Video Card Problem Solved - £750 down the drain - GUTTED

[Jabba]

I now have the answer to why the cards are failing.

The cards have been closely examined and it would seem that there is either water droplets / condensation leaking onto them from my vapochil cooling system...it looks like both cards are un-repairable and I will have to pay over £750 to replace them (my original card plus the replacement)

I am still in a state of shock and feel absolutely sick.

[Anonymous]

I now have the answer to why the cards are failing.

The cards have been closely examined and it would seem that there is either water droplets / condensation leaking onto them from my vapochil cooling system...it looks like both cards are un-repairable and I will have to pay over £600 to replace them (my original card plus the replacement)

I am still in a state of shock and feel absolutely sick.

Damn Jabba yet another un-needed expense :( , Is there nothing you can do to get any compensation from the cooling system people? as i would caracterise that as an inherent design fault myself :| leaking water/ condensation next to expensive electronics shouldn't happen IMO

[Jabba]

Just sending them an e-mail now....and I am going to await their responce before saying anything else.

[pipe]

damn that sucks.. but it is one unfortunate effect of using phase change cooling - unless the insulation is perfect then you get some condensation :( ( I nearly killed a 9700pro the same way, but luckily after a few days it worked ok again )

[Jabba]

I paid alot of money to savrow for it to be perfect....I wish I had built it myself now...paying for your own mistakes is bad enough...paying for someone elses...well there are no words for how I feel right now....

[TT]

Argh that's sick!!!!!!!!!!

Shame on savrow for a messy job I suppose...

[stracing]

that really sucks

and whats worse you were praising them a lot in the other thread

[Anonymous]

Don't think we even know for sure who is to blame, may just be a faulty cooler and not within their control i guess

[Jabba]

Well they charged me big bucks for it...so lets see what they have got to say before anything else is said.

[mindgam3]

:( that aint too good, surely its still under warranty though? And its not exactly your fault?

[Jabba]

Its a very complicated issue and long story...but its a third party card that I fitted...that was damaged by a savrow component....

As I say... slightly more complicated and I hope they show good understanding of the situation.

[cooperluke]

Hum... big shit...

But you something from Savrow where they admit that it was their component that caused the other one to fail??

If I were you... I would get on their anckle until they payed for their mistakes!

Ask the opinion of your lawyer, maybe he has a better idea of the recomended procedures!

[SFDMALEX]

Well third party or not say you are a proffesional that needed that third party card. I dont think anyone buys a system that expensive and doesnt make alternations to it.

And this could have happend to any card, even their own card that came with the system.

[Jabba]

And this could have happend to any card, even their own card that came with the system.

The reason I changed their card was because it was un-reliable (kept locking the PC up)..and now I know why of course....gonna have a good look at that card tonight.

[itsthepham]

Hmm...Jabba, sorry about that horrible news though. anyways, have you have your mind set on any other cards?

[Jabba]

No. I have paid for a replacement of the same card that was perfect before the water started to drip onto it.

[Sm@ck]

I am afraid this is part of the price you pay when implementing cutting edge technology. If the system uses Vaopchill technology (not sure if it does), you might want to check the asetek forums. Maybe you are not the only one with this type of problems. Possibly there is a solution.

I am not sure if any of these threads address your problems
http://forum.vapochill.com/showthread.php?s=490c8ab00416763a6a54d08ce38a03d5&threadid=7624
or
http://forum.vapochill.com/showthread.php?s=490c8ab00416763a6a54d08ce38a03d5&threadid=7522
or
http://forum.vapochill.com/showthread.php?s=490c8ab00416763a6a54d08ce38a03d5&threadid=7540

It is really unfortunate. You really might want to consider switching over to a water cooled system, if you want long term reliability. but yeah 20/20 hindsight.
Then again you do have warranty. I will keep an eye on this thread, and wish you the best of luck, Jabba.

[Jabba]

Yes I am aware of that forum and I am a member there...thanks for posting the information anyway.

[callen]

so uve already replaced the card at your own expense? I hope since u are a valued customer at savrow, they will set things right, even if just for PR's sake! good luck jabba, and i hate to hear about these things, i just got mine back online after a failed power supply.

[jon_s]

I suspect that as callen has pointed out, they will do everything in their power to rectify the situation. I doubt they will pay any hard cash though, they would be more inclined to replace a card, and only one at that. I am not sure they will compensate for both :?

However, we are not talking about PC World here, so they could come up trumps. Best of luck Jabba! :P

edit: they also know that they have got more custom through you (can't rember the name of the person, but the desktop standard laptop for Uni). He said that he mentioned your name as well as Jabbasworld, so they know you are in a position to influence, which may influence their decision if you see what I mean. A bit of a long streatch I know.

