picture editing - stmoritzer need some help

[stmoritzer]

In the recent posts, some of you (dingo, TT) mentioned the lack of picture qualityy in my recent posts.
Fact is , the Ferrarimeeting posts ( Enzos, Mountainpass with glacier & the Palace hotel post) are the first ones editied with Photoshop.
Before I used PaintShopPro to edit my pics.
In the last post TT even thought about some problems with my camera/filter, so far I haven't noticed big differencies.

Well, to find out if I'm a beginner in Photoshop and/or the camera has a problem, I posted 3 sample picture (originals) and would like to ask for some comments from your side.

originals
http://serv2.imagehigh.com/imgss/4039374_DSC01535.th.jpghttp://serv2.imagehigh.com/imgss/4039380_DSC01546.th.JPGhttp://serv2.imagehigh.com/imgss/4039392_DSC01561.th.jpg

http://www.savefile.com/files/148537


Below you see the results either in Photoshop and PaintShopPro. I have to say, the Enzo pic was done against the sun and I wanted to get rid of the shadow, which of course ended in a noisier picture, I guess it was too much :wink:

Photoshop
http://img157.imagevenue.com/loc421/th_05079_Dsc01535c_122_421lo.jpg (http://img157.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=05079_Dsc01535c_122_421lo.jpg)http://img16.imagevenue.com/loc451/th_05131_DSC01546c_122_451lo.jpg (http://img16.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=05131_DSC01546c_122_451lo.jpg)http://img148.imagevenue.com/loc599/th_05901_DSC01561craw_122_599lo.jpg (http://img148.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=05901_DSC01561craw_122_599lo.jpg)



PaintshopPro
http://img108.imagevenue.com/loc564/th_57122_origDSC015351600_122_564lo.JPG (http://img108.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=57122_origDSC015351600_122_564lo.JPG )http://img43.imagevenue.com/loc330/th_57133_origDSC01546_122_330lo.JPG (http://img43.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=57133_origDSC01546_122_330lo.JPG)htt p://img143.imagevenue.com/loc532/th_57144_origDSC01561_122_532lo.JPG (http://img143.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=57144_origDSC01561_122_532lo.JPG)


Would be nice to read some comments and /or see some sample editing by some of you JW carphotographers

Thanks in advance

[ZondaC12]

Links of originals pictures don't seem to work :(

BTW, I really prefer photoshop pictures than paintshop one.
But by lighting dark parts of the picture, you make appear a lot of "noise", we can clearly see it on the Enzo photoshoped (on its right side) :wink: You can use programs like Neat Image, it's very usefull, but you will have to put a little more contrast :)

[c0wb0y007]

Hi stMoritzer,

I already had an idea of what the prob was before I took a look at one of your pics :D


If I were you, I wouldn't turn to other photo editing software that fast. Your pictures are grainy, that's for sure. I link that to the iso/asa setting of your camera. According you are using a very nice camera I won't blame the camera either :-) I mean, I don't think there is something wrong with your shooter.

The example images you have posted above are made with very nice weather condition... lots and lots of light. just check what the iso/asa setting was during that session. It looks like it was set at 600-800, when you combine that with a very high shutterspeed you get those grainy images.

My advise is:

- Check you Iso setting, you should use 100 or 200.

- Further on I want to advise you to step away from shooting with very high shutter speeds. Why would you shoot at ... lets say 1/300 ? No need for that, just go for shutterspeeds around 1/30 - 1/80. The result will be completely different. You will end up with brightly lit pictures full of detail !!! There are lots of peeps who are afraid, when using low shutterspeeds, to end up with blurry images. To be honest, I don't understand how it is possible ending up with an unsharp picture when the object you snap isn't moving.

The first thing I did after I had bought my D70 (my first SLR) was checking the manual just to figger out which program would suit me the most.


Let me know what you think of it ! You may always send me a pm as well.

Good Luck


Cheers

[davide]

I just realised a few days ago what ISO can really do to your pictures so from now I try to shoot with as low ISO as possible and as cowboy says, a suitable shutter speed.

Sometimes I shoot same picture but just with a different ISO just to get one right :)

You shoot some really nice pictures stmoritzer, keep it up!

[TT]

Yep as said, the original pics are terribly noisy, for sure because you don't block ISO at the lowest setting (a must IMO) and let the camera decide. Some cameras, go figure, raise the ISO setting even in full sun :( depending on which mode you're using.

You should have some P or partially manual mode where you can at least set stuff like no flash and ISO at 50 / 100. That will help already greatly, and of course as said, try to shoot at slower speeds when possible. Actually if you're like me, 1/30 will be too slow LOL, but 1/60 to 1/80 are easily manageable.

[davide]

Btw, I can't get my 350D below 100 ISO and I don't believe you can either or am I wrong?

[stmoritzer]

WTF with imagehigh? Uploaded the original pics again, maybe you guys have a look at them and may even post some of your edited ones with comments how you did it.

http://www.savefile.com/files/148537

Thanks for your comments so far, you mainly focused on the ISO setting, which was at 200 and therefore pretty ok. :bah:

Links of originals pictures don't seem to work :(

BTW, I really prefer photoshop pictures than paintshop one.
But by lighting dark parts of the picture, you make appear a lot of "noise", we can clearly see it on the Enzo photoshoped (on its right side) :wink: You can use programs like Neat Image, it's very usefull, but you will have to put a little more contrast :)

Link is working now, 3 files uploaded to savefile.com :)

Why do you prefer PS over PSP?

