IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT REGARDING : WWW.JABBASWORLD.NET

[Jabba]

We have been putting this announcement off for as long as possible but after last nights problems uploading 5th gear (we had to use Dans server in the end) finally the time has come.

Some of you may have already noticed site slow downs and server problems recently prior to the 5th gear problems last night so this will probably come as no surprise.

We currently operate on a 10 mbit server which was fine in the early days but with the ever growing amount of members who have high speed connections and all the new material being added daily it will be impossible to keep the site running smoothly without substantial hardware upgrades the very least being a 100 mbit connection.

Dan has been doing an AMAZING job getting every last drop out of our current server but is spending more and more time trying to juggle server resources to prevent the site from crashing or becoming so slow that it is virtually un-useable...few people realise how much TIME and WORK that guy puts into this site just to keep it online !! In addition to all the great features that he codes himself he also has an ongoing battle with a number of people that are attacking the site on a daily basis who are trying to bring the site down.

Sadly there is no easy upgrade option available to us and we will require a move to a completely new server. The cost and amount of work involved can only be described as a complete nightmare.

Sadly I cannot carry on privately funding JW at this level or expect Dan to carry on working day and night virtually for free.

We feel that advertising would ruin the site completely (we still seem to be the only ad free car forum on the net) and are not left with many other options...the best one so far being....voluntary donations.

This would help cover the running costs and smooth daily operation of the site as well as all the new and ongoing features and a lot more storage space so we can keep even more videos at a much higher quality online and available for an even quicker and trouble free download.

I hope when you decide whether you think this is the correct decision or even a fair one you will consider all the new features that have been added such as how quickly all the latest 5th gear videos were posted thanks to Dans custom upload system and the improved quality of the videos. This will also be the case for Top Gear next month and of course something called "heaven and hell".

I shall leave Dan to answer any technical questions you may have about the downtime and server move...but he will not be able to answer everything so as to protect the "magic" of JW.

Thanks

Jabba

[dingo]

How about just making a subscription fee? I know that would keep away some members, but maybe its for the best.

Maybe only members in the DL/UL club should pay, as they are the ones getting the biggest benefit. It would also not drive away new members as they could experience the site for free and once they discover how special it is they wouldn't think twice about paying.

Just a few quick random thoughts......but I would be happy to donate something if thats what it comes too. :D

[Jabba]

We have been testing that as an idea...but in general we prefer not to force people into doing something that they dont want to.

[Jabba]

We are also looking to provide small extras for the people who donate...maybe custom titles or an extra icon under their username. All ideas are welcome except for anal sex.

[yg60m]

I can easily imagine all the work Dan makes for the site, almost one new feature/improvement every week !! Without counting the number of links added, etc .. So an ENORMOUS THANKS for Dan, TT, FF and of course Jabba, it would be impossible to have such a nice site without all their contribution. :)

No matter the mean of contribution, donation or subs :wink:

[dingo]

....All ideas are welcome except for anal sex.

I'm out then....sorry guys. :P

[stmoritzer]

I can easily imagine all the work Dan makes for the site, almost one new feature/improvement every week !! Without counting the number of links added, etc .. So an ENORMOUS THANKS for Dan, TT, FF and of course Jabba, it would be impossible to have such a nice site without all their contribution. :)

No matter the mean of contribution, donation or subs :wink:


^ I second that!

So far, I didn't recognized the site beeing slow ...

Thanks a million for the effort you guys invest in this great forum.
I'll support the donation idea, if needed to keep the page alive.

[Chingachgook]

LOL no anal sex for me :lol: :lol:

BTW a BIG BIG thanks to Dan, FF, TT and of course Jabba. It's an incredible job, the site is superb, everyday updated, no problem and bugs at all.

For me it's ok free contributions or payment for the DL Members. I think you all deserve it :wink:

[LAMBOR]

We are also looking to provide small extras for the people who donate...maybe custom titles or an extra icon under their username. All ideas are welcome except for anal sex.


I surely agree with that :wink:

[ARMAN]

Yep, I would love to have JW gear :P You can buy them not that expensive from manufactures and print them. Ofcourse no cheap asian quality 8)

I am in for donation, will take a bit time for me but will pay no doubt here :P
I hope just people who wanna pay(non members) would not go automatically to DL area :? :wink:

Donations are excepted on daily basis on forums, theres nothng wrong with that I belive :)


Ofcourse you Jabba, Dan, TT and other mods that works on this site/mb thank you very much but it is just not enough as we all understand :wink: Web providers dont take "thank you" instead of paying bills.
Dan also deserves IMO monthly fee for his working day in night as we all see.

[liveseytowers]

Why not offer a premium member status where you get extra access? I go on corsasport (dont laugh, i have corsa and i know its shite) and they have a premium member server which is about £10 a year and you get a corsasport email address and an image hosting service.

The people that are premium members get the access to the vids etc then.

[ARMAN]

Maybe thread in membs area about costs and all that stuff would be great :)

[ZfrkS62]

well if i can remember my paypal username and password, i'll be glad to toss a couple bucks in.

As for the special custom titles and icons though, other than having the option of changing the Ferrari icons to something else, i'm not entirely sure. Seeing a big 'DONATING MEMBER' under user names on other forums is kind of a turn off for me. That and i wouldn't want to make other users who can't help out feel bad about it by knowing how many people have donated :bah: :hmm:

Cheers to Dan for busting his ass over this place for free and of course to Jabba for doing all he could to keep JW rent free up until now. I was wondering how long he could do it :D

[gis]

Donations or a subscription fee id be willing to do.you guys have all done a great job keeping JW as it is to this day for free.so count me in on whatever it is you decide to do. :D

[gis]

Why not offer a premium member status where you get extra access? I go on corsasport (dont laugh, i have corsa and i know its shite) and they have a premium member server which is about £10 a year and you get a corsasport email address and an image hosting service.

The people that are premium members get the access to the vids etc then.

that isnt a bad idea either,im also a paying member at ZSOC.com (zetec S owners club) and over there we get access to extra stuff,videos,pictures.discounts on parts,also a cool logo under our name,lol and that is £10 a year.

