View Full Version : Have you experienced negative G's in a car before?
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 12:10 AM
as the topic name suggests...
and if so, what car was it in... what were the circumstances?
naturally, 99% of all cars can't do this, and requires immence amounts of d/f and suitable speeds to have it work
My story...
Sunday I met up with my friend who happens to own one of the 3 fastest production cars ever made. (Bugatti Veyron, Dauer 962, Vector W8 [anybody who truly knows about the McLaren run knows they had performed many cheats... and haven't provided any official cirtified runs... the Dauer was so aerodynamic, powerful, and actually capable of 241+ at Le Mans... why wouldn't it be capable of 252 mph with less drag/less down force?]
We get in, and have a go.
you would not believe the looks that car commands from EVERY on-looker.
suddenly, we are off like a rocket in a 750ish hp twin turbo pushrod V8....
a series of progressively larger hills comes up, and suddenly, i feel my weight is applied entirely to my shoulder strap.... HOLY CRAP, we didn't go airborn :) this car is absolutely glued to the ground!
how fast was that?
a ways into 2nd gear... shiftin into third as we coast about going nearly 5x the suggested speed...
holy crap
I have popped my negative G cherry.
TT, im curious if you have exerpienced it in any of the fine cars you've been in... its very very strange, to say the least
:shock: Thats awsome man!!
You finally got a ride in a W8. Hope you have some great pics to share.
You are no longer a negative G virgin.. welcome to the G world.. :mrgreen: .
I think TT would have experienced it in the Diablo.
Any pic of the event.
I have had neg. Gs but nothing on that level. i have "lifted" the suspension completely and lost traction a bit but i didn't get stuffed to the roof of the car. i more or less went flying then anything. :mrgreen:
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 12:38 AM
:shock: Thats awsome man!!
You finally got a ride in a W8. Hope you have some great pics to share.
pm sent
You are no longer a negative G virgin.. welcome to the G world.. :mrgreen: .
I think TT would have experienced it in the Diablo.
Any pic of the event.
you bet I do.... I have a lot more too....
but, rather then share it now, i'd rather wait for the "complete" package to be done, rather then do things in bits ;)
black_magician
06-14-2006, 12:38 AM
now you just gotta find the G-spot. :lol:
I'm not a negative G type person unless I'm on a roller coaster.
PICS OR STFU!! :lol: :P
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 12:53 AM
now you just gotta find the G-spot. :lol:
I'm not a negative G type person unless I'm on a roller coaster.
PICS OR STFU!! :lol: :P
http://nthimage.com/_private/nthimage_Vector_W8_1.jpg
might that count? :P
nthfinity Thanks :wink:
Hey does the Vector W8 have an automatic gearbox???
SWT : What car did that to you.. I have a feeling it's a FWD car because it lifted the rear wheel and drove off with out much drama. :mrgreen:
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 01:07 AM
Hey does the Vector W8 have an automatic gearbox???
a 3 speed auto
1rst to about 85 mph
2nd to 165 or so
3rd to 242 RPM limited
the car stays on boost between shifts too ;)
are you familiar with the car in Prince Kalhid's collection? (i might be slaughtering his name... but in the Saudi royal family)
black_magician
06-14-2006, 01:28 AM
now you just gotta find the G-spot. :lol:
I'm not a negative G type person unless I'm on a roller coaster.
PICS OR STFU!! :lol: :P
http://nthimage.com/_private/nthimage_Vector_W8_1.jpg
might that count? :P
YES!! shweet!! :P :D
thanx man. those things look more like spaceships than cars.
Nice car.. nice shot.. you have to tell me how you line these awesome cars ... ;)
yg60m
06-14-2006, 02:38 AM
Pics mate ?? We want pics and vids :drool: Your friend also have a Dauer and a Veyron ?? If it wasn't you I wouldn't believe it :wink: If you can get pics of these cars too ... :P
Mattk
06-14-2006, 02:59 AM
How did he manage to get his hands on such fine vehicles. Must've been an interesting experience.
stmoritzer
06-14-2006, 03:05 AM
Pics mate ?? We want pics and vids :drool: Your friend also have a Dauer and a Veyron ?? If it wasn't you I wouldn't believe it :wink: If you can get pics of these cars too ... :P
If I understand right, he owns 1 of the 3 fastest car, means "only" the Vector.
Cool ride dude :D , that car was one of my dreamcars as a child :lol: ,
can't wait for more pics ...
davide
06-14-2006, 03:07 AM
What a cocktease, saying that you got a ride in a Bugatti Dauer and only sharing one picture!
How rude.... ;) ;) ;)
yg60m
06-14-2006, 03:18 AM
Pics mate ?? We want pics and vids :drool: Your friend also have a Dauer and a Veyron ?? If it wasn't you I wouldn't believe it :wink: If you can get pics of these cars too ... :P
If I understand right, he owns 1 of the 3 fastest car, means "only" the Vector.
Cool ride dude :D , that car was one of my dreamcars as a child :lol: ,
can't wait for more pics ...
Ooops :oops: didn't read it well :wink:
cooperluke
06-14-2006, 04:41 AM
Wow... that is something of another world. Almost sci-fi! :D
MartijnGizmo
06-14-2006, 05:26 AM
Negative G's? Sure, every time I hit the brake. :P
dingo
06-14-2006, 06:48 AM
It can't be too many negative G's, as AFAIK your blood vessels (eyes) will rupture at only a couple of G's.
I've been in some very fast cars (F50, F430, CS, Murci, GT2 etc etc) at very high speeds (300+) but don't think I've had this feeling....
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 07:37 AM
Pics mate ?? We want pics and vids :drool: Your friend also have a Dauer and a Veyron ?? If it wasn't you I wouldn't believe it :wink: If you can get pics of these cars too ... :P
What a cocktease, saying that you got a ride in a Bugatti Dauer and only sharing one picture!
How rude.... ;) ;) ;)
sorry to disappoint...