[Jabba]

Savrow are speaking to vapochill as they seem to think there would be "oil everywhere" if the vapochill were leaking.

However it looks like colorgraphic were indeed correct. There is condensation dripping down onto the video card as you can see in the pictures.

I will let you know what Savrow say tommorow when they see the pictures.

http://www.jabbasworld.net/sav/1.jpg
http://www.jabbasworld.net/sav/2.jpg

[Jabba]

Turned off now...as I ponder the future for my vapochill system.

[DMbaseball1604]

That blows...I have never seen a graphics card that nice...I thought I got an amazing graphics card(ATI Radeon X800 SE)..I was wrong lol...

[mindgam3]

any news from em jabba?

[Jabba]

Well I have just e-mailed Ali a picture of the VC sent back to me by colorgraphic...you can clearly see the damage caused to it by the dripping condensation even with the naked eye.

I guess this is what you are going to want to know...how they treat their customers after they have parted with their money.

http://www.jabbasworld.net/sav/cg1.jpg

[PATo355]

Fuck that is sick , 750k !!! , you can buy a very good computer with that money , i guess that must be covered with warranty , there is a law here that anything that is sold with an invoice MUST have at least 1year warranty

[Jabba]

I have an "in-house" legal team should it come to it.

[PATo355]

I have an "in-house" legal team should it come to it.

Money is money , dont matter if they are 1 pound or 750 pounds , the fact is that if they dont come up with a solution you should make them pass a bad time , i know the value you give to the money , every pound earned costed work , so dont let em play with you , its their resposability , plus i bet the team of lawyers work for your company , so put em to work :P

[Jabba]

You can sue anyone for anything in the UK whether you win or not is another matter...you would be amazed at the results a good solicitor can get you here.

[Jabba]

Cost is irrelevant in this case as its the principal of the situation that has really pissed me off. Lawyers / Solicitors are part of my everyday life so not really a big deal.

I do not have any issues with the VC company...in fact I have always said how great they have been at all times.

[nthfinity]

sorry to hear the bad fortune of your water cooling leak :(
i suppose another reason im glad my computer sounds like a hoover vacuume cleaner
im sure you will come out on top... however... time does have a price... and often is quite upsetting when dealing on the phone, or dealing with anybody who cant make a decision one way or another, but rather, wastes your time in listening to your story, while stating company policy...
now im ranting :roll: :lol:
good luck, Jabba

[jon_s]

Talking of Lawyers, this has been going round legal circles quicker than, well, something very quick! This is what you can expect the next time you deal with a lawyer! :?

http://www.rollonfriday.com/voicemessage.wav

Jabba, I hope this is not your legal team :wink:

[stradale]

^^^ Jeez.... :shock:

Sorry to hear about what happened, Jabba. I sure hope savrow will help you out straight away. It is their responsibility because they sold you the faulty vapochill. Whether the damaged video cards were supplied by savrow is irrelevant. I hope this issue is going to be solved soon.

[mindgam3]

So what have Savrow said? That its not their fault and their not going to do anything about it? Or are you waiting to hear from them?


Euhm, warranty does not cover water damage or any kind of other fysical damage.

Warranty only covers production faults.


Warranty on the card won't be covered, but warranty for the Savrow system should be. It is a production fault if the vapochill system failed.... and its savrows responsibility to ensure that everything they put into their computers are not faulty

[Jabba]

So what have Savrow said? That its not their fault and their not going to do anything about it? Or are you waiting to hear from them?


Euhm, warranty does not cover water damage or any kind of other fysical damage.

Warranty only covers production faults.


Warranty on the card won't be covered, but warranty for the Savrow system should be. It is a production fault if the vapochill system failed.... and its savrows responsibility to ensure that everything they put into their computers are not faulty

Savrow are now washing their hands of it as they are blaming me for damaging the hose when I fitted the new VC.

They know full well I would not have - and I did not honestly go anywhere near that part of the system. Anyone that has ever fitted a video card before will tell you it takes less than five minutes to do. I have built numerous PC's before and would consider this to be one of the most basic upgrades anyone could carry out.

I never mentioned this previously but the first processor also failed due to a condensation issue from the vapochill hence why they replaced the original 3.2 ghz processor with a new 3.4 ghz processor. Although I was assured that the system was safe to run 24/7 there was a good chance that this caused the first processor to fail (being left idle for long periods of time causes condensation to form). I was assured there had been adjustments made to the vapochill cooling system that would allow me to run the system 24/7 without any further problems after the second processor was fitted.

The first time I put this to the test was a few days ago when I left the system running 24/7 powering a webcam that a few people were able to see on JW...the rest is history as they say.