[Daggernite]

I'll gladly donate. The merchandise idea is a good one too, I seen a few sites which do that and sell mouse mats, cups, clothing, and obviously car stickers and that. Also you could have more than one plan put in place. Like a Donation scheme, a JW shop, and maybe a JW bonus account? where for a fee your could have your own custom title, fancy graphics for you name. I think a subscription might lose the entire feel of JW, because then we might lose current UL/DL members and Its that community people want. So yeah, I think a way to give money, and a way members can get something for there money is the best bet.

[sikx5]

Thanks to Jabba, TT, Dan and all the other fellas that keep this site running, I dont know much about maintain a site, but it can not be easy with such an active user group such as this. I am happy to donate, a worthy cause for sure! :D

[frodefe]

Make donations easy and safe - and you have one happy donator here :!:

[ae86_16v]

Umm, maybe girl scout cookies :) . J/king. Merchandise isn't a bad idea, there are a few sites on the web that will help you set it up. I don't know what kind of returns you could expect from it though.

Paypal I think charges a 2% fee. . . but over all I had pretty good experience with it.

But I'll gladly donate to help out.

[XTwinTurboVR4X]

Make donations easy and safe - and you have one happy donator here :!:

any donations will be via paypal, its easy and safe for end users, and as we already have a system in place for it the perfect solution - sure they charge a fee but so does any other payment gateway system so there's no gain by changing to an alternate system

as for merchandising, that's been looked at before and although its a good idea a few places got scared by the name 'jabbasworld' and refused because of copyright worries.. I guess we could change the site name then that won't be a problem, but I think that its something that probably has to go on the back burner for the moment


upgrade options, well there's only 2 choices really:
#1 - move to a similar spec server as we have now but with 100mb full duplex network connection.. this would solve the network issues we keep having and allow downloads at an unlimited speed to everyone
#2 - move to higher spec server with 100mbit network connection, curing the connection issues and leaving more room for future improvements and growth of the site, and curing the server load problems.

personally I'd really like it to be #2, for 2 main reasons.. first I dont want to have to move everything to a new server more times than necessary, and 2nd and most importantly, as you've probably noticed once we get a few people online the page generation times go up quite a bit, and ATM its possible for one person requesting a 'heavy' page many times in a short period of time to knock the server over so no one can get any pages :( .. a faster cpu / more ram and better hard drives would really help in this area

as it is I already optimised a lot of code to help and it has, although unless I strip out a lot of the site features (not going to happen) we will still sometimes have a server load problem and that isn't going away until we get a faster server

[Evo]

voluntary donations would be a great idea but I think dingo idea is a good one.. DL/UL club should at least have some kind of a fee.. I know most of them have some trouble but some can help out and I am up for it..

Maybe you won't like this idea a lot jabba but it's one way to get people paying is that you offer some new member who are only here for the video a chance to download the video by paying a fee and I am sure you will get few..this idea should be combined with the above..

[Anonymous]

Well if it ever becomes a pay to DL vid site i'd be off straight away, not my kind of thing. Volutary donations to improve JW are quite another thing, I know there are alot of ideas for the future development. I'm not however comfortable with this all being focused on the vid side, JW is about so much more than that and i find it hypocritical considering our previous opposition to accepting donations to effectively aid piracy on other sites :bah:

What can i say i'm not going to bullshit. I was going to leave this topic alone but suggestions of a pay service i can't leave, some members are unable for whatever reason to donate/ pay, does that make them any less valauable to the site???
On the other hand it is totally unfair that Jabba should continue to support something totally himself which i'm sure has grown far more than he could have ever expected. I'm sure we could quite easily cover it with a bit of couch change each per month from a good proportion of the core members. Sucks that those who give most to the site already have to also donate but i'd rather have that than ecourage fucking leeching arseholes.

[Schwalbe]

I'm of those who want to pay a contribution to JW by paypal and to buy JW stuffs like t-shirts and stickers. I will find that idea normal in the interest of the best car forum on the Web. :D


I benefit from the occasion to underline the remarkable job of Dan who have saved the premiere of 5thGear show. http://www.rs6.com/smilies/thumbsup.gif

[Jabba]

which i'm sure has grown far more than he could have ever expected.

Thats for sure...its basically at what level you can afford to run something for free.

Krazy Hawaiians forum is limited to about 15 members because he runs it from his own PC...but at least its free...obviously thats not going to develop into much though.

My level is as it is today...but it either stops...or continues to improve and move forward....but I will need some help with the funding to take it to the next level I am afraid.

[twboy1999]

i just saw this topic.. like many of the member, i am surprise how long the site has been running priviately

now..donation is a great idea.. but not everyone is going to donate, even the people in the download group,, for sure majority of the people not in the donwload group would not donate..

so my suggestion is that,, yess creat a donation, and maybe put on 1 ad or 2 ad max.. to support the site.. pretty sure the donation it self, would not be enough to run the site.. this way. we could get some advertising money and donation money, without the site getting full of ads

[coombsie66]

Jabba I totally empathise with your position, i dont think anyone ever expected JW to get this big, but with the rate of growth, this situation was inevitable.
Happy to make a donation here. :)

[Jabba]

i just saw this topic.. like many of the member, i am surprise how long the site has been running priviately

now..donation is a great idea.. but not everyone is going to donate, even the people in the download group,, for sure majority of the people not in the donwload group would not donate..

so my suggestion is that,, yess creat a donation, and maybe put on 1 ad or 2 ad max.. to support the site.. pretty sure the donation it self, would not be enough to run the site.. this way. we could get some advertising money and donation money, without the site getting full of ads

I hate ads and thats why there wont be any.

[ZfrkS62]

have we tried purging the entirely inactive members from the database? probably..i always think of the obvious way to late :lol:

if we really wanted to show donating members, we could change their name color to blue or something.

Dan, how much do you think option 2 would cost?

[whskynwmn]

have we tried purging the entirely inactive members from the database? probably..i always think of the obvious way to late :lol:

that woudnt really help at all

[yg60m]

as you've probably noticed once we get a few people online the page generation times go up quite a bit, and ATM its possible for one person requesting a 'heavy' page many times in a short period of time to knock the server over so no one can get any pages :( .. a faster cpu / more ram and better hard drives would really help in this area

as it is I already optimised a lot of code to help and it has, although unless I strip out a lot of the site features (not going to happen) we will still sometimes have a server load problem and that isn't going away until we get a faster server

I didn't see any slow load ... but I am on 56k so there is no difference between a slow and a fast loading page :lol:


What can i say i'm not going to bullshit. I was going to leave this topic alone but suggestions of a pay service i can't leave, some members are unable for whatever reason to donate/ pay, does that make them any less valauable to the site???