He owns only ONE OF the three I mentioned
however... i'd love to get my hands on/in the others as well :P
I'm lining up more cars too :)
It can't be too many negative G's, as AFAIK your blood vessels (eyes) will rupture at only a couple of G's.
I've been in some very fast cars (F50, F430, CS, Murci, GT2 etc etc) at very high speeds (300+) but don't think I've had this feeling....
not too many nagative G's of course, and definately not sustained.
I'm sure a few of those provide sufficiant d/f to do the same thing ;)
Edit:
also, at the speeds we were going..... it does make me wonder about the two Enzo crashes... as i am sure they occured under similar circomstances to become air-born. 162 wasn't that much faster then what we were going.
another reason "the cars of the Margaret Thatcher era are greater then todays supercars" ;)
Also.... does the Murcie actually produce much d/f??
Hey does the Vector W8 have an automatic gearbox???
a 3 speed auto
1rst to about 85 mph
2nd to 165 or so
3rd to 242 RPM limited
the car stays on boost between shifts too ;)
are you familiar with the car in Prince Kalhid's collection? (i might be slaughtering his name... but in the Saudi royal family)
3 speed for a supercar.. Good old days. Hehehe..
No idea who is Prince Khalid but I heard about Prince Walid Bin Talal.. He got the Bat Mobile.. :) But never saw any other pic of his garage ..'
What about Prince Khalid. ?
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 08:08 AM
3 speed for a supercar.. Good old days. Hehehe..
No idea who is Prince Khalid but I heard about Prince Walid Bin Talal.. He got the Bat Mobile.. But never saw any other pic of his garage ..'
What about Prince Khalid. ?
Khalid (or whatever his name is... :oops: ) owns the only "lost" Vector W8... it isn't lost, but you can't just go to see it.
last anybody knows its still sitting proudly on a rotating pedistal, and not in a mungy garage... but well, with the royal family, you dont contact them.... they contact you :wink:
LotusGT1
06-14-2006, 08:15 AM
Sunday I met up with my friend who happens to own one of the 3 fastest production cars ever made. (Bugatti Veyron, Dauer 962, Vector W8 [anybody who truly knows about the McLaren run knows they had performed many cheats... and haven't provided any official cirtified runs... the Dauer was so aerodynamic, powerful, and actually capable of 241+ at Le Mans... why wouldn't it be capable of 252 mph with less drag/less down force?]
The Dauer is NOT a production car (the ones running at Le Mans was probably not streetlegal, so your theory won't hold), the McLaren had the rev. limiter removed and a higher flow exhaust from what I've heard, you haven't mentioned the Koenigsegg which broke the F1's official record, and you are the only one on the whole internet claiming the Vector can go over 220 mph. Let's say your claim is fishy at best.
Which doesn't mean it must have been an awesome experience 8)
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 08:26 AM
Sunday I met up with my friend who happens to own one of the 3 fastest production cars ever made. (Bugatti Veyron, Dauer 962, Vector W8 [anybody who truly knows about the McLaren run knows they had performed many cheats... and haven't provided any official cirtified runs... the Dauer was so aerodynamic, powerful, and actually capable of 241+ at Le Mans... why wouldn't it be capable of 252 mph with less drag/less down force?]
The Dauer is NOT a production car (the ones running at Le Mans was probably not streetlegal, so your theory won't hold), the McLaren had the rev. limiter removed and a higher flow exhaust from what I've heard, you haven't mentioned the Koenigsegg which broke the F1's official record, and you are the only one on the whole internet claiming the Vector can go over 220 mph. Let's say your claim is fishy at best.
Which doesn't mean it must have been an awesome experience 8)
first:
The McLaren running at 24x mph was a total joke.
why?
Duct tape on all the panel gaps
a F1 LM w/out the rear wing
delimited
officially timed MY ASS
second:
Vector W8 was run to 242.x MPH at Boneville, and was cirtified; and has been published on a now dead magazine called "Top Wheels" and it had the previous high-downforce wing on it, not the one used today... RPM Limited folks :
Lotus = OWNED
Third:
Dauer is about as much production car as the F1 LM that set that "record" and is definately street legal.
The one at le mans wasn't street legal, it was about 150-250 extra hp. the Dauer has 735 hp, weighs at 2200 lbs, and has a Cd. of .31; wheras the Le Mans long tail config of the race car had .46
to think that its slower is just stupid
Lotus = OWNED :)
of the three, ONLY the Vector, and the Bugatti have (or in the case of the Vector had) a full warentee on pretty much everything... but i'm sure Jochen Dauer would take care of you too.
you are simplly just another fanboy of the F1. Meet people who own them/drive them etc. your views will change
dutchmasterflex
06-14-2006, 09:18 AM
I pull around 3 G's negative and positive on the track with my go kart ;)
Great to see you got a ride in the Vector... hope you ahve some footage in addition to the photos..
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 09:22 AM
I pull around 3 G's negative and positive on the track with my go kart ;)
Great to see you got a ride in the Vector... hope you ahve some footage in addition to the photos..
im speaking of positive normal, and negative normal forces.... not longatudinal/lateral forces ;)
who, what where? video? huh? :P
nthfinity Thanks :wink:
Hey does the Vector W8 have an automatic gearbox???
SWT : What car did that to you.. I have a feeling it's a FWD car because it lifted the rear wheel and drove off with out much drama. :mrgreen:
it was in my truck on a back road, i was trying to keep up with my friend in his mustang. i lifted enough to spin the wheels. i was covering over the top of a hill.
LotusGT1
06-14-2006, 09:50 AM
first:
The McLaren running at 24x mph was a total joke.
why?
Duct tape on all the panel gaps
a F1 LM w/out the rear wing
delimited
officially timed MY ASS
second:
Vector W8 was run to 242.x MPH at Boneville, and was cirtified; and has been published on a now dead magazine called "Top Wheels" and it had the previous high-downforce wing on it, not the one used today... RPM Limited folks :
Lotus = OWNED
Third:
Dauer is about as much production car as the F1 LM that set that "record" and is definately street legal.
