*** 2005 Turkish Grand Prix ***

[Toronto]

Final
Pos No Driver Team Laps Time/Retired Grid Points

1 9 Kimi Räikkönen McLaren-Mercedes 58 1:24:34.454 1 10
2 5 Fernando Alonso Renault 58 +18.6 secs 3 8
3 10 Juan Pablo Montoya McLaren-Mercedes 58 +19.6 secs 4 6
4 6 Giancarlo Fisichella Renault 58 +37.9 secs 2 5
5 3 Jenson Button BAR-Honda 58 +39.3 secs 13 4
6 16 Jarno Trulli Toyota 58 +55.4 secs 5 3
7 14 David Coulthard Red Bull Racing 58 +69.2 secs 12 2
8 15 Christian Klien Red Bull Racing 58 +71.6 secs 10 1
9 4 Takuma Sato BAR-Honda 58 +109.987 secs 20
10 2 Rubens Barrichello Ferrari 57 +1 Lap 11
11 11 Jacques Villeneuve Sauber-Petronas 57 +1 Lap 16
12 17 Ralf Schumacher Toyota 57 +1 Lap 9
13 20 Robert Doornbos Minardi-Cosworth 55 +3 Laps 17
14 19 Narain Karthikeyan Jordan-Toyota 55 +3 Laps 18
15 18 Tiago Monteiro Jordan-Toyota 55 +3 Laps 14
Ret 21 Christijan Albers Minardi-Cosworth 48 Retired 15
Ret 1 Michael Schumacher Ferrari 32 Retired 19
Ret 8 Nick Heidfeld Williams-BMW 29 Tyre 6
Ret 12 Felipe Massa Sauber-Petronas 28 Engine 8
Ret 7 Mark Webber Williams-BMW 20 Tyre 7
Fastest Lap: Juan Pablo Montoya 1:24.770
Official Result

[gucom]

from the pics i've seen so far the circuit looks really good...nice hills, nice corners, with some things around the track to give you a good feel of speed, unlike most other new tracks which look like racetracks in cheap games, with only concrete walls and endless fields of grass on both sides...

[5vz-fe]

Ferrari is seriously lacking pace. :? But it's a relatively new track, I think we'll see the time drop some more to and hopefully some improvement from the Ferraris.

To be honest, I am abit disappointed. Ferrari has done quite some testing over the summer break, yet they are still way off the front pack.

[SFDMALEX]

Ferrari is seriously lacking pace. :? But it's a relatively new track, I think we'll see the time drop some more to and hopefully some improvement from the Ferraris.

Dan tells me they prolly gave up and are working on the 2006, I agree with him on that.

[|Nuno|]

Shit. Ferrari's screwed for Sunday... Brawn said on SpeedTv that they're using an old spec tyre, since the new ones used in Germany and Hungary wouldn't last the whole distance... :? And guess which tyre philosophy they're using? Yep, the "excellent" Magny Cours/ Silverstone one... :|


It's gonna be another tough Weekend it seems...

[5vz-fe]

Shit. Ferrari's screwed for Sunday... Brawn said on SpeedTv that they're using an old spec tyre, since the new ones used in Germany and Hungary wouldn't last the whole distance... :? And guess which tyre philosophy they're using? Yep, the "excellent" Magny Cours/ Silverstone one... :|


It's gonna be another tough Weekend it seems...

That sux!!! Ferrari usually don't make that kind of mistake. Maybe Dan is rite, they really do all the testing for next year's car.

[|Nuno|]

Shit. Ferrari's screwed for Sunday... Brawn said on SpeedTv that they're using an old spec tyre, since the new ones used in Germany and Hungary wouldn't last the whole distance... :? And guess which tyre philosophy they're using? Yep, the "excellent" Magny Cours/ Silverstone one... :|


It's gonna be another tough Weekend it seems...

That sux!!! Ferrari usually don't make that kind of mistake. Maybe Dan is rite, they really do all the testing for next year's car.

Well, it's not Ferrari's mistake - after all, they don't make the tyres. :wink:


And yes, right now, they're focusing more on 2006.

Only (major) updates planned for the F2005 are an engine update (055 C) to be introduced at Monza and a new low downforce package, also to be introduced at Monza. Only the tyre programme will continue to go at full throttle.

But I don't think the F2005 needs the updates anyway; what Ferrari really needs is a good tyre. And to achieve that, they'll have to test, test and test until Bridgestone can come up with the right tyre, which hopefully they will. Someday...