I am sure it wasn't the idea :wink: no service to pay, if you want to donate then it's ok but (I suppose) nobody will know it except Jabba and admins ... that would be fair I think : giving the total but not the donaters or even not giving the total I don't know. ...

[Anonymous]

if we really wanted to show donating members, we could change their name color to blue or something.



Is the nice feeling of giving something back not enough for you people :P I agree with what someone else said earlier, no need for any special visable things, just make others not in a position to donate feel bad. Just offer some other perks as suggested earlier in the thread IMO.




What can i say i'm not going to bullshit. I was going to leave this topic alone but suggestions of a pay service i can't leave, some members are unable for whatever reason to donate/ pay, does that make them any less valauable to the site???


I am sure it wasn't the idea :wink: no service to pay, if you want to donate then it's ok but (I suppose) nobody will know it except Jabba and admins ... that would be fair I think : giving the total but not the donaters or even not giving the total I don't know. ...

Sure i know they don't want to do that, just I wanted people to stop bloody suggesting it :P its a crap idea.

[ZfrkS62]

^^ that was me AL!

[Anonymous]

^^ that was me AL!

ah lol well its a good idea to offer perks, i'm dipping in and out of this topic when i should be finishing this proposal :lol: bloody JW so distracting :P

[yg60m]

I think all the reasonable people are agree :wink:

[Jabba]

It looks like the extras is liked by all....perhaps some small and basic image hosting.

[Roadster44]

well the best perks IMO would be the ones that any visitor gets to enjoy.. a fast site with more features and more content ;)

one idea I have if we can get a better server with more hard drive spce is to code our own image hosting service kinda like imageshack.. but specifically for use just by JW.. hosted on the same server so the images are always available and load superfast

[RC45]

Would some "cheap" but powerful hardware that - uhm, fell off a truck help?

What sort of specs?

[Jabba]

well the best perks IMO would be the ones that any visitor gets to enjoy.. a fast site with more features and more content ;)

one idea I have if we can get a better server with more hard drive spce is to code our own image hosting service kinda like imageshack.. but specifically for use just by JW.. hosted on the same server so the images are always available and load superfast

OK I am quite happy to order the server you have suggested and hope once everyone sees what it has to offer that they will be happier to put something towards it.

[ZfrkS62]

any chance we could consider this a belated b-day/xmas present to the site itself? :D put in perspective, i think it does kind of work out that way (at least in my twisteed little mind :mrgreen:

[jonas240z]

Would some "cheap" but powerful hardware that - uhm, fell off a truck help?

What sort of specs?

haha well.. the only problem I see with having our own hardware is you need colocation hosting, so you need someone local who can go and set it up, and be available 24/7 to go and fix it if there is a problem, and as the uk sucks for that the only real option is the US.. sure its possible if we had someone trustworthy to do those things BUT I still prefer to rent a server and let the datacentre be responsible for hardware side of it, they pay for new patrs if it breaks and are always there to fix it quickly.. that way you dont have to worry about it

[BADMIHAI]

I would gladly donate if I had access to the said download features. :|

[Jabba]

any chance we could consider this a belated b-day/xmas present to the site itself? :D put in perspective, i think it does kind of work out that way (at least in my twisteed little mind :mrgreen:

Thats a good idea....rather than getting me anything for xmas or my birthday I would prefer you put the money towards the site. Presents are a PITA now anyway.

[jon_s]

In the long run I am not sure that voluntary donations is a viable idea. There may be an influx of money initially for those who support the site, but sure even those of us who have the best intentions would 'forget' to continue donating. Even if I am wrong, there would be no way to gauge how much money is going to come in. Obviously the worst case (although unlikely) would be that no money comes in for a period of time meaning that Jabba would have to cover the costs.

The soultion? I have no answers, maye a two tier system. I don't mean this to segrigate the 'population' in any way, but we could have the voulntary donation avaliable to every member. Upon donation some form of reward/perk should follow. This would allow those who do not want to be tied in (however losely) to an annual subscription. I am very selective with my subscriptions, which means that if I was any less dedicated to this site I would think twice about signing up. I am fairly sure this would apply to a fair few of JW's members.

So the second tier would be a full blown subscription. I would comfortably pay £20-30 a year. Again some form of perk would be nice. Although I am pretty happy with what I have got thus far 0X

[Jabba]

Yeh we are looking towards an annual subscription with extra benefits at the moment it seems.

[Anonymous]

I would gladly donate if I had access to the said download features. :|

you see thats what i'm not comfortble with, if people donate it should be because they enjoy the site and its wealth of features/ community, not to download some vids, not to mention the potential legal minefield. I know some will think just because they donate they have some god given right to everything, though i'm sure they'll be told to take a long run of a very short pier or something less pleasant :P Really I don't want this to become another RF, its pathetic there, just take a look round its dead.

[Jabba]

I think the main point is the members who currently have access to everything and wish it to remain that way and receive future benefits want to know what they can do to help out...and we are trying to work out a fair way to do just that.

[TransAm]

In the long run I am not sure that voluntary donations is a viable idea. There may be an influx of money initially for those who support the site, but sure even those of us who have the best intentions would 'forget' to continue donating. Even if I am wrong, there would be no way to gauge how much money is going to come in. Obviously the worst case (although unlikely) would be that no money comes in for a period of time meaning that Jabba would have to cover the costs.

The soultion? I have no answers, maye a two tier system. I don't mean this to segrigate the 'population' in any way, but we could have the voulntary donation avaliable to every member. Upon donation some form of reward/perk should follow. This would allow those who do not want to be tied in (however losely) to an annual subscription. I am very selective with my subscriptions, which means that if I was any less dedicated to this site I would think twice about signing up. I am fairly sure this would apply to a fair few of JW's members.

So the second tier would be a full blown subscription. I would comfortably pay £20-30 a year. Again some form of perk would be nice. Although I am pretty happy with what I have got thus far 0X

Here here

Happy to donate/subscribe on a yearly basis.

Based on the current number of regular users and the yearly cost delta over and above what you are paying now, Jabba, do you have any rough idea what the yearly subscription would need to be?