The one at le mans wasn't street legal, it was about 150-250 extra hp. the Dauer has 735 hp, weighs at 2200 lbs, and has a Cd. of .31; wheras the Le Mans long tail config of the race car had .46
to think that its slower is just stupid
Lotus = OWNED :)
of the three, ONLY the Vector, and the Bugatti have (or in the case of the Vector had) a full warentee on pretty much everything... but i'm sure Jochen Dauer would take care of you too.
you are simplly just another fanboy of the F1. Meet people who own them/drive them etc. your views will change
LOL, it wouldn't be the first time nth THINKS he's smart, but in reality isn't.
I never said the F1 which ran 240mph was stock. However, at a shootout Koenigsegg set a stock F1 ran 231 mph. Both times are documented and certified. That is exactly where your Vector claims fail. I have never seen any documented 240+ mph run of the W8, and you appearantly can't show it. A magazine which doesn't excist anymore? Why wasn't it published in the Guiness Book of Records? Nobody can check that W8 was stock or not, etc etc...Fishy.
Secondly, there is a distinct different between a streetlegal car and a production vehicle. The Dauer is a streetlegal car, but calling it a production car is streching definitions by a long shot. Where the Sledgehammer Corvette then (faster), what's the topspeed of tuner cars from Lingenfelter f.e etc. etc.
There's also a distinct difference between the Dauer which ran Le Mans and the streetlegal version. I've yet to see the street legal one being faster than the Le Mans one. It has never been proven. We don't know how the aerodynamics of the weaker but sleaker street-Dauer hold above 240 mph. But that's hardly the point.
I'm confident the Dauer can smash both the Vector, McLaren and Koenigsegg for that matter on sheer speed, but the Dauer is a racecar converted for street use, where the others were developed as a street car from scratch. No surprise really.
With all those claims, first see it, before believing it. It took Koenigsegg a few years before they could back up their claims. I'm not saying the W8 can't get over 240mph but it sounds a bit fishy when nothing seems to be documented, or no proof can be shown.
I don't believe in words that easily, especially when they come from somebody with a big mouth, but has been proven wrong o so many times. So instead of talking like an idiot I suggest you read first, and take a deep breath. I merely said your statement of driving on of the three fastest cars in the world was bold. And it is. One thing though, don't say people are OWNED by yourself. Besides the fact that it is pretty queer behaviour, you're piss-poor at it too.
dingo
06-14-2006, 09:55 AM
Hehe, I don't really like the Vector but this just got a whole lot more interesting.... :lol:
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 10:06 AM
I don't believe in words that easily, especially when they come from somebody with a big mouth, but has been proven wrong o so many times. So instead of talking like an idiot I suggest you read first, and take a deep breath. I merely said your statement of driving on of the three fastest cars in the world was bold. And it is. One thing though, don't say people are OWNED by yourself. Besides the fact that it is pretty queer behaviour, you're piss-poor at it too.
of course its a bold, and accurate statement
my mouth is only "big" when i'm passionate about something... what reason do i have for lying? I'll provide the documentation all in due time... the shear number of perodicals on the Vector is staggering concidering how much people dont remember/know about it.
why do you think the Michilen XGT Plust tires are only cirtified for the Vector @ 250 mph? they are 200+ for the other cars that it could be fitted to... ;)
On the Koenigsegg... well, that is just as fast... but didn't i mention something about full factory backing of the powertrain? well, i suppose Koenigsegg have a 3,000 mile warenty now :P
so... strip Dauer from my list, and add Koenigsegg... McLaren F1 still isn't up there... she's too slow ;)
oh... i dont think i have the Nardo top speed video of the F1, i'd definately be interested in seeing it.
I don't believe in words that easily, especially when they come from somebody with a big mouth, but has been proven wrong o so many times.
Proven wrong so many times?
See - it's this type of tripe that really takes the original ethos and intent of Jabbasworld and destroys it - nthfinity is a long standing member who has shown to be honest and sincere in all aspects - so why would you try and attack and redicule his content and contribution?
What exactly do you hope to achieve by this attitude and behaviour?
We are trying evry hard to nurture and shape JabbasWorld as a splace ont he Web with valid and accurate and exciting informaiton and content - and as such there is a time and place for everything. Your critique is nothing more than childish hate and jealousy.
You are like thise fools who write into the magazines all high and mighty and attack the content providers because only your pathetic truth is supposed to count.
Hey - if YOU think you can do better and be more factual, instead of sitting there like the whiny bitch you are - why not get off your lazy, pot-smoking, arse and go FIND you own cars to photograph, road test and talk about?
You obviously have no idea of the magnitude of the little road-test and photo-shoot and more that nth arranged with this Vector - JUST SO FOOLS LIKE YOU CAN ENJOY READING ABOUT AND SEEING IT!
Maybe everyone would like it better if no exciting and new and creative content was sourced... all because Lotus doesn't believe the sources.
So instead of talking like an idiot I suggest you read first, and take a deep breath. I merely said your statement of driving on of the three fastest cars in the world was bold. And it is. One thing though, don't say people are OWNED by yourself. Besides the fact that it is pretty queer behaviour, you're piss-poor at it too.
Obviously you nolonger see JW as a place for the unique gathering of car enthusiasts, their shared content and discussion there of.
Maybe it's time you find somewhere else to hang out - because obviosly "we" don't meet your high standards.
:roll:
MartijnGizmo
06-14-2006, 10:50 AM
Ok, lets rent a track and some supercars and walk the talk!
I'd give $5 to see thar. :D
Ok, lets rent a track and some supercars and walk the talk!