There has now been a post made by a moderator on the vaporchill forums confirming that there is indeed a very good chance that the condensation issues that damaged my video cards would have been caused by leaving the system on 24/7.

Frankly I am disgusted at the sudden change in attitude from Savrow. I guess its a case of the old story once again - they put one face on when you are buying something and promise the earth to you and another face on when the product doesn't live up to their promises or there are any problems with it.

I regret ever recommending Savrow to you and should you mention this to Ali who will no doubt blame everything on me fitting a new VC, simply ask him what happened in the case of the first processor a few days after I took delivery of the system. I also have numerous pictures and e-mails from his R&D team confirming these problems with the system that have now surfaced once again.

[X-ale]

OOOoohhhh this is very bad man. I'm real sorry to hear this. Even more sorry for you tho. I hate to ask but curiosity demands, is this an issue normal for 24/7 liquid cooled system or just the VP?

[Jabba]

No idea about other cooling systems. After a lot of hard thinking being able to run a system 24/7 is more important to me than the extra 600 mhz that the VP allows me to over clock out of my 3.4 ghz (3.4 to 4.0 ghz)

Currently looking at converting it to an air cooled system.

[No.1]

Woah... this blows Jabba :(

Savrow have obviously no sense of pride, or loyalty. I really hope you get your system sorted... it will be such a shame to loose that performance, but necessary to keep your system working properly. BTW - i got a 1.7GHz Processor, so you are still 2x as fast as me :fadein:

As regards to recomending the company, i just hope that mindgam3 has a great experience with Savrow, and that thei after sales care is better on his laptop :D

[X-ale]

What if you change casing where condensation dropplets don't fall on anything. Isn't there a possible position? Seems skechy tho.

[Jabba]

Yes I have considered that but the thought of having just paid £750 for two water damaged cards and another £375 for a third one kinda puts me off anything to do with PC's and water ever again.

[X-ale]

Yeah I understand but a good quiet fan system is quite expensive too + the cleaning up is a bitch. I mean, since you already have the VP. If you can avoid more extensive costs by replacing the casing. There's prolly some forums around on liquid cooling pro/cons... This is painful to me also cuz I was hoping to swap to liquid too.

[Jabba]

There's prolly some forums around on liquid cooling pro/cons... This is painful to me also cuz I was hoping to swap to liquid too.

Cant get better than the official forums...for VP anyway.

http://forum.vapochill.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7772&perpage=25&pagenumber=2

[X-ale]

Thanks.

Anyway, back to the thread. The only real way you can fix the condensation is to take the current insulation off, get some new stuff that is slightly thicker too, and then put that on.

You could also get a bigger piece and slide it over the top of the current insulation as well. I've done that and it works really well.

repair the foam insulation just above the clamshell.
Even at stock speeds a Vapo`d CPU will perform better then one on air due to thermal aceleration.

You shouldn't give entirely up yet. Maybe one of these dudes know a dude that can do it up good.

[Jabba]

Thanks.

repair the foam insulation just above the clamshell.
Even at stock speeds a Vapo`d CPU will perform better then one on air due to thermal aceleration.

Would that break the savrow warranty? If it's still existing...

As I have already said...they are washing their hands of it completely...as I fitted the new VC.

[X-ale]

As I have already said...they are washing their hands of it completely...as I fitted the new VC.

Sorry, I didn't understand that when you first mentioned it. And I read p2 b4 p1... figured i should edit my post...

[X-ale]

Thanks for the heads up Thamar. So basicly, to not create condensation Jabba should do what stergiopilus and Rukee said + get a mini-fridge big enough to put his puter in + wireless externals evrything. At this point i'd consider cleaning up with compress air hassle a bargain.

[nthfinity]

No idea about other cooling systems. After a lot of hard thinking being able to run a system 24/7 is more important to me than the extra 600 mhz that the VP allows me to over clock out of my 3.4 ghz (3.4 to 4.0 ghz)

Currently looking at converting it to an air cooled system.

well, jabba... when converting, i will most highly recomend using these brand heatsinks... they are quite acurately, the best air cooling solution available, and i have been running for two years now quite happily :)
the updated design allows for greater air velocities, and a higher rate of heat soak... so quieter fans, and greater cooling
you wont likely hit those 600mhz clock speeds... but cirtainly half that with no problem, i think.
http://www.swiftnets.com/products/mcx478-V.asp
http://www.swiftnets.com/assets/images/products/mcx478-V/mcx478-v-400X340.jpg

[mindgam3]

Yeah that does seem fairly stupid that savrow can't take the blame for it, or at least should've done some testing to make sure this kind of thing doesen't happen. Most people i've spoken to have had their problems solved by savrow but this seems to be a very big and very expensive exception.

I think you should post something about it in their client feedback forum to let others know about it.....