Edit: If you want, I am happy to do some costing exercises for JW

[BADMIHAI]

I would gladly donate if I had access to the said download features. :|

you see thats what i'm not comfortble with, if people donate it should be because they enjoy the site and its wealth of features/ community, not to download some vids, not to mention the potential legal minefield. I know some will think just because they donate they have some god given right to everything, though i'm sure they'll be told to take a long run of a very short pier or something less pleasant :P Really I don't want this to become another RF, its pathetic there, just take a look round its dead.

Oh please. I've had access to those features before you were around JW. :roll: But, on the other hand you do have a point. Giving access to those videos for money would be a legal nightmare and would destroy the fabric of JW. However, I don't see many (if any) people paying only for access to the forums. It doesn't take a hugely powerful server just to keep forums running. Most of the load is due to downloads.

[Ghostbat]

I'd be happy to pay an annual fee. Almost feel like I'm getting away with steeling, having all this stuff here for free.

[Jabba]

It doesn't take a hugely powerful server just to keep forums running. Most of the load is due to downloads.

Can we just not start another argument here please. You will just have to take my word for it that Dan does so much stuff in the background I would have to say that calling anything "forums" is a complete insult and you are just asking for trouble.

I used to run "forums" and there is a big difference between then and now, like about 60 % more than just "forums" and that is without the downloads.

[Anonymous]

I would gladly donate if I had access to the said download features. :|

you see thats what i'm not comfortble with, if people donate it should be because they enjoy the site and its wealth of features/ community, not to download some vids, not to mention the potential legal minefield. I know some will think just because they donate they have some god given right to everything, though i'm sure they'll be told to take a long run of a very short pier or something less pleasant :P Really I don't want this to become another RF, its pathetic there, just take a look round its dead.

Oh please. I've had access to those features before you were around JW. :roll: But, on the other hand you do have a point. Giving access to those videos for money would be a legal nightmare and would destroy the fabric of JW. However, I don't see many (if any) people paying only for access to the forums. It doesn't take a hugely powerful server just to keep forums running. Most of the load is due to downloads.

well ask dan what happens in a large forum, not a little club that has one masturbating storyteller talking to himself wondering where everyone is?? JW does slow down when alot of people are requesting pages, pics in the gallery etc, also grinds to a halt when backing up from one HD to another

[jon_s]

I think the babes section is at fault :P

Do we have a rough idea of how much the transfer to a new server would cost? Or would that info best be kept quiet for now.

[Jabba]

I think the babes section is at fault :P

Do we have a rough idea of how much the transfer to a new server would cost? Or would that info best be kept quiet for now.

There is so much more to it than that...its hard to put a price on it....I am sure we all know what basic computers are like...something that should take 5 minutes can take 5 hours...also a point that allan has made about encoding videos....if things go according to plan then "x" should happen and will take "y" minutes to finish...sadly...very rarely do things work out quite as you plan them...and everything always takes longer and is harder to do than you first think it will be.

[Minacious]

Situations like this will always be a touchy subject because there are so many variables involved it is impossible to make everyone happy.

There is so much content going back and forth and a ton of background stuff going on that many can’t even begin fathom. Something along these lines was bound to happen. I know many may not agree with me, but I think there should be a subscription fee. With all the readily available content, why not pay a little for it, especially if you consider yourself part of this family. We would be helping each other out in the long run.

Whatever is ultimately decided upon, I am all for.

[Jabba]

I think its best we stick to the birthday/xmas presents idea but this time lets buy something for the site. A better server is something we can all benefit from.

[blinkmeat]

And the economics penetrates the best of all things - again

First off thank you Jabba and Dan for creating and keeping this place what it is. Everyone loves it and that's just that :D

I do have a suggestion for you though: Why not register JW as a business? It provides a service to it's members - then just write-off the costs...?

[BADMIHAI]

And the economics penetrates the best of all things - again



I do have a suggestion for you though: Why not register JW as a business? It provides a service to it's members - then just write-off the costs...?

Surely that would be just registering a bootlegging operation as a business. WTF are you thinking?

[racer_f50]

I'd be more than happy to donate or subscribe as well.

Can't say that I've actually noticed any slowdowns (this place is always lightning quick compared to RSC), so great work Dan in keeping it running.

[Minacious]

I do have a suggestion for you though: Why not register JW as a business? It provides a service to it's members - then just write-off the costs...?

Not a wise idea with much of the content that goes through these pipes.

[ARMAN]

Subscription I think should be for dl membs only cause it would turn off 90% the rest of people.
I personally never get in the site that want a payment from me without me knowing if it worth it at all.

[nthfinity]

i think right about all the regular members have a deep appreciation for all that Jabba, Dan, Fishfreek, and TT do for this site.

from the time i first joined this site nearing 2 years now, this is the only one of its nature... nothing even touches it! thats how great its been to me; and im sure at least several hundred of us feel the same way.

im glad to hear ads will never be here for one. i am entirely in support of supporting a full server upgrade. as with anything in life, treading water as slowly dying. improving is the only way; a lot of which we've seen Dan this year alone. everything he's done is simply amazing.

as far as payment, i cant pretend to know how much the said improvements will cost, nor how much you've been spending to give us what we've had thus far.
as some know, my finances are the worst they've ever been; which ive been working on several projects to remedy this... but know that upon my ability to support this project, i will.

regarding a suggested meathod, the Admins know who has/hasn't paid; and limiting user privliges, and reminders via pm might be a way to do this.
for non-regulars; the benefits such as email/image sharing seems a good insentive.

JW gear is something many of us have wanted; i hope that idea isnt totally lost, even though its been turned down time and again by manufacturers... but i still think finding one, or through brembo; i still think its a great idea.

also, when possible, it would help to know a flex-figure we could assist in... eg: 100 pay $, punds/euros XXX.XX etc. and before donations are given, a pledge thread is started so we have a goal... also making the potential JW store completely separate.

just my 2 p

[Jabba]

I don't really want to change the site in anyway with advertising or anything like it...just keeping the site running smoothly and being able to add new and better features is the main goal.

I am glad that we have had mostly positive thoughts in trying to achieve this so far.

[ZfrkS62]

nth- i think it would be better to just leave it a voulunary donation amound since alot of people here are in school and have much more important expenses to tend to, so if they have a little left over to give it would be no problem.

[Chaos in 1983!]

Here's my two cents, I think this forum is by far the best one on the net, not to mention that we are such a great comunity. I'd be more than happy to support JW with anything I can.