I'd give $5 to see thar. :D
All I can say is "Stay Tuned.." ;) - In fact there may be a preview available of some prelims and some locaiton scounting after this weekend.. :twisted:
dutchmasterflex
06-14-2006, 11:13 AM
Lotus has been here just as long has Nth.. and he is just as important to JW
I think both sides of this argument both have their truths and both make sense to some degree...
Like, Why wasn't the Vector ever added to the Guiness Book of Records? Why was the McLaren?
...
TT, im curious if you have exerpienced it in any of the fine cars you've been in... its very very strange, to say the least
Well, thinking about it, the very powerfull cars in which I had rides, Murcielagos, Enzo, Zonda F, Diablos were always driven on quite smooth surfaces, so I don't see how it could be possible :D even with 2000 hp :)
Even on mountain roads, never hit a suitable "bump" to cause that, but to be honest I am not sure I am getting the point: I mean, I got "liften" from the seat and kept down by the safety belt in some Imprezas or Lancers driven on bumpy roads very fast, but you don't see ow it is related to hp :hmm:
Aboute acceleration and braking, the biggest G were without a shade of a doubt in the Zonda and Enzo, but corner wise the Exige can impress even more to be honest!
Lotus has been here just as long has Nth.. and he is just as important to JW
You can have him and his opinions.
Just don't get all pissy when others decide that it is not worth sharing their experiencesa and sourcing content for JW and take their efforts some place else because of haters like him.
I think both sides of this argument both have their truths and both make sense to some degree...
What argument? It's only an argument in Lotus mind...
Like, Why wasn't the Vector ever added to the Guiness Book of Records? Why was the McLaren?
Uhm - because different people/organisations place different weigth emphasis on Guiness and their record book than others.
You don't just say "Here - put our number in" - you have to re-invite the adjudicators over to observe according to THEIR terms.
Salt Flat racers race accroing to their set f timing rules and requirments - does that eman now that all the Slat Flat times are null and void?
Any way - if people keep bitching and whining enough (with pointless arguments), unique and interesting content will simply dry up and go away - maybe thats what some of you guys want for JW anyway.. *shrug*
But in the end - the proof yoy all seek shall surely be forth coming... ;) Have patience :P
Aboute acceleration and braking, the biggest G were without a shade of a doubt in the Zonda and Enzo, but corner wise the Exige can impress even more to be honest!
What nth is refering to is not the affect of "jumping" over bumps or the affects of cornering or accelerating - but rather taking a car over a rise and having the car in effect "stick" to the road as you are lifted out of the seat - so imagine that dust and a piece of paper would stick to the roof at that moment - as the car stays firmly on the road but you push upwards against the seatbelt.
Normally you experience that if you "jump" over a hill and the car returns to earth sooner than you do so your stomach feels light as you crest the hill - but many of us have experienced that in cars with even very little down force.
Nth is talking about that opposite effect - where the car stays put as you crest the hill but you and the paper don't :)
if a race is going down give me a time and date i will be part of the viewing public :D
Ok, reading a bit more I understand the neg G we are talking about should be generated by high downforce produced by the car at high speed... fair enough, but why would this result in the passengers beeing lifted from their seats as if they weren't actually part of the car's "moving system"?
I am for sure a total noob at physics, but really don't see why high downforce should put neg G on the body of the car's passenger and driver.
because if it's the case, how could F1 drivers survive a GP :?:
if a race is going down give me a time and date i will be part of the viewing public :D
Yep - its going to be a very busy summer ;) -- you'll get to see the video :P
Ok, reading a bit more I understand the neg G we are talking about should be generated by high downforce produced by the car at high speed... fair enough, but why would this result in the passengers beeing lifted from their seats as if they weren't actually part of the car's "moving system"?
You are only part of the system because you are strapped in. If you wrere not you would be thrown around like a rag doll.
I am for sure a total noob at physics, but really don't see why high downforce should put neg G on the body of the car's passenger and driver.
because if it's the case, how could F1 drivers survive a GP :?:
They are firmly srapped in so they cannot move relative to the car - but if they went on a rollercoaster style road - they might suffer red-outs as they crest hills, and black outs as they bottom out in valleys.
If they were not strapped in they might fly out the seats on hill crests and be smashed under the dashboard in valleys.
LotusGT1
06-14-2006, 11:41 AM
Proven wrong so many times?
See - it's this type of tripe that really takes the original ethos and intent of Jabbasworld and destroys it - nthfinity is a long standing member who has shown to be honest and sincere in all aspects - so why would you try and attack and redicule his content and contribution?
What exactly do you hope to achieve by this attitude and behaviour?
We are trying evry hard to nurture and shape JabbasWorld as a splace ont he Web with valid and accurate and exciting informaiton and content - and as such there is a time and place for everything. Your critique is nothing more than childish hate and jealousy.
You are like thise fools who write into the magazines all high and mighty and attack the content providers because only your pathetic truth is supposed to count.
Hey - if YOU think you can do better and be more factual, instead of sitting there like the whiny bitch you are - why not get off your lazy, pot-smoking, arse and go FIND you own cars to photograph, road test and talk about?
You obviously have no idea of the magnitude of the little road-test and photo-shoot and more that nth arranged with this Vector - JUST SO FOOLS LIKE YOU CAN ENJOY READING ABOUT AND SEEING IT!
Maybe everyone would like it better if no exciting and new and creative content was sourced... all because Lotus doesn't believe the sources.
Obviously you nolonger see JW as a place for the unique gathering of car enthusiasts, their shared content and discussion there of.
Maybe it's time you find somewhere else to hang out - because obviosly "we" don't meet your high standards.
:roll:
Ahh, here we have our little texan attention whore again. Looking for another discussion to stick your nose in?
I've been in many discussions with Nth, and let's say he was wrong on a few occasions. I didn't attack and ridicule his contribution initially, I merely wondered if the W8 would be one of the 3 fastest production cars in the world. He came back stung like a bee and came with all that owned-bullshit. However those are one of the facts you always seem to miss.
