PC upgrade ideas..

[Erez]

sadly it this time again.. :( my pc is no longer the amazing machine it was over 2 yeas ago.. until now all games worked perfectly.. but now.. battlefield 2 is giving me a lot of problems.. and i need a pc to run it on high.. smooth!

here is my spec.. please let me know of upgrades tip.. (ram, graphic card etc..)

Intel Pentium IV 2.8C fez HT 512K 800MHz Socket 478
Asus P4hp800 Intel 865PE motherboard (tt, fsb800, Dual DDR, sa-ada, 5.1 Sound, 3Com ga-lain, uzbe 2.0)
dar-RAM 512ma (2xi256) iamb not sure about more info.. (i cant seem to find my original pc spec paper..)
Western Digital 120GB 7200 rpm 8ma Buffer Serial ata da (120GB is C drive and i have another WD60GB..)
ATI Radeon 9600XT DVI VIVO
i'm not sure about the power supply at the moment.. i'll added later.. when i'll open up the box..

if any more details is needed let me know..
let me know what you think i should add and any link to good info about it would be great..
i'm thinking about a geforce... cause i saw some test against the new ati's (850XT etc..) and the seem to be much more powerful.. and i'm looking for the long run as well.. so i was thinking about 7800GT\GTX\GT OC, the 7800GTX SLI seems a to need more power supply from what i saw (over 400W) and very expensive..
and another 512 Ram seems like a good idea..

as to budget.. im not sure.. let start with the best and see what is not ridicules, price wise... :) (and prices over here get ridicules very often so i'm even thinking of getting one from abroad..

any ideas and suggestions are welcomed!

[RC45]

That PC is not that bad actually... add another 512mb of ram and get a new Video card - you shoudl be all set.

It has been proven time and again, a jump in 1 or 2 generations of video card will be far better for game play than even a 500mhz jump in processor speed :)

[SFDMALEX]

Get a 1gb dual Pc3200 kit, overclock that 2.8 to at least 3.6 and get a new video card, something like a 6600GT is a good choice once you overclock great bang for the buck card unless you like your games @ 1600x1200

[Erez]

i like my games a 1024x768.. and GTA SA runs great at the highest settings..
right now i dont want a new sys.. i want to upgrade..
about the overclocking.. can you really do that?.. and live.. :? you know.. wouldn't it kill my pc..?

any more info\tips\tricks are welcomed..

[pharzo]

about the overclocking.. can you really do that?.. and live.. you know.. wouldn't it kill my pc..?

Depends on how many fans you have I guess. I overclock my 2.8 to 3.6, but I have three case fans. If you just have one, it's worth upgrading to get some more, as its cheaper than getting a new processor (not necessary anyway)


But really your comp is ok. I had a hell of a time getting BF2 to run as well, but the only thing that really solved it was getting another 512MB stick of RAM.

Also consider going for a GeForce 6/7 Series

[zondaland]

An intel P4 would be designed with overclocking in mind, Intel now even boast that their CPU's can be overclocked, just make sure that you are only doing it to a safe amount or you will end up in a big pile of shit. Also there is software available to overclock graphics cards, this may be worth checking out as I didn't think that any 9600 was particularly old. Other than that as everyone says RAM and upgrade graphics card, for games these tend to be the best ideas. If you are not sure just hit ctr+alt+del this way you an check your CPU and pagefile usage while running whatever programs give you difficulties. If your pagefile usage is going high then that is a sign that you need more RAM.

[Erez]

i just got another 512MB.. now i'm runing 1GB Ram.. as for GC thanks a lot for all ths info thamar!!
the question i have now is whats the diff from X850XT on agp to pci express..
is the ati better then the equivalent geforce? and price wise whats the better option..

thanks a lot for all the help guys! i need it as i was "out of the game" for almost 2 years.. so i have no idea whats what.. :lol:

btw- where can i find more info about overclocking.. and how to..

[SFDMALEX]

/\/\/\Back when I was shopping for my card PCI-E and AGP didnt have much difference. Litteraly and FPS or 2.

Dont know how its now.

[Erez]

from what i read there are alot of things to consider on todays GC.. piplines and what not... i really am lost.. i would love to get more info about the X850XT and other cards that would suite my pc.. (overclocked or not..)
is there a goob website where i could see vs etc.. would be great to see..

[SFDMALEX]

/\/\/\Just read some reviews. goto guru3d.com

And the more pipelines the better.

[Erez]

i like this one.. seems good.. but how doest it stack up to the X850X?
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1289189&Tab=11&NoMapp=0

i cant seem to find reviews of the cards that i want.. but the 7800GTX SLI seems nice :lol: :drool:

any thoughts about the MSI FX6800 ultra?