Subscription might not be the ideal way to call it, as Jabba said we could consider this as a Xmas present to the site, just something to benefit and improove the site. That way we wouldn't be involved in "selling" pirated stuff...

About the JW gear, well it's something I would really like, but it involves expenses, money that could go directly into the server. I think mostly core members would buy the JW gear, and would probably buy a couple of stuff and that's it...so I don't really know if it's worth the hassle.

Anyways, I'll agree with whatever Jabba and the admins decide...

A HUGE thanks to Jabba, Dan, and the rest of the admin team for taking the time, money and effort from their personal life to keep this site running...

[Toronto]

where is the donate button already?
I'm in!

[Darkel]

Of course I completely understand the situation, I read some comments posted here but I just wanted to add my opinion, sorry if this has already been said.

I agree with the donation system via paypal, but something that we need to keep in mind is the age of the dl/ul members, I'm willing to contribute to JW in order to keep it running and so on, but I'm currently still not the legal age. On the one hand I cannot use that system to transfer money, and on the other hand I could not just say to my parents "hey I want to contribute to a car forum on the internet because it's great and they need some funds".
IMO the donation shouldn't be "forced" cause that would mean that some members, even if they contribute to the community can't access the group just because they can't give money, that would be exactly the same as a premium membership costing X € per year :bah:

But as I said before, as soon as it will be possible for me, I'll donate

[dutchmasterflex]

It would be a great idea to have a paypal donation button on the homepage.. I'm sure many users (as you can see) would be willing to donate to keep JabbasWorld alive. I'm close to having a negative balance in the bank and no source of income.. but when I start my internship in January I will gladly make donations..

Until then I am willing to do anything else to help out the cause.. A couple of fund raising ideas couldnt hurt..

I assume a bandwidth cap hass been in effect to help share the speeds?

[nthfinity]

I assume a bandwidth cap hass been in effect to help share the speeds?

im very sure thats not the case

the only time ive ever noticed slower d/l is when the server has been maxed out, and even then, it was only 100kb/s slower then my current max speed.

[jaime_25]

IMO the donation shouldn't be "forced"

it wont ever be forced.. and while there might be one or 2 perks for those who do 'donate' becoming a member of the d/l club is not going to be one of them..

[Ziploc]

We are also looking to provide small extras for the people who donate...maybe custom titles or an extra icon under their username.

Honestly those are great ideas. Forums like something aweful do things like that. They also do custom ads as well like TT is a s00per d00per mod! being shown randomly.

As for other ideas. Hmm... there are those places to get items printed with your logo for profit. Who wouldn't like Jabbasworld Panties for theyre GF.

Works for me.

[Toronto]

IMO the donation shouldn't be "forced"

it wont ever be forced.. and while there might be one or 2 perks for those who do 'donate' becoming a member of the d/l club is not going to be one of them..

I think a fair perk would be, people who donate, should be allowed to download a file put up a few days before others in the DL club. (like a ticket pre-sale)

[leo_26782]

First: Thanks to all the JW team for keeping this site up and running :D

Now some of my thought after discovering this thread today: moving to better server would be a one time cost? What about a donation for the first time, followed by some PM on a more or less random basis to ask members to contribute? That would stay on a voluntary basis, but it could be a way to motivate people, without having everyone paying one, and then a big gap. What about an account transfer also (I know nothing about the other ways to do those payment :oops: )?

Finally, be sure that I'm in whatever the solution is.

[Fleischmann]

I won't be original by starting my post with a huge thank you to the "staff" of JW, I admire your devotion to this site and all the effort put into it keeping this splendid site up and running 24/7. What you guys have created is a miracle.

I was expecting this for sometime now...with the growing number of videos and users an increse in bandwidth is essential and it was only a matter of time before this decision had to be made. I'm afraid I won't be able to donate any money for some time as my uni costs a fair bit of money however I shall try to send even a symbolic sum every now and then to somehow show my graditude and will to help. I wouldn't even mind if JW lost it's status of an ad-free site. I'm pretty sure nobody would mind having a few ad's on the front page if it where to help the situation (and it definatelly would, judging by the traffice this site has). Anyhow, a custom title and/or a logo by a donators avatar is a nice idea.

JW forever.

[gucom]

wow im ashamed to admit that ive been taking JW for granted a bit lately...but as soon as i have my drivers license (and will be able to say how much i can spare) id be more than happy to donate some money to htis great site...its the best internet forum ever i think...

[jakaracman]

I'd hate to see a subscription fee - it just wouldnt feel right to subscribe to a site on which ... you konow what, 5th Gear, Top Gear ...
I'd gladly donate, though ... I hiope Papal works ion this backwards country here ...

[Overmind]

jabba: can you maybe just give us a hint how much more expensive the new server (+100Mbit) would be compared to what you are paying right now? What kind of sum would it be per year?

dan: just to make sure, you ever had a look at this? http://www.phpbb.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=135383

[MadMax]

dan: just to make sure, you ever had a look at this? http://www.phpbb.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=135383

sure and done some other stuff that isn't listed there but is relevant to JW..

[Overmind]

we're seriously fucked up then :), purging half the pix and vids should do the trick though...

:(

Donations might help, but since we're going to need the money every month to pay for the managed server, it really depends on how expensive it will be...

[hamlet]

Hi everybody, after reading all your posts, here is my contribution to the overall thinking:

- First, I am not that familiar with severs and so on, therefore I do not know whether the migration to a new server would be a single or a yearly expense.

- Then, I think the first to do would be to get an idea of the cost and to check whether by a donation or suscription the solution is feasible...because then depends the survival of JW!

- Of course, everybody interested in JW would be happy to contribute, but first to save the site we need to be told by our moderators what we need to put, this would immediately re-center the discussion.


IMO, I am convinced that a yearly suscription fee is a possible solution. This would help to save the site and to regularly bring the necessary upgrades. Of course I also understand the people not supporting this idea, because it can be that for some reasons you are not able to pay.

What I could suggest, is to give the possibility to new members to use the site for free during a couple a months (?) to check what it is about. Then, after this, they would know and could decide to join or to leave. On the other end, it would allow the JW's community to know the new comers and the assess their "intentions" and their real contribution to the site. Of course, as the world is not black and white and as our moderators are not dictators, it would then be possible on a case by case to admit people that could not afford the suscription fees for good reasons but whose contribution to the expension of the site would be assumed valuable. This would be completely transparent and would only be known by the administrators. For the other, their would then be a yearly suscription fee.

