Religion

[Zonda11]

This is not to offend anyone or put anyone down - Because JW is so international, I was wondering what religion everyone practices.

To get started I'm Catholic.

[twboy1999]

no religion here

but i do belive in god

[mrzonda]

Catholic

[RC45]

Instead of starting a bloodbath slowly, by asking whose on what side of the religious fence, let's just begin hurling insults at each other's mothers and get it into full swing... ;)

[Nasdale182]

I've got no one to look up to here. :(

[stracing]

parents made me a catholic but i don't follow that stuff.
friends ask me to goto church but its a waste of time

[geekdiggy]

Instead of starting a bloodbath slowly, by asking whose on what side of the religious fence, let's just begin hurling insults at each other's mothers and get it into full swing... ;)

actually let's just murder entire countries and stop beating around the bush

[RC45]

Instead of starting a bloodbath slowly, by asking whose on what side of the religious fence, let's just begin hurling insults at each other's mothers and get it into full swing... ;)

actually let's just murder entire countries and stop beating around the bush

... you may have a point - although for 4,000 years folks have been doing just that and STILL there is no clear winner... :D

[RC45]

No religion at all, just some BS in my eyes.
And religion is a lame excuse for starting war, and yes I'm looking at Bush. "It's god's will" eum wtf has he a golden phone next to the red phone, so that he can call "heaven"?

When the fuck did Bush say war with Iraq was God's will?
I must have missed that one - unless you are so illinformed you are now making up shit...

[crochico]

No religion here. I was catholic but some things made me not to believe. :?

[Fleischmann]

I'm catholic...at least I think so...

[TT]

No religion here neither...

[stradale]

I'm not religious and haven't been raised with a religion.

Well, there may be one thing: I worship the Diablo :twisted: :wink:

[jakaracman]

I belive in speed!

[Fleischmann]

Same goes for all those damn jews in israel about their "promised land". And the moslims with all their stupid bombings.

For my part you can believe in what you want, but don't use your religion as an excuse and don't force it upon people.

Just my 2 cents.


Very wise words there Thamar.
The same goes to the "Holy War" - it brings nothing, but pain and suffering, kids are raised to be fanatically religious and they are used to accomplish somebodys plans.

[RC45]

Listen to the undertone in his voice, in every single one of his speeches about the war the phrase "god bless us all" comes in it quite a few times.
And there have been speeches where he allmost litteraly said it.

Sorry but, preaching war & religion makes you an arrogant basterd who's plain simply is looking for an excuse to be an asshole.

Same goes for all those damn jews in israel about their "promised land". And the moslims with all their stupid bombings.

For my part you can believe in what you want, but don't use your religion as an excuse and don't force it upon people.

Just my 2 cents.

dude - get the fuck over yourself already - in no way shape of form has the USA attacked "in the name of God"....

"he has almost said it literally" - what a load of trash - because Tony Blair might say grace before eating, does that make the UK "religious fanatics at war"?

I am not even a US citizen, yet I can "read" your predujice against everything "not from your own bplace" - you hate the Americans don't you? - I mean in your above statement you were anti-Semetic and anti-Muslim - you also hate blacks, turks and pakis?

Racist fucker - disguising your bigotry as "religious objection" - whatever.

[godspeed06]

yea man, go eat some fucking waffles.

[Fleischmann]

I don't understand what president Bush has to do with religion...

[RC45]

I respect your opinion, I won't ever try to convince you into dropping your religion. But you have to accept that some people have serious doubts about religions, and you don't have to feel offended at all.
It's not like i'm laughing with you or anything like that.

There in lies the fundamental difference between the idealistic and the educated realistic...

I am not offended by your religious choice - or your objection to mine (which is actually agnostic) - I am offended and appalled by ignorance - and you have scored well on both my "offended" and "appalled" scales.

[gucom]

hmmm i dont think bush would be THAT stupid to say its gods will, i do think hes a moron, and i do think its wrong to use ANY religion as a motive to kill or harm ANYONE
but thamar didnt say anything racist, or atleast didnt mean it that way, he said its stupid of the israelis to kill people and keep them prisoners in their own cities because they feel they have the right to own the country, and that its stupid of the palestinians and iraqis to do suicide bombings in the name of allah

and please, please stay friendly to each other, ok?