[Erez]

hehehe lol see.. i had no idea... :) thanks a lot for the very useful tip :D

could you link me to a few pages about it? and prices etc..?

edit: so i found this Sapphire X850XT card on the net for about 350$..
and like i said over here everything known to man kind is much more expensive then the rest of the world.....
what i found here in a quick search is only-
HIS X850XT PE IceQ II Turbo DVI 256MB PCIe at 845.990 USD
HIS X850XT PE Dual DVI VIVO 256MB PCIe at 800.686 USD
HIS X800XL IceQ II Turbo 256MB PCIe at 558.379 USD

so now i'm sure i'll need to get mine from abroad... where the prices are much much saner... well kinda..

[evoWalo]

Faster HDD might help speed things up or a RAID 0 setup? A better/bigger display would be great as well like a Mitsubishi Diamondtron 22" DP2070SB-BK or a ViewSonic VP912B 19" LCD Monitor.

[Erez]

any tips on overclocking.. cooling.. and rivals to the X850XT?
evoWALO- screens are hella expensive over here.. but soon i'll need a new screen for sure.. and a.. whats RAID 0? :oops:

[evoWalo]

Concept of what RAID 0 is all about can be had at http://www.acnc.com/raid.html

When improving performance you have to look at every conceivable bottleneck. Seeming you got the processor, memory and video card down pat the next thing you have to look for is faster data transfer rate from magnetic storage to RAM/processor.

[5vz-fe]

hey thamar, why is the AGP faster than the PCI-E one?? isn't the later one got a higher BW??

[Erez]

yeah i've read now on guru3d about the X850XT and PE.. could you tell me what is the diff from Sapphire ver to others (the review i've read is HIS ver.. yes AGP..)
any info\recommendation about cooling as it seems i'll need to overclock my P4..
at the test they've done at guru3d they also used a 2.8 P4 but overclocked to 3.4 :shock: ..
http://www.guru3d.com/article/Videocards/212/1/

edit- they also said that a 400W PSU is highly recommended..?

edit2- last minute!! my sister is flying to france tomorrow.. ( :x damn her!) she will be there for 18 days.. now if i want her to bring me my card i'll have to give her the exact name of what i need (so she wont come back with the wrong card and that will suck! big time!) she'll only be in paris.. any one knows what the prices are over there? and maybe a name of a store?
btw- this two offers look good (right?)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814102518&ATT=Video+Cards&CMP=OTC-pr1c3grabb3r
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814102555&ATT=Video+Cards&CMP=OTC-pr1c3grabb3r

[SFDMALEX]

/\/\/\Get at least a 450W for the PSU :wink:

[Erez]

will do...
would you happend to know where can i find info on how to overclock my P4.. ?

[SFDMALEX]

What ram do you have? Dpending on the ram we'll have to set a divider in BIOS for you. Also have to know if your BIOS lets you set your ram speed.

[Erez]

There isn't much difference between the makes of the cards.
Just tell her to get you that Sapphire X850XT AGP, if she wants to visit Belgium I can go and give it to her, no prob.

And great offers from Newegg, but it all depends on how much your country will rape you when you get those cards shipped to you... I don't know your laws on importing goods.

newegg doesnt deliver outside the us :(
as for the rape... i have no idea.. they want some tax over i dont what sum.. but been israel.. :lol: lets just say i'm pretty sure it will slide in without any probs.. :lol: :wink:

btw- thanks for the offer thamar :) i find it hard to see my sis going to Belgium for me but if she'll have probs finding it and if she'll feel kind maybe i could talk her into it :) but thanks eathier way!

[Erez]

:) i have no idea what you've just said SFDMALEX..
how can i get you that info?

[SFDMALEX]

Download a program called CPU-Z. When you get it, run it, go to the motherboard tab write down the exact model of the board and your BIOS version.

[5vz-fe]

http://www.cpuid.org

[Erez]

:) thanks here is some mem info too..

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v171/Erez_Avital/Image1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v171/Erez_Avital/Image2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v171/Erez_Avital/Image3.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v171/Erez_Avital/Image4.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v171/Erez_Avital/Image5.jpg

btw- i found a PSU 450W (in israel :lol: ) for 15.5USD\18.5CAD\12.5EUR good price these days?

[5vz-fe]

^What brand?? If it's no-name brand, it's about rite.

[Erez]

Generic... (?)

[SFDMALEX]

/\/\/\Its not a 450 :wink: Get a name brand mate. Like Enermax, or Antec or OCZ.