Concerning the access to the UL/DL club, I think that payment to the suscription should not automatically grant the access. As a new member, of course I find cool the possibility to download videos, but I think that the current "forum" is reach enough to allow people to exchange a lot without the need to download megabites of videos. I think that the essence of the forum is not to be only a video-server but to allow people with the same passion to discuss. So for me, the current way of working should be kept.

So here are my thoughts about the subject... I simply hope that this great forum will continue and I am ready to support what needs to be done.

greetings to all people that work to keep this site running :good:

[nthfinity]

it really depends on how expensive it will be...

well, to me this isnt just buying a new server... but dan having a full-time job to keep 'er running... also, it depends on how many people are going to contribute... the total is the same... but spread out, its much easier for the masses to afford.

[mhn3773]

deleting files to save bandwidth isn't going to help at all.. it still only takes a few poeple with fast broadband to max the connection out, and then that makes the ftp fuckup and slows down response to page requests from people browsing the forum/gallery

most of the server load is caused by the huge database that has to be searched everytime someone loads a page, too many requests in a short time and it starts to slow down, and all we can do to improve that is have a faster cpu / memory and hard drives

edit: not to mention the fact that the current server is always running out of disk space and we end up deleting files to add new stuff, so bigger drives would be nice too

[Jabba]

it really depends on how expensive it will be...

well, to me this isnt just buying a new server... but dan having a full-time job to keep 'er running... also, it depends on how many people are going to contribute... the total is the same... but spread out, its much easier for the masses to afford.

That is an extremely good point and cannot be stressed enough.

[Jabba]

heres an idea... obviously some members use more content and bandwitdh than others. i dont know if this would be far too complex for dan but maybe depending on bandith a pm could be sent to individual members about how much badwitdh they are using and then give a suggested donation based on usage. :?: .... probably way too complicated

Not so much about bandwidth...but more server power....

[hamlet]

I think that anyway it is impossible to find a solution that will make everybody happy. Therefore, it should come from our moderators, and they are the only ones able to decide...

Anyway, I fully rely on them...just see the success of JW!!

[ZfrkS62]

if i donate can i get pink horses? :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

I'm thinking rainbow scheme for you :P j/k

[Daggernite]

Well if money is needed, then thats as simple as that. Theres no point saying we dont want this and dont want that, or the problem wont get resolved. Having a donation link might not cure the problem, but it can only help, it wont hurt anyone, so why not get one up ASAP and see how it works out?

I know what everyone is thinking about the maybe subscriptions. No one wants to feel inferior to anyone else, or be in any kind of hierachy in relation to how much money they donate. They want to be on the same level as everyone else in the club. And keep it the same as it has always been. Also you dont want the focus to go towards running cost, and be taken away from contribution and community.

So considering, I think a donation button should go on the page somewhere, so money can be collect ASAP. Thoughts and ideas can be thought up in the mean time in regards to custom titles and all that. But at least money could be built up, and an idea will be formed as to how much money can be made.
Also merchandise is another way to make money, which wouldn't make anyone seem "better" than anyone else, and seemingly give em a "higher rank". I know theres copyright problems, but you can would around them, like maybe just having a "JW" stickers and logos on a shirt. Theres no need to have Jabbasworld if that causes a problem. I think them are the best options so far when considering the reasons.

I'm not the best writer at trying to get across what I mean, so I hope its understandable. :)

[Jabba]

Not sure if we can make that an official option but we will do our best to please everyone :P

[|Nuno|]

Well, I'm pretty late for this thread so I'll probably be repeating what the others have said... Anyway, first of all I must say that the staff has done an amazing job on this site. So thanks for that. :) This is by far the best car-related Forum on the Internet. Hell, since I joined here it became the only forum where I post!

So yeah, back on topic, I think the donations and merchandise/email thingy would be a good idea. But right now, I'm on the same boat as Darkel; and I'm sure I'm not the only one, seeing how many members under 18 the site has. :| But whenever I can, I'd be more than happy to help.

[FPVPSI]

I would be more then happy to 'chip' in...i love this site, and i would hate to see it shut down... :oops:

Just one thing though...when the donating starts, could there be a bank account i directly transfer money too? I really dont want to go down the patpal, credit card path...

[Evo]

Jabba I think for now the donation idea is quite a good one.. Try it out and it will help at least it's a start..

[Ziploc]

No one in favour with the Jabbasworld printed panties fund raiser? :P

[djv]

No one in favour with the Jabbasworld printed panties fund raiser? :P

sure.. one condition though - we will need pics of them being modelled by the recipients as proof they are being put to good use 8)

[Overmind]

deleting files to save bandwidth isn't going to help at all.. it still only takes a few poeple with fast broadband to max the connection out, and then that makes the ftp fuckup and slows down response to page requests from people browsing the forum/gallery


I was thinking if the current server is moved to the 100Mbit line, it might only make things worse ;) as downloading users will be able to put even more presure on the server during load peaks :).

[ZfrkS62]

No one in favour with the Jabbasworld printed panties fund raiser? :P

sure.. one condition though - we will need pics of them being modelled by the recipients as proof they are being put to good use 8)

my g/f is going to wonder why there is a JW on her crotch...but i'm all for it :D

[weichenoo]

I was thinking if the current server is moved to the 100Mbit line, it might only make things worse ;) as downloading users will be able to put even more presure on the server during load peaks :).

I'm sure we'll find they won't be maxing out a 100mbit line, and that will relieve the current bottleneck..

[RC45]

Wow, sad best luck to you peoples :mrgreen:

It's almost like you are gloating about something?

[gigdy]

I was just wondering what causes the highest loads? Is it the regulars or an increasing amount of lurkers?

[Anonymous]

Wow, sad best luck to you peoples :mrgreen:

It's almost like you are gloating about something?

well if he is its funny how he's considering donations to then. JW has been out of Jabba's own pockets for well over 2 years, only now because he wants his baby to grow even further has he asked for some help. Its not sad, its happy really, a new beginning almost :D

[graywolf624]

I actually do have a few technical suggestions:

Signatures.. If we cut down on pictures in signatures thats alot of bandwidth. Won't solve all our problems, but could help.

What type of database software are you running? How optimized is indexing?

Global memory and frees at bottom of pages.



