what happened between Tiff and Clarkson?? [Archive] - Sports Car Forum

SFDMALEX

10-14-2003, 08:04 PM

i just read this from a "ask tiff" part of the 5th gear website,

"Speedster
Hi Tiff - You did a report from the States last year on the 350Z and apart from interior and boot you seemed to really like it. Your old colleague Jeremy Clarkson reviewed it on his show and said that it was a load of rubbish. What are your thoughts on his opinion and has yours subsequently changed?

Tiff - My thoughts on him are the same as his thought on the 360 Z. If he can get it that wrong, you can't trust him on anything."

does anyone know what really happened between these 2? anything that caused Tiff to want to move on and not be on good terms with clarkson??

Johns

10-14-2003, 08:09 PM

they're two different people and anyway why would u have both in one show when u can get two very different shows :) I think its better that they eachhave their own show :D

AlienDB7

10-14-2003, 08:54 PM

Tiff and Jeremy always have different opinion, that's one of the reason why it was so fun watching them arguing over an issue. Tiff wants a pure drivers car and Jeremy is more of a logical person, looking for something that's more usable as a daily fun car. Any of you remember the bmw M5 vs. jag XKR feature in JC's head to head video? That's was great, too bad we probably won't see something like that again.

SFDMALEX

10-14-2003, 11:50 PM

yeah but that line that i quoted from his words on the 5th gear site seem to reveal some bad blood between them. "you cant trust him on anything :fist: ", thats a real personal :twisted: attack and its obvious that there's more than a diff of opinion. I would like to know the real truth why tiff decided to move on, they couldn't have gotten along all that great.

DeMoN

10-15-2003, 12:23 AM

I am really interested to know the answer to this question too! Please someone enlighten us

AlienDB7

10-15-2003, 12:51 AM

I think it was Jeremy who decided to leave [top gear].

deth

10-15-2003, 01:44 AM

just a note further on in the chat

"Supra4eva - Have you ever Driven a Toyota Supra( Twin Turbo of Course), By my Nickname you prob guessed It's one of my favorite cars. I've never actually seen anyone road test in on television.I know clarkson did, and he called it rubbish, as you said earlier you can't trust him on anything,lol. What's your opinion on this "Mental *** Supercar" ?
Tiff - I don't know when Jezza did it, but I did the last Supra on TV for Top Gear, and raved about it. Like I said, the big belly's got no idea!"

hehehe

WhiteP

10-15-2003, 04:20 AM

are the replies really posted by Tiff?

Vansquish

10-15-2003, 04:58 AM

If those replies are posted by Tiff, then I'm sort of happy to know that he regularly contributes to Autocar and has his own show. Clarkson really seems to like softer vehicles...he doesn't seem to mind having automatic transmissions, witness the SL55 that he owns...and though he's still something of a performance nut, I really think that most of his opinions aren't as pure as Tiff's...I mean, if Tiff can say that a Lambo is a bit too benign for his tastes and he really seemed to think that about the Gallardo and the Murcielago...while Clarkson is afraid to shut off the traction control, then I'll side with Tiff every time. I guess I'm more of a racer at heart than Clarkson is hehe.

espen

10-15-2003, 08:10 AM

Just look at the big old mullethead try to drive something... ever notice how he spins pretty much any car he drives? He could'nt even avoid spinning his ovn Merc SL for f.s sake... and now he runs a sad talkshow where the same old jokes get recycled every effing eposode to polite laughter forn the aduience, the Stig amusingly plays corny music and old mullethead can once again be top dog on tv.

The reason Tiff got sacked form Top Gear is that Clarcson was a proper employee of the BBC while Tiff was hired in for the job. The instant Tiff appeared, ol' sheephead got demoted to the decidedly last place in the popularity stakes. Big shock: Clarkson wasnt happy... and Tiff got canned.

Jabba

10-15-2003, 08:17 AM

You dont like clarkson I take it ?

espen

10-15-2003, 09:42 AM

You could put it that way :lol:

I think he should get out of the way and let someone who actually can drive and perhaps even knows what he talks about take over. Tiff fits the bill ;)

I think Tiffs test of the Macca F1 or the Enzo compares favorably to anything Clarksons ever done in his life.

Jabba

10-15-2003, 10:01 AM

Tiff presents 5th Gear and therefore its unlikely that he will present Top Gear as well... he wasn't sacked by the BBC at all... he was poached by Channel Five along with Quentin Wilson and Vicki Buttler Henderson to provide a rival show to Top Gear...

Tiff is the better driver of the two but Clarksons humour is much better....its just that not everyone understands it...