[ae86_16v]

Huh, I would've thought that Bridgestone would've done better on a brand new circuit. Heard that they've got a pretty good track records in terms of coming out with new Tyres for untested tracks.

[RAMMIUS]

Yup with season its fucked for the Scuderia , on Mugello and Fiorano they begin testing the V8 for next year .

Probably they`ll try to make a very good race at Monza , and they could go well at Suzuka , but that`s it for this season.

:(

[saadie]

Qualification ...

1 9 Kimi Räikkönen McLaren-Mercedes 1:26.797
2 6 Giancarlo Fisichella Renault 1:27.039
3 5 Fernando Alonso Renault 1:27.050
4 10 Juan Pablo Montoya McLaren-Mercedes 1:27.352
5 16 Jarno Trulli Toyota 1:27.501
6 8 Nick Heidfeld Williams-BMW 1:27.929
7 7 Mark Webber Williams-BMW 1:27.944
8 12 Felipe Massa Sauber-Petronas 1:28.419
9 17 Ralf Schumacher Toyota 1:28.594
10 15 Christian Klien Red Bull Racing 1:28.963
11 2 Rubens Barrichello Ferrari 1:29.369
12 14 David Coulthard Red Bull Racing 1:29.764
13 3 Jenson Button BAR-Honda 1:30.063
14 4 Takuma Sato BAR-Honda 1:30.175
15 18 Tiago Monteiro Jordan-Toyota 1:30.710
16 21 Christijan Albers Minardi-Cosworth 1:32.186
17 20 Robert Doornbos Minardi-Cosworth
18 11 Jacques Villeneuve Sauber-Petronas
19 19 Narain Karthikeyan Jordan-Toyota
20 1 Michael Schumacher Ferrari

i couldnt see the qualification ... :cry:
anyway ... the results are very interesting .....

ohh and im expecting a big jacques attack and suchumi attack ..:| :roll:

[|Nuno|]

It's gonna be another tough Weekend it seems...


Damn. How right I was... :?


Good thing is that I really like this track - very nicely done. :good: The Quali was pretty unusual too, with lots of excursions of the track, etc...

[RAMMIUS]

^^^^ yup , the usual grip problems , the track brand new and also dirty , a lot of sand , so excursions off the track are usual stuff in this kind of environment. .

[gucom]

change in starting order, Sato was penalised for leaving the track too slowly and driving in Webber's way, he now starts from place 20, so every1 from place 15 on moves up a place

[gucom]

there was nothing to appeal, regulations say that if u are overtaken on ur outlap by a guy in quali lap, u lose ur time and thus start at the back. webber had to overtake him, its clear as can be.

[SFDMALEX]

man no way am I waiking up at 8am tomorrow.......no Turkey GP for me... :(

[Max Power]

why don't u tape it...

[Toronto]

man no way am I waiking up at 8am tomorrow.......no Turkey GP for me... :(

lol, your not DIE HARD, I have been up for every race this year :P, and 8am isn't the bad, you see the other races :D

[leo_26782]

Montloya didn't only passed Monteiro, but he also bracked right in front of him!!!
Congrat to McLaren, they had the best car, and Kimi made a great race. Just keep going like that and winning the manufacturers championship is more than a possiblity.

Concerning Schumi: nothing to say apart from a very disapointing spirit: if you give up: give up! Don't come back 10 laps later to make sure you're not the first one for the qualification on the next race. :x

[McLarenboy]

JEZUS CHRIST, how much luck can a guy get. To get a break here and there is understandable but almost every single race is getting rediculous.

Alonso still has a lot to prove, for me he impressed me the most when he was driving for Minardi. I doubt the guy has the skills to work his way up in a race by passing other drivers.

[ZfrkS62]

i fell asleep before Monty apparently cut off Monteiro and didn't wake up until the interview after the race :?

It's obvious Renault has some kind of team order in place, though it may be just as simple as don't race each other (to avoid teammates removing eachother from the race) which is why Alonso had to wait for permission to pass.


What the hell went flying across the track at the start of the race? It looked like someone's front wing but i didn't hear any mention of it nor did i see anyone pit for a nose cone replacement :?

[5vz-fe]

After today, I think there will be a higher chance of Williams switching to Bridgestone. 4 tire faliure?? That gotta be a record or something :mrgreen:

[ZfrkS62]

After today, I think there will be a higher chance of Williams switching to Bridgestone. 4 tire faliure?? That gotta be a record or something :mrgreen:

They said something about the inside of the tire rubbing on the end plate of the wing. Notice how no one else had issues with their tires?

[5vz-fe]

^Oh did they have a new aero package for this race??