That all being said.. I may be looking for recreational coding this fall if I get my new job(moving out of development and too financial analysis) Potentially I could help out with this aspect. Especially given my experience developing for several websites with usage and complexity rivaling jw at work. This is seperate from all the donation stuff.

Dennis

[TransAm]

...very rarely do things work out quite as you plan them...and everything always takes longer and is harder to do than you first think it will be.

Sounds a familiar tale (this happens all the time in my industry :roll: )

[bmagni]

i think its a nice idea, i knew this would habppen sooner or later, whats it gonna be, paypal ?

[bmagni]

ok, so i was thinking, wasnt JW.net gonna get changed to carjungle.net ???
wouldnt it help to use one domain for the forums and all the possible members to visit and another to host the vids ???
wouldnt that reduce costs ??

[abdul123]

Signatures.. If we cut down on pictures in signatures thats alot of bandwidth. Won't solve all our problems, but could help.


that would help if the images were hosted on JW server and if the problem was how much b/w we use :).. but it isnt, the bandwidth problem is just that currently we have a shitty 10mb net connection that just cant cope at peak times and becomes a bottleneck - we always have many gigs of the monthly bandwidth allocation left over each month ;)

[graywolf624]

Yes, but if you bandwidth cap connections using a load balancer and cut down some of the extra stuff like the pictures that are on the server(didnt realize they weren't Ive never looked)... Then again you might not have control over things like what load balancing software since its at a data center.

[blah]

Do you accept sex as payment?

[callen]

well I know i dont have ANY money to contribute right now to Jabbas world, since I am in University and literally have 250 bucks to my name right now....BUT i do have a credit card and I can always do it the american way: "buy now, pay later" i totally support contributions as long as they are economically feasible for us "poorer' members. 8)

[ZfrkS62]

idea to get around the copyright thing: He legally changes his name to Jabba :wink:

Seriously though, i think that for the regular members, an extension of the fast track dl group would be a great idea, extending them into the homemade section of the vault, that would bypass the whole copyright issue about top/5th gear.

dunno what there would be for DL members...but i don't really care, cuz we've been reaping the benefits of Jabba's generousity and the admin's hard work.

[callen]

yah i dont agree that payment (donation) should make you any more valuable than the next guy who didnt donate as much... plus I thought there was copyright issues with top gear/ 5th gear.... so we shouldnt just let any old guy with $20 bucks access to all the vids... should we? I dont think so, I still believe you have to work for the perks on this site, and that it should not be something you can buy.
And with that said, I will donate without a doubt.

[T-Bird]

well I figured something like this was coming someday so I am more than happy to help out anyway I can.

[GT-R_R34]

i'm so behind on my reading in JW. i just found this tread and what ever happened i'm 100% for what ever discission you guys have.

[nthfinity]

.hell I`ll label them Armani if thats what he wants...(this would have to be done in the night time at work tough as faking brand names are not something we do... )

LMAO Brembo, thats hilarious; im all for JW merchandice, but i cirtainly dont want you in jeopardy :wink:

whats goin on with phatbimer... he seemed cool enough before?
now it seems hes an asshat :?

Edit:
Holy crap, i just recieved a costom title! kick ass :!: thankyou Jabba ;)

[ZfrkS62]

you just now noticed it? i saw that earlier today :lol:

[nthfinity]

i spent some hours defragmenting earlier, not much JW surfing earlier today, until about about 15 minutes ago :lol:

[callen]

Holy crap, i just recieved a costom title! kick ass :!: thankyou sir (Dan?)

I wish i was special too :cry: :cry: :cry: heheh I like ur title its a cool one!

[RC45]

whats goin on with phatbimer... he seemed cool enough before?
now it seems hes an asshat :?

My observations as well ;)



Edit:
Holy crap, i just recieved a costom title! kick ass :!: thankyou sir (Dan?)
Awesome... :P

http://going24-7.com/pins/images2/buzz_lightyear_surfing_0503.jpg

;) hehe

[WhiteP]

I really like the idea of donation. I just hope that the donation is enough to keep JW running. The initial donation may be big money and enough to help JW solves the current issue since everyone never donate to JW before. However, once members donate to JW a few times or even the first time, they may not or will not donate again after the first few payments. Then JW will face the same problem again.

Anyways, I m really out of idea. If the donation thing is ready, I can always contribute some money. Even though I m saving a downpayment for my first piece of real estate, I really have to help JW. JW is pretty much the best site I can find online, providing so many car videos I ever want, and many nice people like Jabba, TT, Dan, FF and many others....... Thanks! Thank you so much!

Count me in!!!

[nchs09]

this has to be one of the biggest threads evah. not in size but every reply is like HALF A PAGE :P



well as a member of jw i dont use the forum alot now to post. i mostly lurk and when i see an intresting topic i post.. but jw still holds a place as one of the only 2 forums i post in.. and i used to post in it ALL THE TIME
but time is not on my side now a days


so whatever u decide.. donations or fee for pics and what not...


i will contribute :)


*edit*


btw i know whatever happens ill help out BUT so that no more strain happens again in the future... how about regulating size of signatures?

i mean some of them are CRAZY huge and im sure that slows down alot.
also im sure the search button is @ fault for slowing down forums as on www.tranceaddict.com we have THE SAME problem. maybe a way to fix that?

**second edit*** ok read some and saw someone suggested about the sigs. well how about making the avatars only pics and not jifs. look @ urs dan. i mean ya its cool but little here little there helps alot

not putting anything on u. but i say just pics in avatars and not crazy gifs

[sameerrao]

I'm in. The site rocks. Jabba, Pls post the paypal details up.

[Pokiou]

Hey guys i know i dont come here much but im still willing to put some money in let it be 10 aus or 100 aussie dollars...

this forum is great so keep up the work

Pok

[stmoritzer]

after having read the newest 60 posts :shock: since I left yesterday, I can support the ideas of callen, hamlet and brembo

to make it short: IMO,

free access to the forum for new members for a couple of month, so they will see how cool JW is or leave - and the Oldies and especially the Mods can "check" the new mebers (if you've to pay from start, "nobody" will subscribe without knowing what he gets)
...
after that, an annual subscriptions is the most faisable way IMO to cover the costs... after subscriptions -> access to UL/DL club (comment: I second the previously mentioned idea of not giving everybody willing to pay a direct access to the vids -> this would end in some guys only downloading the unique amount of HQ-vids from JW server without contributing to the community)

so the subscription and the Access to UL/DL club is somehow connected (it make sense, the big amount of traffic is done in this section, am I right Dan? ) but of course the Mods are free to decide case by case...