BTW i wasnt raised in any religion, so i dont have 1

[godspeed06]

by the way, im not christian so i don't at all feel offended. and how the hell is that racist?

Listen to the undertone in his voice, in every single one of his speeches about the war the phrase "god bless us all" comes in it quite a few times.

what about your undertones? -

Same goes for all those damn jews in israel about their "promised land". And the moslims with all their stupid bombings.

sounds pretty offensive to me. kind of like me saying those "damn belgians", why don't they go eat some waffles? :wink:
now do you know where i got that from? :cry:
the truth hurts... especially when your an asshole. :lol:

[Vansquish]

I beg to differ... our moron of a president has made several religiously biased comments which in their very essence contradict one of the tenets of the American Constitution. Supposedly we have a "separation between church and state," but Dubya has been doing his best to finagle his way around that. He says, "God Bless" at the end of most of his speeches, he called the war in Iraq and against Al Qaida a, "Crusade", what if not religious is that comment? One of the things that really fried me recently was watching the "White House Menorah" being lit, and this massive attempt at winning over the Jewish American public by doing so. I don't believe that any president prior to Bush has done that. He is a racist, anti-semitic bigot, and the one thing I want more than anything else is to see him get the pedestal he's standing on get smashed to smithereens and see a proper president with at least half a brain.

I don't exactly believe in any sort of higher power, but I do believe in preserving one's traditions. My family is Jewish, and I guess that means that I am too. I'm more of a "cultural Jew" than anything else.

[godspeed06]

i kind of get pissed off when he uses the christian thing too because i am not one and i live in the bible belt so i am at odds with this ignorant stubborn ass shit every day. it still wasn't a crusade though. bush can call it whatever he wants, it doesn't matter, he's a dumbass. i think the point to be made is that we would have done it anyway. we would have done it with an agnostic president, a jewish president, an atheist president. it doesnt matter. we still would have gone to war. you can bitch and whine all you want about bush spewing christianity brainwash in all of his speeches. it really doesn't matter. the end effect would still have been the same.

[RC45]

I beg to differ... our moron of a president has made several religiously biased comments which in their very essence contradict one of the tenets of the American Constitution. Supposedly we have a "separation between church and state," but Dubya has been doing his best to finagle his way around that. He says, "God Bless" at the end of most of his speeches, he called the war in Iraq and against Al Qaida a, "Crusade", what if not religious is that comment? One of the things that really fried me recently was watching the "White House Menorah" being lit, and this massive attempt at winning over the Jewish American public by doing so. I don't believe that any president prior to Bush has done that. He is a racist, anti-semitic bigot, and the one thing I want more than anything else is to see him get the pedestal he's standing on get smashed to smithereens and see a proper president with at least half a brain.

I don't exactly believe in any sort of higher power, but I do believe in preserving one's traditions. My family is Jewish, and I guess that means that I am too. I'm more of a "cultural Jew" than anything else.

It is your constitutional right to differ in opinion and action.

That's the beauty of this system - and don't you ever forget that - unlike the 10,000's of citizens in Iraq that were summarily executed for having a differing opinion to Saddam.

Oh - my bad - that's not the same thing - that is why, as it was going on, it was Tuesday - so we must have been in Belgium where objection is selective and NOBODY had a comment about how Saddam Hussein conducted his bussiness - because he wan't doing it in the name of religion - so it must have been ok.

[ported_head]

no religion actually preaches war....and religious fanaticism is just a pathetic excuse to justify the obvious....you aren't going to get many supporters unless you tickle their religious nerve. and bush saying whatever he does in religious context is because majority of the people are religious, and it doesnt apply to you if your not and if you do get offended...well rat's ass.
and btw im supposed to be a Hindu...but then im an atheist

[RC45]

gucom, you read my mind dude ;)

RC45, I know, "god bless us all/america" is an expression commonly used. And that expression he shouldn't have used in any of his speeches about the war, or about terrorism. Because then he makes it a religous question.
We have another perspective on things like that, it's just the way how people think here. And if we think like that allready, then how about the islam-world?

What is the religion of your country? Your head of state? Your seniors of the judicial system?