Kangaroo Boy

10-15-2003, 10:06 AM

Did Tiff Drive a touring car(s) back in the early 90s or was it Clarkson?If so,what series was it?

Jabba

10-15-2003, 10:32 AM

If you click on the 5th gear link on the front page you can find lots of information on Tiff's career there......

SFDMALEX

10-15-2003, 10:44 AM

The reason Tiff got sacked form Top Gear is that Clarcson was a proper employee of the BBC while Tiff was hired in for the job. The instant Tiff appeared, ol' sheephead got demoted to the decidedly last place in the popularity stakes. Big shock: Clarkson wasnt happy... and Tiff got canned.

This seems to explain the bad feelings Tiff has. Is this true cuz Jabba says otherwise. Also "deth" posted another quote by tiff in which he insults the "big belly" lol. there has to more info on these two and the split up.

Jabba

10-15-2003, 10:47 AM

I think you will find its all "tongue in cheek" humour between them

alondahan

10-15-2003, 10:49 AM

Did Tiff Drive a touring car(s) back in the early 90s or was it Clarkson?If so,what series was it?

Tiff drove many things, including touring cars.

but Clarkson driving touring cars?? lol :lol: . I don't think he could have completed one lap without spinninig 4 times.

SFDMALEX

10-15-2003, 10:58 AM

I think you will find its all "tongue in cheek" humour between them

really?! i guess i saw it differently but with tongue in cheek like that i'd like to see what tiff would say if he really was pissed at clarkson. "must get that wrong too" and "big belly" dont seem to me like tongue in cheek but i wish i could ask them in an email to really settle this.

espen

10-15-2003, 11:03 AM

Ok jabba, if you know this then I am mistaken. I read in a carmag that Tiff was being forced out by Clarkson and BBC and was anything but pleased. The mag also stated that Tiff has raced GT-cars and some open-wheel class but never got into a position to be able to do it in a top team.

I'm happy that Tiff hosts on fifth gear, but we dont get that over here of course :roll: when oh when will Tiff make a "Greatest slides" DVD?

Imre

10-15-2003, 11:30 AM

Tiff is a ex f1 driver.Back in 80 he drove with sierra cosworth and won a round in british touring car c.

Jabba

10-15-2003, 11:57 AM

when oh when will Tiff make a "Greatest slides" DVD?

He has...its called "burning rubber"

espen

10-15-2003, 12:02 PM

Wow, I didnt know :shock: I'll have to start looking for it - is it new? Anyone seen it?

Jabba

10-15-2003, 12:07 PM

SFDMALEX

10-15-2003, 02:35 PM

[quote=Jabba]"must get that wrong too" and "big belly" dont seem to me like tongue in cheek but i wish i could ask them in an email to really settle this.

Yes thats very common british humor....in fact its quite light really....I will often say something like this to someone "stop eating that pizza you fat bastard" said in a friendly way of course...its just an innocent comment

i guess i just wanted gossip and bloodshed :twisted: . i misinterpreted but I thought that it was possible these 2 didnt like each other because tiff probably left the show for a reason like egos clashing or bad blood.

1zippo1

10-16-2003, 08:31 AM

Tiff is the better driver of the two but Clarksons humour is much better....its just that not everyone understands it...

My thoughts exactly!! Just read the Top Gear - Porsche CGT article. I often had to laugh and I don't know any other car reviewer that can do that!!

stradale

10-16-2003, 08:38 AM

I don't think there's anything wrong between JC and Tiff. As Jabba said it's all tongue in cheek. That's what makes it such fun. Not only for us to watch, but I think they have a good time too.

The part where Tiff says you can't trust JC on anything surely was meant in relation to verdicts on cars.

I found this as well on five.tv:
Willz - Hi Tiff, i can't decide what to do! i'm 15 years old and am at a grammar school hoping to take engineering of some sort, but i love cars and i can't help but dreaming of being a car journalist. what do you recommend and how should i go about persuing my ultimate passion for cars?
Tiff - Journalism is a good path to follow, and in any case, if cars are your thing, then that's one way to get to drive them. That's how my mate Jezza got started anyway, except her did get expelled from school, but I wouldn't recommend that.

mendocino

10-16-2003, 10:13 AM

me neither stradale...
they're just rivals now and so humour peaks are always welcome. As I said before, Tiff is a driver, and really I don't care about driver's opinions... I like tiff's review because there'r great to look at : good slides, burning rubber, impressive driving. for sure. But if I didn't say a word on his reviews, I wouldn't care!!
I like clarkson's ones because of his humour AND I just agree 95% of the time with him! for me he's the best reviewer of all. Sure he's not the best driver, but he has got the stig to do that!, if you think about it, I'm sure a other good driver than tiff maybe will have other opinion than his on any cars, everything is a matter of taste while talking about look and feeling.
I don't like tiff's rigidity. when he don't like a car, he just talks for himself. clarkson tries to be more balanced and when he's not, the other presentators of top gear make some balance for him! that"s an important think for me.