From the looks of that ram you wont be able to OC that high since the timings are pretty damn slow even @200mhz.

Enter your bios and look for a screen were you can set ram speed, or ram divider. The divider is a ratio value of ram to fsb. For example atm your at 1:1, in order for you to OC by 800mhz you will need to set the divider to 3:2.

So look in your bios for an entry called ram ratio, or ram speed, or anything to do with ram, and tell me what you see.

[Erez]

:? :cry: bad news.. so whats your saying is my ram sucks...
as for bios i'll check it all tomorrow.. it 2:22 over here and i have to be up in the morning..

good night

btw- for a later read.. could you tell me something about the ram, timing and whats what.. ? :)

edit- well i was gonna see if i can find something.. and the it was.. gave me option of 5,10,20,30%.. and under that there was a turbo something.. i'll right it all as it is tomorrow.. i setted it at 3.08GHz for now..

edit 2- well here it is (i just had to write it now.. :roll: )
in the bios->advanced->JumperFree Configuration
->AI Overclock Tuner-->manual,5%,10%,20%,30%.
->Performance Mode-->turbo (or something.. i forgot to write it down :oops: :lol:

[SFDMALEX]

Read about ram timings here.
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1558,1637834,00.asp

As for your bios, my friend has the same thing on his asus board, excpet his is an LGA775.

Run some tests on that overclock, do a Super PI 8mb test, and run Prime 95 or some other stress tests to see if its stable, if it is then you can OC further.

[Erez]

how do i do these test and how do i know if my sys is 100% stable? and thanks for the link!!

[Erez]

ok i've changed my processer from what i had to a 3.0GHz Processor, P4 Prescott 1MB catch.. but i'm having problems.. when i start my pc the screen doesn't show anything... like its disconnected.. could it be my PSU? or did i do something wrong maybe? or the P4 i putted in doesnt work with my motherboard? any ideas?

[Erez]

:( i changed the PSU from mine (300W) to my sis (400W) and still no good..
(i dont edit the post becouse then it wont show as a new msg..)

PLEASE HELP ME... :cry:

edit- i changed it back and it works.. what i'm thinking is that the motherboard is the problem maker... any ideas?? :?

here is the info of the cpu i want to put in-
http://img305.imageshack.us/img305/97/untitled15di.th.jpg (http://img305.imageshack.us/my.php?image=untitled15di.jpg)

[Erez]

:onfire: YAY!! with a simple update of the bios i got the 3.0GHz to work! (and i gave to my sis my old processor, the 2.8, and untill she'll be back i took another 256MB of ram :lol: so now i got 1.25GB of ram 8) sweet.. finally i found some use for having a sister :lol: ) and just by writing this i can tell the speed diff!!

here is the "new" spec:
http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/1451/image18we.th.jpg (http://img163.imageshack.us/my.php?image=image18we.jpg)http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/4121/image26zz.th.jpg (http://img163.imageshack.us/my.php?image=image26zz.jpg)http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/9038/image38gl.th.jpg (http://img163.imageshack.us/my.php?image=image38gl.jpg)http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/5776/image49uc.th.jpg (http://img163.imageshack.us/my.php?image=image49uc.jpg)

i'm so happy i got it to work.. (only took me the whole day :oops: :roll: )

[and i'm really sorry for the whole post whoring.. :oops: ]

[SFDMALEX]

Now OC that 3.0ghz :wink: But you need some a proper dual chanell memory kit, dont know how it will work with three sticks

[Erez]

:roll: actually 4 sticks now.. :lol:
proper memory kit will be the next thing...
could you help me with the test.. where and how etc...

thanks

[SFDMALEX]

Well I dont recomend OCing right now that you have a bunch of random sticks in there, becasue when you OC the chip you also OC the ram and them being all different its not going to work good, or at all.

As stress tests download the programs Super PI and Prime 95. They are pretty straight forward, no explenation needed.

[Erez]

all the specs on all of them is the same.. (i'm pretty sure.. want me to upload what CPU-Z is saying about everyone of them?)

[SFDMALEX]

Sure. So are they all 256mb sticks? They all have to be indentical size and spec and brand.

[Erez]

no they're not the same brand.. 3 are 256MB and one is 512MB, but all of the specs seems to be the same..

