OMG! No more celica after 2005!

[aks]

don't know bout u guys, but i surely am disappointed!

the celica has always been one of my dream cars! it's jus beautiful! how can toyota do this?!?!?!?!

read about it here
http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=7329

[oldsnail]

i think this is a repost, but its actually no more CELICA AND MR2 (MRs)

http://pressroom.toyota.com/photo_library/display_release.html?id=20040716

[ARMAN]

Dont worry they will make some new models, they are not stupid to cancel all the line of sports cars cause they'll loose too many customers.
I am not a big fan of celica, but I always liked MR type :)

[nurbrun]

oo no?????? :?

[Ghostbat]

I think I will survive. The celica becam a little worse for every new generation..

[altezza]

hopefully they will keep selling them in Japan
may be it's time for them to develop a better product

[PaulGT2164]

they are going to keep selling them in japan. the celica and mr2 have been in a sales decline....but they will bring something over to replace it, and i think the Tc is meant to hold the viod of the celica for now.

they need to bring back the turbo AWD celicas =)
or maybe a retor RWD drive one, cause they have been in productin since the 70s
and the current rumour i heard, which came from a dealer....is toyota is working on a direct competitor to the S2000
so that could be interesting :D
ill hate to see it go, the celica i think is one fo the best handling FWD cars money can buy, and are pretty good performance wise too, and the Alltrac/GT-fours are awesome.....
i work on 3 or 4 celicas regulary, see my avatar =) the blue one is a 1990 celica turbo alltrac, with a TRD spec turbo, HKS BOV, and a complete custom interior, the red one is my 1988 alltrac turbo, which is in process of being readied for SCCA prorally or rallycross, and the light blue celica at the bottom is a 1994 GT which at one time was one of the few turbo 5SFE celicas roaming the streets (est. 300+ whp) now its currenty receiving a 3SGTE swap while i build the 5SFE stronger for a customer of mine.

its a shame the FWD celicas were often overlooked in the aftermarket world, specifically the 94-99 models, who share the same engine as the camry, and the motor is bulletproof....

but oh well toyota will come back with them, or have something just as great

[possessed_beaver]

will probley make way for the supra replacment.

imo there is no such thing as a "true" peformance car, when it has FWD!

i hope they bring back the GT4 or a car to reflect toyota's involvment in forumla 1.

PaulGT2164 i would defentley agree with all you're comments.

[oldsnail]

i think they would rather sell a million corollas instead of a few hundred celicas and mr2s.. after all, most of the celica's parts have been donated to the new updated corolla.

[PaulGT2164]

true, but toyota also cares about making its image more youthful, i think the scion's TC will take the place of the celica for the time being, which is fine, its a cool car, i hope they offer a better handling higher power version (rumour has it they are going to) and the corolla with the 180hp engine, could be quite the fun car if done right =)

[oldsnail]

i guess all the japanese coupes are gone now in the celica price range..except for the the rsx(integra) .
i guess its main long time rival was the honda prelude which retired in 2001..
and mazda and nissan that doesnt have there mx6 and 240sx either, retired in the late 90's......

the celica put on a good fight..

the thing about scion, its only released in US..

[PaulGT2164]

yeah the celicas main competitor was the prelude, i remember reading that somewhere, and when the prelude died off, the sales of the celica did too
i have a huge collection of 70s and 80s celica posters, its quite a long running car with a ton of heritage, i am glad they still sell them in japan =) one of the things on my list of wants, is to drive a 1994+ GT-FOUR, i drive us spec alltracs often, but the last generation GT FOUR was awesome, 255hp turbo, AWD, and for its time, i believe it was the most advanced AWD system put into a production car, its a shame that they never sold the GT FOURs here after the 5th generation celica body style, so we never got the 6th gen body style gt-four (known as the ST205)
not to mention the celicas massive rally career, (at least 2 championships, and over 38 rally wins) and the fact most of the top drivers once drove for toyota.