My critique has nothing to do with jealousy or whatever fucked up conclusions you draw. This is a discussion board, where people discuss. If he makes claimes about the F1, or the W8, or whatever he chooses to post about, and I think they're different, I have every right to discuss that. That has nothing to do with "my pathetic truth" as you wish to call it. Funny how you don't seem to grasp the concept of broadening your horizon. But then again, you can't see past your own opinion.
LOL at your petty attempts to insult me. It has become your trademark, and that's pretty sad. My "lazy ass" has something for me more important to do then hunting for cars. Unfortunately I'm busy with graduating, work, etc etc. My sparse time I use for my social life, and my section at JW.
I'm done arguing with you, with your brainless "obvious" analyses everytime where you call everybody jew-hating terrorists when they don't agree with you on political views, where you call everybody spineless assholes whenever they have another point of view. You make yourself look like a fool again. In conclusion, STFU, and if you decide to leave again, don't forget to close the door and skip the drama. Because I'm not leaving.
Ahh, here we have our little texan attention whore again. Looking for another discussion to stick your nose in?
I've been in many discussions with Nth, and let's say he was wrong on a few occasions. I didn't attack and ridicule his contribution initially, I merely wondered if the W8 would be one of the 3 fastest production cars in the world. He came back stung like a bee and came with all that onwed-bullshit. However those are one of the facts you always seem to miss.
Man you are angry this week? You local pot-house run low or something?
My critique has nothing to do with jealousy or whatever fucked up conclusions you draw. This is a discussion board, where people discuss. If he makes clames about the F1, or the W8, or whatever he chooses to post about, and I think they're different, I have every right to discuss that.
Discuss all you want - but you coame ou tthe gate hating and calling him a liar. What proof are YOU using for your claims? It's not like YOU have ever driven ina W8 or spoken to the owners and collectors and engineers about it - have you?
Whats YOUR basis for challenging him?
That has nothing to do with "my pathetic truth" as you wish to call it. Funny how you don't seem to grasp the concept of broadening your horizon. But then again, you can't see past your own opinion.
If he never sourced the car, took the drive, did the test and the GRACIOUSLY decided to SHARE it with YOU - you would have never had a thing to say.
YOU just cruise around like a whiny bitch LOOKING for "discussions" to have - again - what is the basis for YOU to disagree with him?
LOL at your petty attempts to insult me. It has become your trademark, and that's pretty sad. My "lazy ass" has something for me more important to do then hunting for cars. Unfortunately I'm busy with graduating, work, etc etc. My sparse time I use for my social life, and my section at JW.
Your point?
I'm done arguing with you, with your brainless "obvious" analyses everytime where you call everybody jew-hating terrorists when they don't agree with you on political views, where you call everybody spineless assholes whenever they have another point of view. You make yourself look like a fool again. In conclusion, STFU, and if you decide to leave again, don't forget to close the door and skip the drama. Because I'm not leaving.
I am sure you are not leaving - you have no where else to be. SO again - whats the basis for you to angrily hate on his gracious contribution to the content at JW?
Just because you have decided you don't like his opinion ? Or do you have some factual basis to challange his assertions?
Again - if you have had access to a W8 and been able to gather further research that can debunk his claims - please feel free to offer them up - others wise perhaps you might STFU and allow others to enjoy the content that Nth is providing.
Just a thought.
dutchmasterflex
06-14-2006, 11:55 AM
argument aside,
If only my go kart had downforce wings and seat belts ;)
Trying to ignore the usual fights...
Ok, now I see the kind of situation where you could experience such things.. a crest, (possibly not a ramp or else, d/f or not, you'll go airborne) driven pretty quickly. Quick enough to make you feel like your body is trying to lift from the seat but not enough to beat the downforce generated by the car.
And well, sadly I was never was in the right place with those cars :bah:
LotusGT1
06-14-2006, 11:59 AM
Man you are angry this week? You local pot-house run low or something?
LOL, you are talking to me? Look at your last reply at me and stop wondering if I'm angry, but start questioning what issues you can't get over.
Discuss all you want - but you coame ou tthe gate hating and calling him a liar. What proof are YOU using for your claims? It's not like YOU have ever driven ina W8 or spoken to the owners and collectors and engineers about it - have you?
Whats YOUR basis for challenging him?
I only ask to show proof of the claims he makes. That's not strange, now is it? That would be funny, when you only can judge on the words of another. People would have a fieldday with your bullshit.
If he never sourced the car, took the drive, did the test and the GRACIOUSLY decided to SHARE it with YOU - you would have never had a thing to say.
YOU just cruise around like a whiny bitch LOOKING for "discussions" to have - again - what is the basis for YOU to disagree with him?
You cruise around looking for sticking your nose in discussions others have. That's even worse. I wondered something, he replied, and you as the attention whore you are came bugging everybody with your issues again. I merely wondered something.
Your point?
It annoys people, and not only me.
I am sure you are not leaving - you have no where else to be. SO again - whats the basis for you to angrily hate on his gracious contribution to the content at JW?
Just because you have decided you don't like his opinion ? Or do you have some factual basis to challange his assertions?
Again - if you have had access to a W8 and been able to gather further research that can debunk his claims - please feel free to offer them up - others wise perhaps you might STFU and allow others to enjoy the content that Nth is providing.
Just a thought.
I have plenty places to go, but I like it here. Nth is a grown man capable enough to talk for his own. I meant nothing with it, he got all pissy and started the OWNED-BS, I reacted, he reacted and it was over. Nothing major.
Untill you appeared *again*. Why don't you stop insulting half this forum on a daily basis that disagrees with you? Why don't you stop bugging others with your obvious issues, because the anger inside you is constantly showing.
Just a thought.
:roll:
Oh, and let's stop this argument for the sake of this topic.
sameerrao
06-14-2006, 12:10 PM
The McLaren running at 24x mph was a total joke.
why?
Duct tape on all the panel gaps
a F1 LM w/out the rear wing
delimited
officially timed MY ASS
I disagree.