Are there any archaic religious practices included in any civic ceremonies of institutions in your country at all?

[godspeed06]

no religion actually preaches war

christianity has been damn close throughout the years. in fact i think it has gone that far before, at least in a sense.

[gucom]

i know you would have kicked saddam out, im glad you did, cos he is/was really 1 of the biggest bastard on earth, but bush did mention the word crusade, and maybe u learnt at history that the crusaders were christians battling the muslims for jerusalem, i dont think that was the wisest thing he ever said.

and if its ur constitutional right to differ in opinion, why do you atart namecalling when thamar says something u dont agree with? and before calling sum1 racist, read the whole post and try to figure out exactly what he meant, ok?
thank you

[ported_head]

does christianity really preach against islam?? or is it just a matter of interpretation and implementation. and you do realise that when you have a head of state is a racist of any sort, then it isn't really a democracy

[RC45]

and if its ur constitutional right to differ in opinion, why do you atart namecalling when thamar says something u dont agree with

Why? My right to freedom of speech says I can - and it's not a matter of disagreement with his viws - it's a matter of disagreeing with his ignorant rantings...

but again, that's the beauty of the system - freedom of opinion - not freedon from opinion... ironically the same as freedom of religion, not freedom from religion which is what is happening.

Since you folks claim to know so much about the seperation of church and state in the context of the United States of America, I challenge you to read the US Constitution and see what it really says - and what the actual and original purpose of the text was.

You may be very surprised at how wise and forward thinking the founders were - but modern politcal action groups have actually bastardised the original intent of that clause.

Let's see who actually takes the time to learn something.

[RC45]

does christianity really preach against islam?? or is it just a matter of interpretation and implementation. and you do realise that when you have a head of state is a racist of any sort, then it isn't really a democracy

I am wondering what sort of trash you are being fed by the media... it is almost as if you believe the USA is on a racial conquest to kill all non-white, non-christians.... please tell me yo are just postulating here...

[godspeed06]

does christianity really preach against islam??

no.

and yes, the original intentions of separation of church and state are completely different from what people now believe separation of church and state to mean.

[Overmind]

no religion here :).

I basicaly don't realy care what everyone else worships, but the separation of state and religion is very important, thing just tend to go wrong if it's otherwise...

[RC45]

...the separation of state and religion is very important, thing just tend to go wrong if it's otherwise...

Do you have a set of laws/rules in mind to try enforce this? Does your country have an actual set of legal guidelines to accomplish this?

[kawa22]

Catholic cristian i believe in God

[gucom]

Why? My right to freedom of speech says I can - and it's not a matter of disagreement with his viws - it's a matter of disagreeing with his ignorant rantings

look, ofcourse i, being from europe, dont know everything about the US constitution, but here in holland, it says, freedom of speech UNLESS u harm some1 else with it, this includes racism, but also namecalling and that kind of childish stuff

And something else about US, someday sume smartass from the white house said, if ANY US soldiers are being brought to the international court of justice because of war crimes, we will get him back.
Now, what would that same smart-ass from the white house say, if the serbs would come to The Hague(thats where int. court of justice is) and get milosevic back?? thats exactly the same situation, and it shows just how rediculous some of bush's(yeah, the smart-ass from the white house) plans are

[Minacious]

:D
Religion discussions always brings out the best in folk. I don't think there could ever be a discussion surrounding Religion that won't turn into a heated debate. It's kind of hard when everyone thinks their Religion is the right Religion.
I can't get involved in this because I more than likely would touch some nerves.

For the record, I follow no Religion and believe in no Gods.

[veilsidebr]

i have faith and i believe in god, up to everything. But i don´t have a certain religion, i guess to stay with god alone, in my though, is better.

[corvette97]

catholic, i dont current any church but i do belive in god, i don't really believe in church, insted i have god in my heart

[godspeed06]

dude, you're not much of a catholic. you're a hardcore protestant.

[Chingachgook]

I believe in God, and when I was in trouble I felt His help, it was a fantastic sensation. Actually I don't go too much to the Church... :oops:

[SamuraiGti]

Catholic =)

[corvette97]

dude, you're not much of a catholic. you're a hardcore protestant


let's say that here in my country the ppl related to the church have been doing bad shit, corruption and shit, that why i dont believe the "church" you know i mean as a building, as a place i should respect, cuz' the ppl on the head of the church are bad ppl (except the headmaster), i do believe in catholic church tho, i attend catholic activities, not on regular basis but i do,

[godspeed06]

oh...

