crap.

[Nemisis8u]

3. none of the super or hyper cars was engineered to be fuel-saving, but it is very hard for me to believe that the vette makes +25mpg(as you claim) - maybe when its running idle.

Well actually, the z06 verson gets 23 mpg city and 37 mpg highway. Compared to the s2000 which gets 24 city and 34 highway. For the vette that is damn impressive considering how the engine has almost three times the volume of the honda, 165 more hp and 207 more lb-ft of torque. This comes from last years Canadian International autoshow program. So get your facts straight please

[RC45]

Amazing .

The only ones ever launching these "American cars a crap" threads and attacks are actually anti-America at heart - and simply want to fight.

You want fight - ok - here goes.

I moved to the USA from South Africa in 1995.

I too was shocked at how "backwards and antiquated" everything was

Unless you were in a very large city, things like fibre-optic phone systems and debit cards and pay-auto-tellers were foreign concepts.

The TV signal is delivered by co-axial cable buried in the ground - and the cell phones were analog in nature with ground based towers - no satellite GSM based stuff any where.

And the sheer number of crappy econocars (Jap/Euro/Yank) was astonishing.

I was in shock.

Well - 9 years later I finally get it.

The answer : "who gives a shit"

LOL

And also "if it ain't broke - don't fix it" Why? Because that detracts from profits.

All those hundreds of millions South Africa spent in the early 90's ripping out the copper wire to lay fiber in it's place - would pale into insignificance when compared to the cost of replacing all the copper in the USA with fiber. So they (the USA) have been doing it as needed and when funded by private, profit orientated investment.

Sure - in that single aspect South Africa was 100 years more advanced than the USA with having fiber phone lines instead of copper - but there is more copper wire laid in just Houston than in the entire country of South Africa - so the sheer scale of economies needed to be cost effective is unbelievable.

The point?

If all the telephone users (200 million of more) were able to get their calling done with the existing copper systems - why change them? And then at whose cost?

Fast forward to 2004 - and much of the copper telephone lines are replaced with fiber - but the project did not require, as the South African one did - government intervention with funds to pay for the job - private industry did when the time was right.

The very same story is true of the co-axial cable TV system - slowly it has changed - as and when commercially viable.



Now - onto cars.

I despise econo cars from all corners of the globe - and especially US econocars - they are not only boring, but materially and technologically antiquated - much like the telephone network.

But you know what - that telephone network was the first in the world - the biggest and most profitable and helped spawn a new global age - the information age - and is being reworked as we speak - and just as a boring telephone switch is not as exciting as a Pentium4 PC - both have their roots in the same technology.

That US auto industry? The GLOBAL one, that is made up of the biggest and most powerful commercial enterprises in the world - the one that helped spawn a new global industrial age - the mass-produced auto age - and is being reworked as we speak - and just as a boring econobox is not as exciting as an Ferrari Enzo - both have their roots in the same technology.



It is possible to be "global" in your choice of auto interests - so that being said - I like the current Chevrolet Corvette, yet despise the current Chevrolet Malibu.

I like the current Ferrari 360, yet despise the Fiat (place any model here).

I like the current Dodge Viper, yet despise the Dodge Caravan.

I like the current Jaguar coupe, yet despise the current Euro-Ford Fiesta.

I like the current Porsche 996, yet despise the VW Lupo.

Do we notice a trend here?


Now - if someone wants to further sub-analyse - and say but the Lupo is better than the Chevy Cavalier blah blah blah...

The answer is "who gives a shit" - apparently not the people who can barely make a liveable wage, and need cheap transportation and can only afford a Cavalier - and buy it to get to work. They buy what they can afford and what is available.

You may wonder how many people? Well probably more people will buy Cavaliers than the total number of cars VW will sell in the entire North American continent.

And what does that translate to in real world terms?

This : Why would Chevy "fix what ain't broke" in economic terms.

Why spend money on something that didn't need "economic tweaking" as it is profitable just the way it is?

That is why folks.

So let's stop the "Jap vs Euro vs US" car crap - unless you just wanna hate on other countries.

Rather let's compare model of car to model of car... ;)

[RC45]

Dear RC45...
1. I said that it is BASICALLY the same engine; what I ment

[mostly crap edited]
blah blah blah
[/mostly crap edited]

I presume that as a corvette owner and a fan of those(?) you know a lot more about its history and technical aspects than me, but it

does not entitle you to humiliate or abuse me in any way. It is supposed to be a friendly forum, isn`t it?

Really? Well if it is a "friendly forum" then how about engaging what little brain power you have, and proof-read the drival you post first - to see if it in any remote way promotes friendship in it's presentation....

You might want to check for presentation and factual content while you are at it... as you really do not have a clue as to what you rant on about.

There - that's about as friendly as I get.

[graywolf624]

does not entitle you to humiliate or abuse me in any way. It is supposed to be a friendly forum, isn`t it?

Respect is earned not given. It is offly hard for people not to start attacking you when you pass off facts that are false. I can't say I approve of bashing but I would suggest you do some research before you post again.. Thus avoiding such things.

[karmann]

I read my first post couple of times. There is NO false content, nor agression. I am disengaging from this discussion, as it has became rather pointless and hostile. I bid you good bye.

[Nemisis8u]

I read my first post couple of times. There is NO false content, nor agression. I am disengaging from this discussion, as it has became rather pointless and hostile. I bid you good bye.

Yes, the ricer has left the building.

[Fishey]

Porsche...(Pre-996) but I like the boxster!
They have the best built car bodys in the world bar-none....

Jap cars are cheap... Not even new lexus (top end) have a full galvanised body :(
The same can be said for almost 99% of all other Jap cars..