First of all the F1 being tested was a regular F1 and not a LM car. It was chassis XP5 which was built in 1993 and featured in the Autocar roadtest in 1994. if you look at tspecs sheet of the F1 and the LM, there are significant differences between the two cars and not just the rear wing.
The timing was done at the Ehra Lessen track using the track measurement sensors.
Am attaching a report of the world record run.
http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/3526/dscn14266qr.th.jpg (http://img125.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn14266qr.jpg)http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/1156/dscn14270cv.th.jpg (http://img125.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn14270cv.jpg)
F1 vs LM
http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/3361/dscn14304ow.th.jpg (http://img125.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn14304ow.jpg)http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/5781/dscn14313lf.th.jpg (http://img125.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn14313lf.jpg)
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 12:20 PM
The McLaren running at 24x mph was a total joke.
why?
Duct tape on all the panel gaps
a F1 LM w/out the rear wing
delimited
officially timed MY ASS
I disagree.
First of all the F1 being tested was a regular F1 and not a LM car. It was chassis XP5 which was built in 1993 and featured in the Autocar roadtest in 1994. if you look at tspecs sheet of the F1 and the LM, there are significant differences between the two cars and not just the rear wing.
The timing was done at the Ehra Lessen track using the track measurement sensors.
Am attaching a report of the world record run.
http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/3526/dscn14266qr.th.jpg (http://img125.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn14266qr.jpg)http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/1156/dscn14270cv.th.jpg (http://img125.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn14270cv.jpg)
F1 vs LM
http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/3361/dscn14304ow.th.jpg (http://img125.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn14304ow.jpg)http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/5781/dscn14313lf.th.jpg (http://img125.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn14313lf.jpg)
I'm sorry sameer... but after speaking at length with engineers who have had time in the F1, knowing people who are very good friends with owners, and the same engineers were there when the F1 "set" the record...
as you know, F1 vs. F1 LM can be changed at the owners will ;)
the car wasn't what they claimed it was by any means; and w/out a doubt, they were "cheating"... yes, it still went that fast for the briefest of moments... but it wasn't the "stock" setup so many people think it was.
I have extraordinarily credible sources
BTW...
hows this for size...
a cirtain wealthy entrapanuer has an F1
he took it to track days regularly, and is a professional race driver
grip grip--- oh plenty of.... whoa, no warning, and the back comes out... no seat-of-my-pants warning, no steering wheel warning... vague doesn't begin to describe the horror of trying to drive the car at the limit.
he doesn't think this is right
he ships the car back to McLaren
they test it, then disassemble the suspension, re assemble it, and test again
the verdict?
it handles the same as all F1's do
again. this is a very true story :P
gucom
06-14-2006, 12:25 PM
i dont know anything about ur sources but somehow to be honest im not buying any of it, u can say its because i want to believe in fairies or whatever, fine, still not buying it...
anyway, ever seen the vid? "that fast for the briefest of moments" isnt even close to what it did, it did 391 as top speed, just not for a kilometre, the kilometre average was 386 iirc...and it kept the speed for a long long time...
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 12:31 PM
i dont know anything about ur sources but somehow to be honest im not buying any of it, u can say its because i want to believe in fairies or whatever, fine, still not buying it...
anyway, ever seen the vid? "that fast for the briefest of moments" isnt even close to what it did, it did 391 as top speed, just not for a kilometre, the kilometre average was 386 iirc...and it kept the speed for a long long time...
hey, do you know anybody who was involved in building the fastest cars in the world at the time?
when you do, i'll believe your sources ;)
386 is fast.... ive never said it isnt.... but it isn't the same 391 by any means.
the Vector holds 242 at its rpm limit..... and was officially timed.
didn't Bugatti do thier own timing runs there?
LotusGT1
06-14-2006, 12:37 PM
Well, get all those owners here at JW and let them school us 8)
I don't doubt you or your sources, it's just that I've seen an F1 owner talk at Pistonheads having other opinions.
You cruise around looking for sticking your nose in discussions others have. That's even worse. I wondered something, he replied, and you as the attention whore you are came bugging everybody with your issues again. I merely wondered something.
Not bugging anyone - simply askign why you needed to come in and try steal the spotlight by calling hima liar - when you have no basis from which ti debunk his claims.
Who says I don't have an interest in his story or opinion? DO you hold sole rights to "discuss"?
It annoys people, and not only me.
It annoys many people that you simply "discuss" every topic into the trash - why not enjoy the content posted for what it is? IS everything abou t"proving wrong vs right" for you?
I have plenty places to go, but I like it here. Nth is a grown man capable enough to talk for his own. I meant nothing with it, he got all pissy and started the OWNED-BS, I reacted, he reacted and it was over. Nothing major.
Untill you appeared *again*. Why don't you stop insulting half this forum on a daily basis that disagrees with you? Why don't you stop bugging others with your obvious issues, because the anger inside you is constantly showing.
Just a thought.
:roll:
Oh, and let's stop this argument for the sake of this topic.
Chum - I simply asked that you perhaps take the contributions in the spirit they are made. I am not and never will speak on his or any one elses behalf. I am aslo not preventing you from having an opinion - every one ahs one - but does that opinion need to prevent the rest from just enjoying the content posted?
Nth sourced, produced and provided the content he did - of his own free will, and graciously did so for everyone's enjoyment - not just so you could "discuss" it by calling it BS.
So the only one arguing is you - I am enjoying the content he posted. Taking the information he provided on face value and in the good faith it was delivered - as he has no vested interest or reason to fabricate lies and willfully try mislead the global community with false information about the W8.
All he did was provide some unique and rare content - it is such a pity some folks cannot enjoy this for what it is.
:)
Well, get all those owners here at JW and let them school us 8)
I don't doubt you or your sources, it's just that I've seen an F1 owner talk at Pistonheads having other opinions.