[jpatino03]

I'm an atheist, but its really up to each person to decide what he beleives. I'm not going to push my beleifs on others.

[Zonda11]

Ya- i see that there is reasoning behind every choice of religion. Many people on here were raised a certain way, but an equally large amount of people don't believe in anything at all. I hope that my values/morals are the correct ones and that I'm believing in the true God. But is there really any way for me to no this, of course not. I just hope that when I leave this earth, I find out that there was a point to all that I believe in. I just hope that there is somewhere i go after this life whether its heaven or another life, is not my concern. I just hope that everything here on this earth is not just about science - but something more.

[ported_head]

RC 45: if you take a minute to look back and make a list of every country that USA has attacked in the recent past..what do you get? non-white, non-christian..people...and i dont get influenced by what the media has to say...i have my own opinion and a strong one that too.... and another thing..you just keep swinging between extremes ...unless you are doing any of this for a certain sort of acquired coolness that the brits are famous for...you got some issues

[RC45]

if you somehow think that the whites of the world are after the non-whites of the world - you are the problem.

please grow up.

[BADMIHAI]

RC 45: if you take a minute to look back and make a list of every country that USA has attacked in the recent past..what do you get? non-white, non-christian..people...and i dont get influenced by what the media has to say...i have my own opinion and a strong one that too.... and another thing..you just keep swinging between extremes ...unless you are doing any of this for a certain sort of acquired coolness that the brits are famous for...you got some issues

What about Yugoslavia? How is that a non-white, non-christian country?

For the record: I was baptised Orthodox, but I'm an atheist.

[Kangaroo Boy]

hardcore protestant.

[ported_head]

well what i was trying to say is that has been the trend for whatever anti social activities that these countries might harbour....but it is these countries so because they have been deprived of a basic human conditions. easy for you to say RC 45 when drive a Vette and got a RC 45 to ride around occasionally. the deal is that i have grown up....but the rest of the world hasn't especially whites....im sorry if i seem to be resorting to apartheid....but whatever country i have been to so far has been racist...Germany being one of them and so is Australia and so is UK...and RC aren't you a brit. just because you are in your late 30s doesnt mean you have more wisdom then a 20 yr old.... lighten up dude... or stick a firecracker somewhere to help you do that.

as far as Yugoslavia goes..the only reason US gives a rat's ass about Yuoslavia is because of their political and economic ties with industrialized europe. and NATO bombed Kosovo because Milosovic was a jackass and had nothing to do with racism.

[RallyeNLD]

I'm a Tifosi. I believe in BHP Torque and everything with a prancing horse on the engine cover. 8)

How boring would it be when everyone was a christian or jew or muslim etc.

And, I'm just curious, In which way are Germany, Australia and the UK racists?

[Kangaroo Boy]

well what i was trying to say is that has been the trend for whatever anti social activities that these countries might harbour....but it is these countries so because they have been deprived of a basic human conditions. easy for you to say RC 45 when drive a Vette and got a RC 45 to ride around occasionally. the deal is that i have grown up....but the rest of the world hasn't especially whites....im sorry if i seem to be resorting to apartheid....but whatever country i have been to so far has been racist...Germany being one of them and so is Australia and so is UK...and RC aren't you a brit. just because you are in your late 30s doesnt mean you have more wisdom then a 20 yr old.... lighten up dude... or stick a firecracker somewhere to help you do that.

You've been to Australia?How is Australia Racist?Australia is the most Multi cultural countrys in the world.

[stradale]

as far as Yugoslavia goes..the only reason US gives a rat's ass about Yuoslavia is because of their political and economic ties with industrialized europe. and NATO bombed Kosovo because Milosovic was a jackass and had nothing to do with racism.

So the NATO bombed Kosovo? If they did, then that's a strange way of ending suppression and preventing another genoicde by the Serbs in Kosovo. Well, Belgrade isn't in Kososvo. It clearly had more to do with the failure in Srebrenica and Ruanda than with the political and economical ties with Europe, which were hardly existent. Of course it also has to do with stabilising a region that has been troubled since the Ottoman reign.