I'll try to explain once again : quick clear example imo: when I watch a 5th gear review by tiff, I just watch it and enventually enjoy it, period, whilst after a top gear review (witch imo are one level up in visual quality), I wish I could be on that stage argueing and talking with him about the car, what he felt ect. I would'nt really like to talk to tiff to know how it was to drive, how he slided it ect... but that's my opinion, I'm sure lots of people prefer tiff for his driving skils.. but I'm with JC all the way! :D

ps hooww yes and I just can stand than tiff prefer the 360 to the 355 and older ferrari... that's so.... limited

AlienDB7

10-16-2003, 10:37 AM

I agree with you mondeo, Jeremy is a much more interesting reviewer. Yes, I do agree with him most of the time, except for his taste for the renault styling. I respect Tiff for his driving skills and his ability to give a proper review while driving. However, he's a race car driver and his driving skill is beyond what most of us here would reach.

Jeremy, on the other hand, is closer to what we are. Someone who likes car and perhaps can afford one or two. I can't now.. but sometime in the future I should be able to afford a decent one (I hope). As for driving skill, he's still a good driver compared to 99% of the drivers out there. If you give me a 500hp car, I don't think I'll be able to powerslide without spinning out. JC is just a bit more down to earth for me and I like him for that. On top of that, his taste of styling is very close to mine (I have a thing for the british sports car too!) :mrgreen:

blah

10-16-2003, 05:11 PM

damn british humor.

mendocino

10-17-2003, 11:59 AM

OMG!!! :shock: Everybody here is calling me MONDEO :shock: I think the great 'ladda' brainwash suceeded... :cry:

stradale

10-17-2003, 12:50 PM

^^^What the hell are you on about, SIERRA?! :wink:

SkylineGTR34VspecII

10-17-2003, 02:54 PM

themailman34

10-17-2003, 03:00 PM

Does Clarkson have any experience in actual racing?

SkylineGTR34VspecII

10-17-2003, 03:04 PM

I don't think that he does.

AlienDB7

10-17-2003, 03:18 PM

Instead of asking how'd Jeremy force Tiff out (which I don't think it happened), I kinda want to know why Jeremy left top gear in the first place?

themailman34

10-17-2003, 03:18 PM

judging by his driving style I bet he doesn't......he loses control of too many cars

mendocino

10-17-2003, 03:34 PM

well you know what... I'm gonna say something very very tricky here: what if he just loose control intentionnaly to show us how hard a car like that is to drive... I'm of course not sure about that but it may be the man's style. for example the murciellago part, of course he's not as scared of it as he seems to be because he drove that on a drag later on topgear. he just want to give us another opinion,feeling about supercars, and I'm sure if I could drive an xjr15, I would be scared! and I bet everyone here would be! And seeing tiff doing some trick on a 360 souldn't make you think you can slip into a car like that and test it like he does.

Jabba

10-17-2003, 03:36 PM

I think there is some truth in that...clarkson is more of an all round "entertainer"

AlienDB7

10-17-2003, 04:05 PM

That's very true mondeo. If you look at the celeb time on the suzuki liana, jeremy is faster than all but 2 guests... 3 if you include the stig. So he's still a better than most people. Nobody can keep the supercars in control 100% of the time, not even tiff. Honestly, I kinda enjoy the outtakes in tiff's burning rubber video :)

Jeremy is just so different from other reviewers. He's just so biased, which makes him much more interesting. You may not agree with him, but you'll certainly be enertained even when you're arguing with him throughout the whole show. That's another reason why JW is an interesting place to hang out, cause we all have [slightly] different opinions.

mendocino

10-17-2003, 04:12 PM

If you look at the celeb time on the suzuki liana, jeremy is faster than all but 2 guests... 3 if you include the stig.