That's a change of heart all of a sudden? And I am the one with issues? hehe ;) Nice try.
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 12:53 PM
as he has no vested interest or reason to fabricate lies and willfully try mislead the global community with false information about the W8.
in fact.... just the opposite
I'm worried that my love of the Vector will hinder my abilities to buy one.... increasing market demand based on the true performance, and longetivity of it.
find me another car that is designed to last the lifetime of the owner...
find me another car that has such tremendously low maintainence costs... In Vector, there are no "7500 mile MAJOR services"... etc.
gucom
06-14-2006, 01:00 PM
the run at ehra lessien was confirmed by Volkswagen (owners of the track). now i see how that could be slightly dubious when it's a volkswagen-owned company like bugatti you're talking about, but why would volkswagen make false claims about a BMW-powered independantly built sports car that they have nothing to do with?
I dont thik the fact that the car tripped the timing lights at the speed they say it did, is under quesiton, but rather the entire setup and config that was needed to pull it off... right?
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 01:11 PM
but rather the entire setup and config that was needed to pull it off... right?
yup.
which speed is the F1's record run in the guiness book at?
was it the nardo attempt, or ehra lessien?
when they came over to cirtify the Dodge SRT-10 Ram as "fastest production truck" they required an average speed (timed lap) to do so....
gucom
06-14-2006, 01:15 PM
well...afaik only the rev limiter was removed, and they told rowan atkinson (F1 owner) he didnt have to worry about tyre pressure on a high speed run, as they didnt change it on the record run... now i doubt they'd endanger the life of 1 of their clients just in case he might once tell a magazine called evo what they told him on the phone...
and the record attempt was at ehra lessien, the vid's probably still out there somewhere on the internet.
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 01:18 PM
and the record attempt was at ehra lessien, the vid's probably still out there somewhere on the internet
so why would Guiness make a special exception for McLaren?
the reason Guiness demanded a timed lap was to take in effect wind speed positively, and adversely affecting the truck... this is also the reason why timed runs are for going both to and from in land speed records....
the F1 was a one way record...
yg60m
06-14-2006, 01:57 PM
BTW...
hows this for size...
a cirtain wealthy entrapanuer has an F1
he took it to track days regularly, and is a professional race driver
grip grip--- oh plenty of.... whoa, no warning, and the back comes out... no seat-of-my-pants warning, no steering wheel warning... vague doesn't begin to describe the horror of trying to drive the car at the limit.
he doesn't think this is right
he ships the car back to McLaren
they test it, then disassemble the suspension, re assemble it, and test again
the verdict?
it handles the same as all F1's do
again. this is a very true story :P
Mate, I doubt that it would be so rare on the market with such value if it was that bad :wink: It is very hard to find one and you have to pay 1.5 million € at least to get one. Moreover I have several articles (including one from R&T) where professionnal drivers find it more than drivable :P
For performances, I have read that the limiter had been removed for the Speed record and it's true that it accelerates very hard on the video but Best Motoring's F1 test wasn't slow either :wink:
So - any way - how about that Vector W8.. did you really get to see it/drive in it or are these just photochops ? :P
LotusGT1
06-14-2006, 02:12 PM
Not bugging anyone - simply askign why you needed to come in and try steal the spotlight by calling hima liar - when you have no basis from which ti debunk his claims.
Who says I don't have an interest in his story or opinion? DO you hold sole rights to "discuss"?
If that's the case, the pot and kettle applies.
In either situation you should shut up as you make an ass out of yourself again. Also, you have a very particular way of "asking" why I wondered about things Nth said. LOL@stealing the spotlight. It has almost become your sole purpose on this board. Ever noticed that every "debate" the last few weeks has revolved around you?
BTW, I didn't call him a liar, don't try to put words in my mouth again.
It annoys many people that you simply "discuss" every topic into the trash - why not enjoy the content posted for what it is? IS everything abou t"proving wrong vs right" for you?
I didn't come with an attitude, I merely asked a question. Not to mention the fact that Nth sparked the discussion pointing out the situation with the F1. LOL, I even adressed the fact that that particular F1 was not stock. I only wanted to see some proof of the claims he makes about the W8 because I never ever have seen anything close to proof.
Funny also that it's you who is always in debate with fuck knows who about. Pot and kettle once again.
Chum - I simply asked that you perhaps take the contributions in the spirit they are made. I am not and never will speak on his or any one elses behalf. I am aslo not preventing you from having an opinion - every one ahs one - but does that opinion need to prevent the rest from just enjoying the content posted?
Nth sourced, produced and provided the content he did - of his own free will, and graciously did so for everyone's enjoyment - not just so you could "discuss" it by calling it BS.
So the only one arguing is you - I am enjoying the content he posted. Taking the information he provided on face value and in the good faith it was delivered - as he has no vested interest or reason to fabricate lies and willfully try mislead the global community with false information about the W8.
All he did was provide some unique and rare content - it is such a pity some folks cannot enjoy this for what it is.
:)
LOL@Chum. Anyway, you didn't simply ask, you came across like the asshole you regularly are. I asked something, he responded irritated, and after all said and done, you come by to open your mouth like a loose cannon again.
I can and do enjoy the pictures Nth and others show. Hell, it's the closest I or many others will ever get to such rare car. Why in the qorld can't I ask for an explanation for some things, especially when the poster actively posts about it?
That's a change of heart all of a sudden? And I am the one with issues? hehe ;) Nice try.
Maybe one day you'll learn what context means and what people mean when they post stuff. If somebody can show some evidence and tell the full story I am all for it. I doubt you would appreciate such things, as you never were able to see besides your own beliefs. Your loss, not mine. I'm done with this topic.
LOL@Chum.
Chum is shark bait.
Anyway, you didn't simply ask, you came across like the asshole you regularly are. I asked something, he responded irritated, and after all said and done, you come by to open your mouth like a loose cannon again.