[ported_head]

majority of the people fortunately aren't racist...and i do respect that.... even in australia people have been very nice...very courteous.... but there were a few people who were indifferent and racist... and i wouldn't bother going into the details..because it would be my word against yours. even in germany..people do act differently against people with a darker skin...and mine is... because im an indian...especially in university campuses. UK well i dont need to say much..they ruled my country for quite a few years...and they still think they can ride india's ass. but they do need a reality check. once again...my opinions need not hurt the general public... just the few that ive had bad experiences with. just for the record... USA has been one of the most hospitable countries ive visited.

[stradale]

There are racists in every country. Do you think your country if free of racists? I can imagine that some people of the older generations could be judgemental about Brits. Judging a country by a few of its inhabitants, as you did with Australia is generalization. Racism is an extreme form of generalization, so be careful with that. Especially when you're accusing others of doing so.

[RallyeNLD]

Very often there is an culture clash. On a smaller scale you have even got that between states. Just respect each other. You don't have to give up your culture, though you have to embed yourself in the envoirement.

[ported_head]

never generalised the whole country..i made it very clear that what was prevalent was due to a few people... and no my country is not racist.... not bragging...just that the illiterate and the uneducated actually look up to the fairer skinned people... even though we were ruled ruthlessly by them for many years. an aftermath and being judgemental are two different things..so be careful with that.

and racism is a form of objective generalisation and not subjective so i don't see how my statement could in any for be offensive

[RC45]

ported_head - Poor you, you are oppressed and held back because you are dark skinned. All the wealth and power in the world belongs to the whites - and they will do anything to keeo the darks from rising up....

First off, aren't you from India? So - are you a product of positive discrimmination, and as a result an educated Dalit, or as a Brahman did you pretty much inherit the opportunites you enjoyed thrust upon you.

Unless the following quote is untrue:

But with all this positive discrimination policy, most of the communities who were low in the caste hierarchy remain low in the social order even today. And communities who were high in the social hierarchy remain even today high in the social hierarchy. Most of the degrading jobs are even today done by the Dalits, while the Brahmans remain at the top of the hierarchy by being the doctors, engineers and lawyers of India.


You my friend, are in for a rude awakening - YOUR attitude is what is perpetuating this "apartheid" (what an irony you use that word - I am a South African living in the USA).

How is it I say your attitude is perpetuating this - simple - as long as you feel the need to "fight" the oppresive whites of the world, there will be a battle.

Why don't you get over yourself already - and move on - these race based conflicts are mostly concentrated in less developed/developing countries - and are fueled without much international sponsorship - In reality the locals many time ask for international intevention.

And before you try blame my "success" on my whiteness - know this - I grew up in relatively lower middle class household, and have managed to work my way to where I am - literally from nothing. My folks didn't even have the means to pay or borrow for my education.

[Overmind]

...the separation of state and religion is very important, thing just tend to go wrong if it's otherwise...

Do you have a set of laws/rules in mind to try enforce this? Does your country have an actual set of legal guidelines to accomplish this?

yes, well I don't know what it's like in your country, but here goverment != church, nuf said. what I mean is that we don't have a great parlament (in fact I find it to be full of dickheads), but I'm more than sure it is not guided by the religion intentions.

[gucom]

You've been to Australia?How is Australia Racist?Australia is the most Multi cultural countrys in the world

sure dude have u seen those camps in which they keep (illegal) immigrants?
in the middle of the desert, in the fuckin heat, their life is worse than where they came from, and they didnt leave that place cos it was so much fun there

[ported_head]

dear RC 45: must be some form of literature that you rely on your quotes for, but the only difference being that i dont rely on a 50 cent photocopy from a $50 book...this is where i live..and is way more accurate than the book you rely on. the Dalits were a big issue..not anymore...because they have all sorts of reservations to help them come up the social ladder..so much so..that your so called ladder head gracing brahmins are well left behind. and i am a brahmin..and i am born in a middle class family too..and i work for everything that i want..including my education. and funny you should say that i should move on...because it's the very same attitude that provokes this sort of behaviour...so i should just adapt myself to whatever is going on..and expect nobody else to change. apartheid is not something i keep obsessing about all day... i have better things to do...it's something that came up in this thread..and i happen to feel very strongly about.

