Dodgy bloke comes to buy my Saab I smell a rat (long)

[TransAm]

Hehe

This was the summary of my day yesterday afternoon and evening:

So here I am, trying to sell the Saab privately so I can get into an S2000. Had a couple come see it Wednesday then called me Thursday to say definately interested.

I wanted to do an in and out deal on a 2002 S2000 in Lewisville yesterday at a dealer. Lovely car, 17000 miles, not a scratch.

The guy buying my Saab, Herb, says to me:

Look, as we are doing you a favour by doing this in and out and saving you some sales tax, we'll cut you a deal. We will pay you 15k for your Saab (the price is 12k), you save even more on sales tax, and write us a check back for $3000.

Duh...

So I says, no mate, not gonna happen. I'm a motivated seller and the car is a VERY good price (they have a 2001 Saab like mine at Carmax for 16,000, my car is a 2002) already.

Then he says, ahh, but the check (from Capital One Auto Finance) is already made out for 15000 as we needed to cover off Taxes, Title and Licensing costs and were hoping you would work with us.

Let's take a step back here and consider this. He is asking me to aid him in defrauding the finance company? I work in finance - financial crimes (no matter how small) tend to lose you your career. Not only that, I am (a Brit) in the US on a visa and could be asked to leave the country over a scam like that. I told him this, as politely as possible!

So, he backs down a little and I explain to him if he wants to cover TTL in his check then the in and out deal is ideal for him, he can pay it all in one lump sum check to the dealer.

Ahh but, says he, so we are saving you money on sales tax and we get nothing back? Well, he says, if that is how you want to play it we think you should give us a couple of hundred bucks back so we can share in your saving.

At this point he tells me his Capital One auto finance check is in fact blank and his wife "got confused" earlier when she said to him it was already printed out in my name for 15k.

I wanted to say 'WELL FOOK YOU THEN' and slam the phone down on him, as we had had about 4 or 5 phone calls with eachother by this point. We agreed to disagree and left it at that.

9pm comes and goes, dealership is closed. Dealership is closed today as well, of course. I email him at 11pm offering to just sell the car to him as a private sale today, and of course this means I forego $750 sales tax saving. Easy deal, he comes with the check for 12k, he drives off in the Saab.

An hour or so later, the twat emails me back saying they will do a deal for 13k, and I am to give them 1000 back. I can wait 3 weeks for their check to clear if I so desire in order to eliminate any financial risk.

I returned his email saying look, its a good solid car, priced really well, the price is 12k take it or leave it as I have others interested.

He is pushing for a deal this weekend as his mother in law is actually going to be the titleholder (she is actually the one who has got the finance arranged) and she needs/wants to be present when the deal is done. Mother lives in Austin and made a special trip up to DFW. So before anyone suggests I push for him to go to the dealer tomorrow, this is not an option with this particular buyer.

Haven't heard back yet.

Now was I being unreasonable, selling a car below market value and refusing to aid him in defrauding Capital One?

I have all this 'wheeling and dealing' of his in writing as well... should I contact CapOne and let them know what this guy was trying to pull, regardless of whether or not he buys the car off me?

I kind of suspect the mother in law doesnt know what deals hes been trying to do.


Oh fuxsox. Why cant life be simple? I could have had a nice S2K in my garage to wake up to today and be making my 'what do you drive or ride' post if not for this numptie!

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!

Opinions, comments, questions?

[coombsie66]

I dont quite follow the story, as in the fraudulent part, but im not well educated in finance schemes (and i had a couple glasses of red with lunch :wink: ) but i agree with you on the case that your putting your balls on the line for him ( for no good reason) and with it being long term finance it could come back to bite you at any time.
I dont know if i'd turn him in, probably just ignore. Is there any way you can do a deal somewhere else?