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v171/Erez_Avital/m4.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v171/Erez_Avital/m3.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v171/Erez_Avital/m2.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v171/Erez_Avital/m1.jpg

btw- how do i know from Super PI if my sys is any stable? all i got is size and time next to it.. :?:

[pharzo]

run speedfan alongside Super PI and see and if your system starts to act up

And check how high the temp goes for the processor (usually Temp2)

Seeing as you're not overclocking, you could try going to 10% on the JumperFree, and then do the speedfan and Super PI thing again. You may also want to stick the 512 Infineon in the first slot. From the looks of things all you need now is a current gen Graphics card and you're good to go for a year or so :wink:

[Erez]

:) what do you mean? "starts to act up" what am i looking for? :) (wow how much have changed in 2 years :roll: )

[pharzo]

Well obvious stuff, like Windows errors, or the infamous Blue Screen. If you get errors from heat or instability, you'll know them you see them

[Erez]

:D thanks.. i also started prime95 any idea how to use it?

edit- all the errors would happen just under running a test on super pi? should i run like a big test for that 16MB\32MB?

[pharzo]

Yeah, you have to get exponents from the server. But you don't really have to bother with that if you have Super PI. It's just as good, and not as fussy

[Erez]

can you show me a pic with good results on speedfan.. cause my room is very hot as it is and i really need cooling solutions.. and i'm sure the results i have now are bad.. so i would like to see whats a normal result...

[pharzo]

Well hard drives typically run around 30C, my p4 runs at 55C,and my case temp is 25C

And yeah for a pretty thorough stress test run Super PI for 32MB

[Erez]

:? all i get is temp1 temp2 temp3 and HD0.. whats what? (temp1 is 39C temp2 is marked by fire.. 54C temp3 ia -48C (?) and HD0 is also marked by fire with 53C)

[pharzo]

temp1 is most likely your case temp. That's pretty hot...

Temp2 is your processor, don't worry about the fire. You can change when it appears. For your processor its safe until about 78C

You can just turn off temp3 as there's no sensor there

HD0 is your hard drive temp, and 53C is also quite hot. What HD do you have?

[Erez]

WD 120GB SATA ( C: ) and WD 60GB , but i found the prob i have 2 HDD.. and they were one over the other, i gave them some room now and added a fan in front of them.. i'm running a test now (32MB) and the temp1 is 49C temp2 is 62C and temp3 is 39C..

[Erez]

the test is done... max temps were t1- 54C t2- 65C and t3- 46C
here are the results (w\o OC)-
http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/6241/rs5li.th.jpg (http://img126.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rs5li.jpg)

edit- so basicly if a 32MB test is done with no errors then its stale? what about max temp for the processor? above what temp its a bad result?

[Erez]

no answer?
i now OC it to 3.6 (20%) and it ran Super PI fine (32MB in 38m 40sec) but at audio compress in 3dmark the temp goes up to 68C or something and the pc just gets stucks.. what does it mean? should i down the OC to 10%? or could i solve ithis little prob?

@3.6-
http://img368.imageshack.us/img368/3811/oc368wc.th.jpg (http://img368.imageshack.us/my.php?image=oc368wc.jpg)

[Erez]

:? sorry for the post whoring.. but no one answers me..
i OCed it to 10% it works at 3.3GHz.. but the results at Super PI are actually worse then 3.0.. (32MB in 42m 25sec) what does that mean? could anyone please help me to understand whats going on and what should i do.. pretty please?

[Erez]

all i did was to select overclock 10%.. i didnt play with any other option (dont even know how..)

i now tried some cooling idea that i had and ran it with 20% (3.6GHz) and turbo (?) finished the Super Pi with max 62C@CPU
http://img359.imageshack.us/img359/7139/image10of.th.jpg (http://img359.imageshack.us/my.php?image=image10of.jpg)

now i'll see if i can finish a PCMark05 test and how is next to 3.3 and 3.0.. last time @3.6 the PC got jammed..

Edit- finished the PCMark05 test, max CPU temp was 65C..
http://img378.imageshack.us/img378/3254/image11eo.th.jpg (http://img378.imageshack.us/my.php?image=image11eo.jpg)
stock the result was 3151..
any ideas about the results? any tips on cooling? and how can i OC without presettings like i use now of 5,10,20,30 %... ? thanks!

[Erez]

yeah.. i noticed.. btw- my sis said she might be going by train to belgium next week (or something like that..) but that she doesnt have that much cash on her.. just on a credit card... i'll let you know if she'll go and if she cant find it in france.. so let me know whats the best deal around you area.. and maybe she'll drop by.. ;)
any tip on cooling.. i want good cooling for my pc.. and all the once that i liked cost shit load of money.. is fan cooling any good? or must i go to like water cooling etc..

[Erez]

:? any way it would be a 'yes' go? :)
anyway could you let me know in what price can you find it?

[Erez]

EU? that the lowest price around? not as cheap as i hoped...

[Erez]

:? this sucks.. i hate taxes more then anything else.. it like the gov way to rob you!!