Dan/Jabba what do you think about this way foreward ?

8)

[bultaco_metralla]

too much pages to read... ive read the start and some ideas, i dont have a work and dont have much money but if my Bultaco has to wait a little more to help the site it will wait!! It has been waiting 30 years!!!

[philios55]

Its really sad to hear that this website came to this point,
but it was inevitable :!:
Many of the ideas the members already said are really
good and i hope we find solution for this problem fast:

:idea: What about a small Jabbasworld Shop inside the forum where we
have all kind of stuff for sale t-shirs,hats etc. I'm sure the majority of the
20000+ members would love to buy some of those gear and it would generate a lot of money for the Jabbasworld upgrade for years to come :!:

[Anonymous]

Its really sad to hear that this website came to this point,
but it was inevitable :!:
Many of the ideas the members already said are really
good and i hope we find solution for this problem fast:

:idea: What about a small Jabbasworld Shop inside the forum where we
have all kind of stuff for sale t-shirs,hats etc. I'm sure the majority of the
20000+ members would love to buy some of those gear and i would generate a lot of money for the Jabbasworld upgrade for years to come :!:

Only real problem with a shop is its more work and postage could be a nightmare!! we are so far flung it is more difficult to distribute. Oh and will people stop saying its sad :lol: how is making JW even better in years to come sad?? maybe because we have to crowbar open our wallets or take the cushions off the sofa :P

Personally i can't wait to see all the new features in JW mk2, i mean just look how popular one of the latest new additions is, where else do you get different video each week of that standard available to every member?? ( that doesn't run out of B/W or go slow as shit) seems popular to, consistantly over 300 dl's its only going to go up iMO, now if we could just get people to comment it would be perfect :D

[nthfinity]

Personally i can't wait to see all the new features in JW mk2, i mean just look how popular one of the latest new additions is, where else do you get a video of that standard available to every member?? seems popular to, consistantly over 300 dl's its only going to go up iMO, now if we could just get people to comment it would be perfect

i look forward to it myself :)
al, does that mean that all the vids on the portal are available to every registered member? or just the videos of the week?

[stradale]

Sorry to hear about all the troubles you guys are having to keep this site up. It can't be stressed enough you're doing a fantastic job! Don't regret you need to do change some things to let JW remain the great community it is and to let it evolv further. Maybe you even should have done this sooner.

Anyway, I'm all for donations. However, keep them voluntary! Difference in member status should be on the basis of involvement with JW only. Perks granted after donation should IMO be nothing more than that: perks. Not susbstantial difference in features. Then of course there are the legal matters. A subscription to enable downloading is a hazardous situation IMO and could lead to more and bigger problems than there are now.

In order to keep people motivated to donate once in a while we need to have some sort of system. Somone already mentioned PMs. I think it would be a good way to send people who have donated in the past a PM after a while kindly reminding them donations are needed to run JW. You could also add this message to the start of videos downloaded from JW to try and get more people to donate.

I know that voluntary donations do not provide consistent and reliable income, but IMO it's still favourable to some sort of subscription.

Good luck on deciding what to do. I hope JW and the unique spirit of it will carry on for a very long time!

[adamwich]

I have just made a Paypal account and I am ready to donate! :D

[Anonymous]

Personally i can't wait to see all the new features in JW mk2, i mean just look how popular one of the latest new additions is, where else do you get a video of that standard available to every member?? seems popular to, consistantly over 300 dl's its only going to go up iMO, now if we could just get people to comment it would be perfect

i look forward to it myself :)
al, does that mean that all the vids on the portal are available to every registered member? or just the videos of the week?

just video of the week, the 10mbit server would explode if all of them were i reckon! :lol: even the shiny new one might get maxxed i suppose, there's enough leeches about!!

[Stikz]

Hey guys, Jabba and the admin team have done a fantastic job for so long. Obviously thanks you guys for the effort. I'm in for the donation or whatever, just say when and where. :D

[LotusGT1]

Agreed with what stradale said 4 posts above mine..

But in order to have a decent idea of what is needed I suggest a donation paypal button this instant minute and a "money-thermometer" to see how it's going and what still is needed.

At least give us some ballpark figure to know what money we are talking about here....

[djv]

you have to wait for Jabba to set up the paypal account for it, then I'll add a donate page to the site ;)



in the meantime can anyone say "Dan is logged in the new uber server now setting it up " ? 8)

[Anonymous]

YIPEE :D :D

[nthfinity]

Dan is logged in the new uber server, and now setting it up 8)
:shock:

Damn, that was FAST!

[ZfrkS62]

you have to wait for Jabba to set up the paypal account for it, then I'll add a donate page to the site ;)



in the meantime can anyone say "Dan is logged in the new uber server now setting it up " ? 8)

:shock: damn, you guys don't waste nay time in doing what must be done do you? :shock:

[Stingray]

well the response to this topic has been positive, so we decided to just get on with it ;)

[ZfrkS62]

did you really expect otherwise? :wink:

[stradale]

Hurrah!!! :D

Three cheers for Jabba, Dan, TT and the mod team!

[RC45]

JW mkII here we Come!!!!!!!!!!!!!

As long as we keep at least one black on white colour scheme for my old wore out eyes to view the forums with... ;) :P

[twboy1999]

whatever u guys decide on

please creat a new thread.....it would be hassle for people to find the page, where the final decision is made

[cateye]

Unfortunately I never use paypel some 1 plz tell me how to use it

[Daggernite]

Glad to see JW MKII is going ahead. All the strong support and great attitude is quite moving. I'm excited to see what is going to happen in the future.

[RC45]

whats goin on with phatbimer... he seemed cool enough before?
now it seems hes an asshat :?

My observations as well ;)

:? I comment on the bad news and I'm told that I'm gloating, what was I supposed to say? Little comments get taken way out of proportion here, I was joking seems nobody can take a joke anymore :lol:. In anycase "sorry" if it hurt anyones feelings

Don't be sorry for what you said - I know I'm not :|

[Jabba]

whatever u guys decide on

please creat a new thread.....it would be hassle for people to find the page, where the final decision is made

OK thats a good idea as we are close to making a decision shortly.