Very good example alien!!! I wish I could have tough of it myself!! :D

themailman34

10-17-2003, 04:20 PM

i agree with the above posts...........Jeremy is an extremely good driver compared to the average Joe

His comments are biased, but they provide some comic relief :D

1zippo1

10-17-2003, 08:39 PM

When it somes to car opinions I trust Tiff more than most. It always seems like JC is looking for what is wrong with a car rather than what is good about it. Tiff drove in Lemans he knows how to drive a car whereas JC is a only mediocre driver. I mean in JCs top one hundred cars he went absolutely nuts. A lot of his list made no sense. The 360 moden number 97 or something!?!?! It was such a biased list. He pisses me off sometimes! Wheras Tiff never does. I tend to just ignore a lot of his opinions completely. I like watching him because he is funny as hell.

If I was looking for a good review of a car I would like to buy I would have to see a review of it by both presenters.

I like Tiff and I honestly think he's the most straightforward but the thing I dislike about him is that he sees every car as something to have fun with. He didn't like the RS4 because the 4 wheel drive makes the car to stable to play with, but that doesn't make it a bad car. But for the viewer, it appears that way.

Jeremy has a critic view on cars so he'll tell you all that's wrong with it. And he focuses less on the fun part of the cars then Tiff!!

For a clear review of a car, I still prefer a good car magazine.

AlienDB7

10-18-2003, 12:08 AM

I like Tiff and I honestly think he's the most straightforward but the thing I dislike about him is that he sees every car as something to have fun with. He didn't like the RS4 because the 4 wheel drive makes the car to stable to play with, but that doesn't make it a bad car. But for the viewer, it appears that way.
If you read the chat with Tiff on 5th gear's site, you'll know how much Tiff hates 4wd:

Wacko - I know your a Civic nut but please give me your opinion on the S3 - this could swing it and I want to make the best choice.
Tiff - Didn't I just say rear wheel drive rules, and even front wheel is better that four wheel.

and on safety:

IanFK - Tiff, whenever I see a programme that covers safety it then leads me to want to buy the safest car as tonight now i'm thinking it must be a Sabb, at the same time i enjoy driving fast cars and thus dont really want to comprimise ! is this an issue for you ?? any thoughts advice would be welcome ?????
Tiff - I have to confess, I'm a bit of an old school safety comes last man, but the more we look at safety issues, the more notice I'm beginning to take.

The interesting thing is, Tiff actually likes the impreza and evo even though they're 4WD with all the electronics to keep you on the road... I agree with you, magazine is better when you're looking for a more informative analysis of the cars. However, nothing beats test driving the car yourself (if that's possible) :mrgreen:

Chingachgook

10-18-2003, 06:12 AM

Tiff drives very very well, he's race driver, so he can understand the behavior of the car, where the limit is and how good or bad is the handling, the steering ,the brakes and so on. He can make a detailed analyse of the car.

Jeremy is a "normal" driver, he can tell us what a normal driver can fell about the car.
Have you seen the Lotus Elise 111s test? he says it was too understeering, but when the man from Lotus drove it, the car was always sideway...
I prefere Tiff, he is the man

mendocino

10-18-2003, 07:37 AM

And in everyday use... normal use, the 111s will understeer..; you can never do what cavin did on normal road exept you're just crasy, that's what clarkson wanted to tell us. but as said before they're just two really different people with different views of motoring.

AlienDB7

10-18-2003, 01:59 PM

If a "normal" driver wants a car that'll oversteer in everyday use, s/he wouldn't be driving a lotus anyway. If you can actually get to the limit on public road, it doesn't deserve the "best handling" car status! If you want to oversteer all the time, you may as well get the car tiff learned powersliding on...

Tiff - Yes, that's the big problem today. I learned my skills power slidding mum's Morris 1000 in the wet at 10mph. Nowadays, your doing 50 befroe you even get into trouble, and then it all goes wrong, all too quickly.

Sometimes, older cares are just more fun since you can really push it to the limit without going at an insane speed (relative to the road condition). I sure enjoyed going sideways at 10-20kph on snowy days :)

Tabero

10-18-2003, 04:53 PM

There was a fallout between the two of them...Tiff IMHO is a true driver that will examine a vehicle for what is really worth. Clarkson is a talker and is rarely drives any car the really reviews "the Stig" does all of there reviews. So Clarkson's give his opinion all the time w/o really driving the car. He does throw out some dry british humor but he lacks the racing blood that Tiff has.

maalox

10-18-2003, 09:10 PM

Part of it too is that Top Gear is aimed at a more general demographic I think. For one thing, Clarkson always glosses over a lot of more technical details as too boring/complicated for his audience--this is a tradeoff as it makes the show more accessible but also less interesting to the truly hardcore (I still like it, but mostly just to see cars I've read about in motion). Tiff's philosophy is more to emphasize the passion of driving, with a bit of commentary on whatever he thinks is interesting.