Really? - I simply pointed out that if folks like you keep trying to burn people at the stake everytime they bring unique and interesting and rare content, eventually they will stop.. it is after all a gracious gesture to do it in the first place... perhaps appreciating it once in a while should be your motivation - not "drilling for facts".
This is why many people (with huge amounts to share) do not like the intardnet and stay away from discussion forums - because of all the know-itall's that can't see the wood for the trees and would rather crucify the messenger than enjoy the message.
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 02:23 PM
Mate, I doubt that it would be so rare on the market with such value if it was that bad It is very hard to find one and you have to pay 1.5 million € at least to get one. Moreover I have several articles (including one from R&T) where professionnal drivers find it more than drivable
For performances, I have read that the limiter had been removed for the Speed record and it's true that it accelerates very hard on the video but Best Motoring's F1 test wasn't slow either
I really have to wonder if its a similar situation as Bugatti where they send a representative over do do the "hardcore" testing; as this guy isn't the only owner from whom i've heard this type of tale.... let alone the fit and finish of the car... it isn't italian after all :p
anyway... tangent, back to "similar to bugatti"
so, did McLaren have stipulations as to how hot to drive the car? I dont know. I do know Bugatti hasn't let any track tests yet; and have only let one magazine test accelleration numbers.
the complaint i've heard via the real-person grape vine is that for the weight of the car, the F1 doesn't handle very well.
unfortunatley, we couldn't push the Vector's lateral limits....
but that is another story completely unrelated to the cars factory abililties when she was new... you cannot buy rubber for the Vector.
I do know Bugatti hasn't let any track tests yet; and have only let one magazine test accelleration numbers.
Do you think if somebody organized a Veyron to attend a 'test and tune" day then maybe these guys would take the words more seriosuly? ;)
Although if someone did - and it turned out to not be "the ultimate" on the track.... :twisted:
Michelin cant press a few tyres for the aging W8?
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 02:31 PM
and you are the only one on the whole internet claiming the Vector can go over 220 mph. Let's say your claim is fishy at best.
nothing is fishy, as it has been published.
just because you haven't seen the published article doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
that was not a question; but a suggestion that perhaps i am not to be trusted? i dont know
dingo
06-14-2006, 07:16 PM
You have to admit that Lotus just posed a question regarding some "facts" that were posted, don't we all have the right to question info that is posted? Especially since everyone knows how much bullshit is out there....
Now I don't know who is right, and really don't care as neither the F1 or Vector interest me that much, but it wasn't Lotus who got defensive and attacked others. ;)
Just my views, get over it guys you look like children (yet again).
If anything is ruining JW its these constant stupid arguments, stick to the facts without insulting each other all the time.
You have to admit that Lotus just posed a question regarding some "facts" that were posted, don't we all have the right to question info that is posted? Especially since everyone knows how much bullshit is out there....
Thats the point - the assumption is now that everyone on JW goes out of their way to post bullshit?
Are we to never get to a point when we can begin to take peoples contributions in good faith and at face value?
...but it wasn't Lotus who got defensive and attacked others. ;)
Well - instead the insuation is that everyone - even regulars make a point of posting made up bullshit.
:)
Just my views, get over it guys you look like children (yet again).
If anything is ruining JW its these constant stupid arguments, stick to the facts without insulting each other all the time.
And I guess the greater community is made stronger by the assumption that everyone is only posting bullshit all the time?
I can't think of anyone who took one of St Angers posts and implied until he posted scientific data to backup what he said - he must be bs'ing the community.
I guess thats just the way it will always be. *shrug*
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 08:53 PM
Hehe, I don't really like the Vector but this just got a whole lot more interesting.... :lol:
uhhhhhh. so you are simply eating popcorn and watching the fireworks... ok.
You have to admit that Lotus just posed a question regarding some "facts" that were posted, don't we all have the right to question info that is posted? Especially since everyone knows how much bullshit is out there....
Now I don't know who is right, and really don't care as neither the F1 or Vector interest me that much, but it wasn't Lotus who got defensive and attacked others. ;)
Just my views, get over it guys you look like children (yet again).
If anything is ruining JW its these constant stupid arguments, stick to the facts without insulting each other all the time.
and you are the only one on the whole internet claiming the Vector can go over 220 mph. Let's say your claim is fishy at best.
Lotus didn't pose a question, or ask a question; but rather made an personally insulting opinion that my facts direct from the source are false.
sentra_dude
06-14-2006, 11:25 PM
HEY guys! Let's get back on the topic, lol. When are the vids coming dude? ;) :lol: Thanks for the write-up, very cool...although still can't get over that thing having a 3-speed auto haha, different strokes for different folks as they say. ;)
As to negative G's...hmm, I have been in a car that was airborne, does that count? [p.s. that statement is computer generated, and does not refer to any actual events that have happened ;)]
I've definitely gone over some steep hills and felt a bit of negative G, although, it was not very much at all, its pretty cool feeling. Also...in airplanes, things such as maps and pens and sunglasses and people have been made to float on occasion :mrgreen: does that count too? :D
Also, Nth, I think the simplest solution to the debate about topspeed, is to find the records of the Salt Flats...I'm sure they must keep those around somewhere! Also, that article in the 'dead' mag that featured the Vector... If you are talking about that article, you must have at least seen it somewhere, or maybe you own it? so why not share it with us...? :)
nthfinity
06-14-2006, 11:40 PM
unfortunately, I do not own the magazine with the article.
As i promised, it will come in due time....
in all seriousness, i dont know what is so hard to believe about it; cars have been doing 240 on the salt flats with internal combustion engines for quite some time... why is it so hard to believe that an American car hit 240 mph before the ultimate fan-boy car is beyond me.
i've been under full accelleration in two 200+ mph cars, and i can tell you the Vector is on a whole separate level then even the 600 hp Ford GT..... which we know isn't much slower then the F1... why is it so hard to believe?
anyway.... video might be available friday... time will tell.... ;)
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