EDIT: Oh and good choice on the S2000, something i just love about the screaming engine and RWD. :D

[TransAm]

Well it is defrauding the lender because I am effectively aiding them in telling Cap One that they have paid 15k for a car when in fact they paid 12k and I gave them cashback. It is a way of them getting cash from funds that are only to be used to purchase a car, and they are paying less interest than they would on, say, a personal loan... I bounced it off the finance manager at the dealership he confirmed it was illegal and strongly advised I didn't do anything of the sort! :shock:

I suspect the couple have credit issues, (my wife thinks this bloke Herb probably has a fraud conviction) thus they are using mother in law to buy the car for them as they cant get approved on a loan themselves. :wink:

I won't drop him in the shit because it is not my style, although I felt like doing that last night! :twisted:

[bmmusti]

sounds like a typical scam.. tell him cash or fuck off

[TransAm]

I have mate

Betcha I don't hear from them again

Fuckwits!

[RC45]

Now there's a mother in-law involved? Good God man... what's next - a cousin named Vinnie Bufalino from Chicago, wearing a woolen burberry and driving a black Lincoln TownCar? ;)

Looks like he's going have introduced the entire crime family to you before the week is out.... :P hehehe

[Anonymous]

Well it is defrauding the lender because I am effectively aiding them in telling Cap One that they have paid 15k for a car when in fact they paid 12k and I gave them cashback. It is a way of them getting cash from funds that are only to be used to purchase a car, and they are paying less interest than they would on, say, a personal loan... I bounced it off the finance manager at the dealership he confirmed it was illegal and strongly advised I didn't do anything of the sort! :shock:

I suspect the couple have credit issues, (my wife thinks this bloke Herb probably has a fraud conviction) thus they are using mother in law to buy the car for them as they cant get approved on a loan themselves. :wink:

I won't drop him in the shit because it is not my style, although I felt like doing that last night! :twisted:

so basically they want some money for crack :P I'd walk away, never trust such dishonest people. Have fun with your new baby :D

[TransAm]

I have another guy interested in it, so nothing would please me more than to phone this Herb guy up and say:

"Sir, I am making the decision to not sell you a Saab today"

(this is what they say to you over here if you dont have ID for cigs or beer) :mrgreen:

LMAO @ RC's comment!

[SFDMALEX]

Haha, you made me think of that Rat song by the White Stripes.

I wouldnt do it. Illegal operations are not worth it, unless its big money, plain and simple. If you going to take a risk, make sure the payback is worth it, even then it stupid.

You did the right thing.

[nthfinity]

TransAm, id say dont go with this bloke at all, even if he comes back with a 12k check; id just sunner go with somebody who isnt a weasle a few days later.

people are always looking for some fucking handout, and its just total bs. good luck selling the Saab asap

[arturo]

I have mate

Betcha I don't hear from them again

Fuckwits!


haha.. remind me to do more than quickly scan long ass posts in the future

[TransAm]

I will post their email addresses later on and we can all have some fun :mrgreen:

Porn to work email usually goes down a storm!

[Anonymous]

I will post their email addresses later on and we can all have some fun :mrgreen:

Porn to work email usually goes down a storm!

haha i did that to my old landlords, complete assholes. We even left the house spotless, unlike when we moved in, they invented so much stuff to not give us our deposits back!! Got it in the end but revenge is fun, childish but fun to inconvenience them :D

[ZfrkS62]

why is selling a car such a fucking hassle :? i'd just say contact cap one and let them know what this twat is trying to pull.

just move on to the next buyer and get your 12K :wink:

[TransAm]

We are going to phone the mother in law later on tonight (have her cell) and, using some well worded enquiries, try and work out if she knows what they were trying to pull. If she is 'in on it' so to speak I shall contact the authorities, if not hopefully it will make her wary of her son in law in the future. He is the driving force behind all this shady dealing and I suspect the M-I-L knows nowt about it.

There is another guy interested in the car, at 12k, he wants it independently inspected (at his cost) during the week. I don't think there is anything wrong with the car though.

[graywolf624]

Oldest scam in car purchasing. Sell it to the second guy and report the first to his lender.