i hope that toyota will once again offer a turbo awd sporty coupe over here. the new TC shares the same chassis as the jap spec caldina, which is available in a AWD form...so we can only hope i guess, and given toyotas familiarty with AWD systems, and mazda joining the fray in the EVO and STi world, i think toyota will offer something similiar, because in other parts of the world the STi and the EVO are selling like mad and have a huge following, so i predict the same will happen here, and the amount of popularity that the WRC and ProRally is gaining here in the states will only make AWD turbo cars even more popular

its like the return of the muscle car.....saloons, with mad power, with a modern twist

[Sachmo12345]

the only celica taht i was ever interested in was the Alltrac

[ahmedgiyab]

Thats very sad....actually I never liked the Celica coz it was FWD....the MR2 was a crazy

car....anyway they are very popular worldwide, especially the Celica.... :D

[oldsnail]

jsut a side note that mr2s and celicas share mechanical components from 1990-present.
stuff like 5sfe, 3sge, 3sgte, 1zzge, etc.

[DjPtsatsot]

well, i am not too saddened, but maybe this means there will be a new Toyauto ( :lol: ) Supra to follow?

[hemi_fan]

im not gunna lose sleep over it either... i never really liked the celica as it was FWD with a 4 cylinder engine... not my cup o' tea.

[ae86_16v]

i hope they bring back the GT4 or a car to reflect toyota's involvment in forumla 1.


That's what they've been saying since the beginning. Maybe they should start winning. 3rd year into the program and people are already talking about cancelling it. I remember when they debuted they said they'll be competing for the championship by the 3rd year.

I highly doubt that they Tc will be AWD, considering that it is suppose to be a "cheap" car. I saw the commercial of one the other day, that thing looks pretty sexy.

I don't mind them canceling it, Toyota needs to refocus anyways.

[PaulGT2164]

"I highly doubt that they Tc will be AWD, considering that it is suppose to be a "cheap" car. I saw the commercial of one the other day, that thing looks pretty sexy. "

maybe not the Tc, but the chassis is capable, so maybe a toyota branded spin off, thats what i said


"That's what they've been saying since the beginning. Maybe they should start winning. 3rd year into the program and people are already talking about cancelling it. I remember when they debuted they said they'll be competing for the championship by the 3rd year"

true, they were a little over ambitious, but in their other motorsports categories they took over (NHRA, Nascar truck, etc) lol i thinks its great they are doind so well in their first year of nascar truck series, as a magazine once said after the NHRA celica won, and after the awesome standings of the nascar truck series, they said Z"what does this mean? even the rednecks will drive camrys soon" lol

but oh well it is sad toyota is stopping the celica from being sold here, but its all part of a bigger plan, and i cant wait to see what new comes out!

[aks]

but oh well it is sad toyota is stopping the celica from being sold here, but its all part of a bigger plan, and i cant wait to see what new comes out!


i can't wait either! if the rumours are true and an s2000 competitor is comin from Toyota, then it's sure as hell gonna be one heck of a car! :D

[oldsnail]

but oh well it is sad toyota is stopping the celica from being sold here, but its all part of a bigger plan, and i cant wait to see what new comes out!


i can't wait either! if the rumours are true and an s2000 competitor is comin from Toyota, then it's sure as hell gonna be one heck of a car! :D

trd put a 2zz-ge in an MRS, and that is enough to keep the s2000 busy..
too bad that engine is featured in lotus now now..

as for the 3sgte for rally racing and celica gt4, it was was replaced with a modifeid beams 3sge in the corolla to compete.

[aks]

just imagine what trd would do with a stock s2000 competitor!!

[PaulGT2164]

one of these days im gonna buy a 2000+ mr2 spyder and put a 2ZZ in it....
i have some best motoring vids with that and they are awesome

[itsthepham]

one of these days im gonna buy a 2000+ mr2 spyder and put a 2ZZ in it....
i have some best motoring vids with that and they are awesome

Hell yeah, i have that dvd with the techno spirit MRS. that car hauls ass in that video. especially during the touge section.