[SFDMALEX]

man no way am I waiking up at 8am tomorrow.......no Turkey GP for me... :(

lol, your not DIE HARD, I have been up for every race this year :P, and 8am isn't the bad, you see the other races :D

I just cant man, if I do Ill fall asleep.

I had to wake up early for work Saturday, and I went to sleep at 3am Sunday morning, no way could I have woke up at 8am man :(

[ZfrkS62]

^Oh did they have a new aero package for this race??

I didn't hear anything about it, but that's not an impossibilty.

[styla21]

^^Not a whole new package, but some modifiations.. viewed here: http://www.formula1.com/race/technical_analysis/745/179.html

However i'm confused by this, because surely an aero package is symetrical, yet the tyres were only the right rears? There must be some head scratching going on :?

[5vz-fe]

^Thanks for the info styla21. As for your question, I think they only rub during high load corners, and my guess is they are all hard lefts.

Things like this would surely be picked up during testing :roll: wonder what happen there.

[ZfrkS62]

the loading on the wing had to have been pushing it to the right. most of the turns were lefthanders which caused all the lateral G;s to go to the right, including the side force on the rear wing

[styla21]

the loading on the wing had to have been pushing it to the right. most of the turns were lefthanders which caused all the lateral G;s to go to the right, including the side force on the rear wing

Z i admit getting confused by physics quite easily.. But a left handed corner (which turkey is 75% made up of); wouldn't it "lift" the car off the right hand side of the car and thus the wheels? - This would likely put more stress on the left side (and left tyres?), which completely contradicts what occured with the Williams.
I don't understand how a left-handed corner puts load on the right hand side of the car. :oops:
Regardless - their problem must be something obvious to occur 5 times. :oops: :!:

[5vz-fe]

Think sagging rear when u step on the accelerator from a dead stop. Only now you are turning left from a dead straight.

[styla21]

Think sagging rear when u step on the accelerator from a dead stop. Only now you are turning left from a dead straight.
That makes perfect sense mate, thanks :fadein:

[jenkF1]

Went to the circuit this weekend to watch it with my own eyes and have to say stunning track. On friday when security was low I went to the uphill Eau-Rouge style uphill section and the speed blew me away.

I watched the race however from the uphill S-Bend bit and have to say half way through the McLaren looked UNBELIEVABLE over the kerbs and was in a different planet. Was nice to see the dıfferent styles through the slows section. Jenson forever smooth. Alonso late on the breaks and Fisi first on the throttle.

I think Michelin had too softer tyre deja vu and the Williams chassis and general set-up put to much load on them.

[dingo]

That was actually quite an entertaining race. :D At least we saw a bunch of overtaking, that first lap with Kimi vs Renaults was great! :D

A shame that Webber was hit by Schumi, but wouldn't have mattered much since those damn tyres didn't last. :?

It also would have been nice if Montoya could've finished 2nd and given Kimi another 2pts over Alonso. :)

The next race should be good - SPA!!!!


Concerning Schumi: nothing to say apart from a very disapointing spirit: if you give up: give up! Don't come back 10 laps later to make sure you're not the first one for the qualification on the next race. :x

Alot of drivers have done that this year, and to me makes perfect sense. :wink:

[RAMMIUS]

^^^ Actually the next race is at Monza , September the 4th.

:wink:

[|Nuno|]

I must say this circuit is awesome. One of the first Tilke tracks that I really enjoy.

Now, for the race - not a good Weekend for Ferrari, as expected when they have to used old tyres. Bad old tyres.

I was quite excited after the first couple of laps though. Schumi's first laps were just :shock: . In the first lap he overtook 8(!) cars, including some fast ones, like Button. And only one of those 8 overtakings was made in the first corner... I really would like to see onboard footage of his first lap.

But after those few laps the tyres just stopped working... And then there was the incident with Webber. Shit happens, I guess. Only thing that bugs is that Monza's Qualifying will be compromised because of this. :bah:

Anyway, things in the front of the race were interesting, so overall, I enjoyed the Race. :D




edit - and so much for team orders, what was that on lap 5 or something, fisi letting alonso pass on TEAM ORDERS. yet no one has said anything about it, yet im willing to bet had it been Ferrari everyone would be bitching and crying.


Yep, fucking hypocrites. :x McLaren's case in Hungary, I can understand, since the drivers were in different strategies. But this is just pushing it. At least when there were team orders at Ferrari, it was admitted by them (and they weren't illegal). But of course, everyone had to complain... :roll: Including the people who are now applying the same team orders...