[nthfinity]

are you still running 240hp? (not a lot extra really)

[TransAm]

Yep, maybe a little more, it's 202 at the wheels, so add 20% for the fact its a power-sapping autobox!

[dutchmasterflex]

i say, drop everything and move on.. no use getting involved in their pile of shit.. dont bother wasting your time when you could be driving with the wind blowing through your hair and a smile on your face while listening to 9000rpm sccream...

[RC45]

We are going to phone the mother in law later on tonight (have her cell) and, using some well worded enquiries, try and work out if she knows what they were trying to pull. If she is 'in on it' so to speak I shall contact the authorities, if not hopefully it will make her wary of her son in law in the future. He is the driving force behind all this shady dealing and I suspect the M-I-L knows nowt about it.

There is another guy interested in the car, at 12k, he wants it independently inspected (at his cost) during the week. I don't think there is anything wrong with the car though.

I would drop the entire 1st deal... and let them move on.

They know your name, contact info, adress etc.

Just let em roll.. you really have nothing to gain by bringing the spotlight to them, other than royally pissing them off.

Not worth the risk IMHO... :)

[Anonymous]

We are going to phone the mother in law later on tonight (have her cell) and, using some well worded enquiries, try and work out if she knows what they were trying to pull. If she is 'in on it' so to speak I shall contact the authorities, if not hopefully it will make her wary of her son in law in the future. He is the driving force behind all this shady dealing and I suspect the M-I-L knows nowt about it.

There is another guy interested in the car, at 12k, he wants it independently inspected (at his cost) during the week. I don't think there is anything wrong with the car though.

I would drop the entire 1st deal... and let them move on.

They know your name, contact info, adress etc.

Just let em roll.. you really have nothing to gain by bringing the spotlight to them, other than royally pissing them off.

Not worth the risk IMHO... :)

especially angry texans with guns :P

[TransAm]

Well they have backed down now and will take the car for 12k, I can verify the Capital One check on the phone and will hold the documents until the check clears.

Deal done, or it should be in an hour or so! 8)

Now can anyone remember what I paid for the Saab back in January (I think I may have mentioned it in my what do you drive or ride post) :wink:

[nthfinity]

Deal done, or it should be in an hour or so!

s2000 here you come :twisted:

[RC45]

Deal done, or it should be in an hour or so!

s2000 here you come :twisted:

Or these folks are pro scam artists and they will be long gone by the time the cheque bounces... and where that car is going... it won't need no stinking papers... ;)

[Yablokov]

thats so messed up. go to capone n rat em out. put him in jail.

im sure you will sell your car.

o btw. im looking at a 00' s2000 meself ^^

goingfor a testdrive this comming week. XD

[TransAm]

Deal done, or it should be in an hour or so!

s2000 here you come :twisted:

Or these folks are pro scam artists and they will be long gone by the time the cheque bounces... and where that car is going... it won't need no stinking papers... ;)

Lets hope not! I verified the check and have the title here still :lol:

[gis]

seems that an S2000 will be coming your way soon mate.just bring it back over to preston and you can take me out for a spin :lol:

[TransAm]

seems that an S2000 will be coming your way soon mate.just bring it back over to preston and you can take me out for a spin :lol:

You know what insurance group it is in right?

No chance of me being able to insure a S2000 in the UK alas.
:cry:

[SilviaEvo]

good luck with your S2000!!! i hear that the car is brilliant

[gis]

seems that an S2000 will be coming your way soon mate.just bring it back over to preston and you can take me out for a spin :lol:

You know what insurance group it is in right?

No chance of me being able to insure a S2000 in the UK alas.
:cry:

group 20 they are here in the UK,lol im sure you would be able to insure it mate.

you sold your civic didnt you? you decide on another car for over here?

[TransAm]

you sold your civic didnt you? you decide on another car for over here?

Yes I sold the VTi.

Nahh not yet, I hardly go back very much so I will wait til I get home permanently before I buy anything. Civic Type R is near the top of the list but so is a 330d, very different beasts of course.