I know Neatimage, but hardly used it so far, loss of sharpness :bah:




Hi stMoritzer,
......
. lots and lots of light. just check what the iso/asa setting was during that session. It looks like it was set at 600-800, when you combine that with a very high shutterspeed you get those grainy images. .....

Let me know what you think of it ! You may always send me a pm as well.
Good Luck
Cheers

Thanks for the reply, I may come back to your offer after some testing.

I checked again, since I always use ISO 200 (90%) or lower
and the Enzo picture has ISO 200, shutter speed of 250 with F5.6
the the other two have also ISO200, a 1/250sec with F4.5

I'll try your hint with the shutterspeed, IMO below a 1/60sec also static pics could be blurry :wink:


I just realised a few days ago what ISO can really do to your pictures so from now I try to shoot with as low ISO as possible and as cowboy says, a suitable shutter speed.

Sometimes I shoot same picture but just with a different ISO just to get one right :)

You shoot some really nice pictures stmoritzer, keep it up!

Thanks davide :)



Yep as said, the original pics are terribly noisy, for sure because you don't block ISO at the lowest setting (a must IMO) and let the camera decide. Some cameras, go figure, raise the ISO setting even in full sun :( depending on which mode you're using.

You should have some P or partially manual mode where you can at least set stuff like no flash and ISO at 50 / 100. That will help already greatly, and of course as said, try to shoot at slower speeds when possible. Actually if you're like me, 1/30 will be too slow LOL, but 1/60 to 1/80 are easily manageable.

I never use automatic -mode!, ISO is set to 200 mostly like for these pics ... I'll try the lower shutterspeed but as you, below 1/60 is often blurry :wink:

[stmoritzer]

besides the camera/original quality

now since the originals are up, I wonder what your result in PS or PSP would be, if you find some spare time 8)

[Darkel]

Well, having also used this camera for more than a year, I never used ISO200 or higher, anyway 100 should be perfect for a sunny day like that, and you don't even have to worry about the depth of field with a small sensor.
I've just had a look at the originals and 200 already seems to be grainy.

However, a friend of mine fucked up an entire shoot (those open doors @ the local airforce base) because of a cheap (read : "no need to sell your kidney for those pro ones") UV filter; the fact that you use it with the polarizer could explain a drop of quality. This guy ended up with grainy and out of focus shots with perfect light conditions and low ISO settings.

I'm not sure though, so my advice would be to try without the UV filter and compare the results.

[TT]

NeatImage is useful but only if used BEFORE the rest of the editing, most important, before resizing.

As for ISO 200, on a reflex it won't be a prob, on a compact it's too much and you should really NEVER go higher than its min value, I am sure there is a mode in which you can put it at 100, 50 or whatever is the min and be sure it won't move.
I admit slower than 1/60 could be tricky, but in most days you'll have enough light to shoot at 1/80 and that's enough even for me :D

[P_Zero_Rosso]

I checked your Enzo pic and think you used the shadow highlight function a little overenthusiastic thus creating even more noise.
I tend to use it to maximum 10-15% depending on the original picture.
Other tips are already mentionned: low ISO and shutter speeds.

[Fleischmann]

Well, like already pointed out, the ISO setting was slightly too high. If you don't have a Digital SLR then you should keep that parameter to the minimum. Playing with the contrast and saturation sliders in PS can make things worse, the picture would be even more grainy.

[stmoritzer]

@ P_Zero_Rosso : you'r eright, it was too much-> the PSP version of that picture is already better


@TT: before resizing was clear, but thanks for the hint to do it first... as said, I used it 2-3 times so far.
I'll check, if the grainy pics remain and check the camera/filters ...



Well, having also used this camera for more than a year, I never used ISO200 or higher, anyway 100 should be perfect for a sunny day like that, and you don't even have to worry about the depth of field with a small sensor.
I've just had a look at the originals and 200 already seems to be grainy.

However, a friend of mine fucked up an entire shoot (those open doors @ the local airforce base) because of a cheap (read : "no need to sell your kidney for those pro ones") UV filter; the fact that you use it with the polarizer could explain a drop of quality. This guy ended up with grainy and out of focus shots with perfect light conditions and low ISO settings.

I'm not sure though, so my advice would be to try without the UV filter and compare the results.

:hmm:, I used both filter for more than a year now and never had any complains from you guys :wink: before,
is it possible that the performance dropped due to cleaning of the filters??

[SDK2003]

The biggest tip would be to use a flash and stop using the PS Shadow and Highlight Filter :)
Bright sunny days introduce very harsh shadows, using fill in flash will lighten the shadows and add 'pop' to your image.

[Darkel]

:hmm:, I used both filter for more than a year now and never had any complains from you guys :wink: before,
is it possible that the performance dropped due to cleaning of the filters??

That was just something I had noticed, I never said it was actually the cause of your problem. But now that you've told us about using ISO200 most of the time and the position of the sun in the yellow enzo picture which inevitably leads to grany shadows (especially with post-treatment), it's the ISO IMO :bah:

[stmoritzer]

thanks again for your comments.

[sentra_dude]

So stmoritzer, have you gone out and shot some more pics, taking into consideration the suggestions here...any improvement in noise levels?

[stmoritzer]

not yet :bah:, I'm quite busy atm and didn't have time to shoot pics. I crosschecked with some Ferrariday pics I took in the meantime and it seems better...