and you want cheap literature quotes...i will give you some...south africa happened to be one of the countries where racial discrimination was institutionalised... where any protest against these laws were dealt with penalties and punishments...obviously these things are the past...way back in 1953.... around the same time when dalits were being oppressed. and this was a long time ago...incase you haven't noticed. things have changed.

and that was exactly my point...attitude has changed..but we still have a path tread.,,and it's my opinion..based on my experiences...and need not be true for you. and you may have dealt with whatever hardships in your life...and everybody has... but i see no point in reminiscing about the past... as you seem to think i create a hue and cry about the whole thing.

maybe you need more expensive books to rely on..ignoramus

[scubywrxr]

You are all fucked when Jesus comes back ! :twisted: J/K

[Kangaroo Boy]

You've been to Australia?How is Australia Racist?Australia is the most Multi cultural countrys in the world

sure dude have u seen those camps in which they keep (illegal) immigrants?
in the middle of the desert, in the fuckin heat, their life is worse than where they came from, and they didnt leave that place cos it was so much fun there

sure..Its like 3 star motel out there.They get Food,Water,A hut with Air con,Clothes etc.They come here with disease and get treated for it.And they are Illegal and my taxs pay for it.And the government tries to ship them back,and they just don't want to go.And no there life before in Indonesian was worse back there.Really,You don't go to country in a crap wooden boat and think that you going to live here because it doesn't work like that,.And they know it.

[RC45]

dear RC 45: must be some form of literature that you rely on your quotes for, but the only difference being that i dont rely on a 50 cent photocopy from a $50 book...this is where i live..and is way more accurate than the book you rely on. the Dalits were a big issue..not anymore...because they have all sorts of reservations to help them come up the social ladder..so much so..that your so called ladder head gracing brahmins are well left behind. and i am a brahmin..and i am born in a middle class family too..and i work for everything that i want..including my education. and funny you should say that i should move on...because it's the very same attitude that provokes this sort of behaviour...so i should just adapt myself to whatever is going on..and expect nobody else to change. apartheid is not something i keep obsessing about all day... i have better things to do...it's something that came up in this thread..and i happen to feel very strongly about.

and you want cheap literature quotes...i will give you some...south africa happened to be one of the countries where racial discrimination was institutionalised... where any protest against these laws were dealt with penalties and punishments...obviously these things are the past...way back in 1953.... around the same time when dalits were being oppressed. and this was a long time ago...incase you haven't noticed. things have changed.

and that was exactly my point...attitude has changed..but we still have a path tread.,,and it's my opinion..based on my experiences...and need not be true for you. and you may have dealt with whatever hardships in your life...and everybody has... but i see no point in reminiscing about the past... as you seem to think i create a hue and cry about the whole thing.

maybe you need more expensive books to rely on..ignoramus

I must have really hit nerve there... poor, poor, poor you....

[zevolv]

You've been to Australia?How is Australia Racist?Australia is the most Multi cultural countrys in the world.

You think so? I'm going to doubt that. I'm just going to ignore the fact that we have states here with more people than Australia and accept that we must not have nearly as many cultures as your country.

[ahmedgiyab]

The war in Iraq was obviously because of the oil...money talks...and bush in not exception...

The US only helps the countries which have enough oil to satisfy bush and his "family"... :wink:

It has nothing to do with religion...

[RC45]

The war in Iraq was obviously because of the oil...money talks...and bush in not exception...

The US only helps the countries which have enough oil to satisfy bush and his "family"... :wink:

It has nothing to do with religion...

Count your blessings - if the world didn't need oil, you and your nation would be as impoverished and starving as Ethiopia... I bet you guys don't want the world to switch to solar energy...

[Zonda11]

It wouldn't be reliable enough!!

[RC45]

It wouldn't be reliable enough!!

uhm..ecasue the sun doesn't shine at night?

No wonder the kanuks rely on the USA for breathing instructions :lol: - one would store the energy in batteries, foo... hehe ... ;)