[Ford Capri 2.8i]

Although the source is good....its difficult for me to believe this fact one both cars have had a lot of success in Japan, the USA and in Europe...if the car werent very successfull.....for example the VW corrado wasnt very successfull during its stay on market....id believe it easily..........see what happens anyway.....the life is very long

[sikx5]

The celica lost the plot after the st205. They just became more ugly and slow and a complete chicks car. quite dissapointing. I have been in the market for a st185 group A version but have yet to find a nice one in australia.

The ST205 would be awesome car for sure and i am buying one someday, even though they have huge KM's and still cost a fair bit. In japan you can buy a 1996 ST205 for less than $30,000AU for a car which has less than 50,000KM. A bargin really considering to buy a 1994 Group A ST205 in Australia with more than 120,000KM costs around $30,000. bit frustrating :x

[Josh]

Maybe they should make a new car inplace of the supra it is gettin very old
maybe they should do sumthin like the new 2007 skyline make it more prestiege lookin
!!NOT!!

[PaulGT2164]

"The celica lost the plot after the st205. They just became more ugly and slow and a complete chicks car. quite dissapointing. I have been in the market for a st185 group A version but have yet to find a nice one in australia."

the 1994-1999 models i think where the best looking celicas to day, curvy, and sexy

the 5sfe motor put down 150 hp in the 1994 pre-OBD-2 version and was pretty lightweight (under 2500lbs for the coupe version) so it was in the faster category of the cars in it class. my 1994 coupe, with a exhaust, intake, and modified throttle body could tick off the quarter mile in high 14s, which is not bad at all, but the most fun came with the turbo lol, i didnt get a chance to run it at the track before i sold the motor, but there wasnt much that could out accelerate me =)

the 2000+ GTS 6 speed was awesome, 0-60 in sub 7 secs and 180hp

with the EVO, the STi, the GTO, the coming Skyline, etc toyota will bring a car here to combat them, they are just sitting back and watching the market, they are smart like that....and they will count on the popularity and general badassness of the supra to help sell it, so it should have some of the attributes.....what i like about the conceptual drawings/models or the next supras and skylines, is that all i have seen keep the same style tailights :D which makes me happy.

and given the fact most of the general public (people who use cars as mere transportation...ugh) are still in love with the huge deathboxes known as sport utilities the tree hugging hippies havent noticed all the high power sports / gt cars that are coming out, so i can see a revival of the "big 4" (3000gt, rx-7, supra, 300zx) coming soon, we have the 3000gt replacement (EVO, sorta) the 300zx replacement (350z) and rumours of the next rx-7 and supra are rampant....its gonna be a good next few years in the car market

and luckily american manufacturers are somewhat stepping up to the challenge, with the new gto, solstice, etc

so my fellow brothers, and occasional sister, the time is upon us ! to rejoice in our sports cars, and drive them towards our salvation of speed! for do not let the evil car hating suvs get us down in out missions, my brothers! spred the word, spred the horsepower, and god bless all your pistons, and occasional rotors!

[sentra_dude]

150hp from 5SFE? Really...how can I get power like that from my 5SFE?

Glad to see another Celica driver, although I'm somewhat envious because you get to drive the serious Celicas...while I am lucky to even see a GT4. :P

[PaulGT2164]

depending on the year of the car, the 5sfe offered anywhere between 135-150HP
your 1992 model should be on the upside of 140 - 145

the motor is also shared in the camry

burien toyota (www.poweredbytoyota.com) has a really nice turbo kit (i have had it before)

and www.raceeng.com has pistons and rings and rods for the 5sfe

to get cams, go to www.webcamshafts.com, they have stage one and two cams

the 5sfe is a gooood motor, i like it

i have a ton of pics of the 1990 alltrac and my 1988 ill post later
and maybe a video or two of the 1990 model at the track, where in the 1/8th mile, completely stock (except for a trd spec turbo) it ran a 10 flat on its first run

[edwardbauer]

you just cant beat a s2000 for the effort it took on

[sentra_dude]

depending on the year of the car, the 5sfe offered anywhere between 135-150HP
your 1992 model should be on the upside of 140 - 145

the motor is also shared in the camry

burien toyota (www.poweredbytoyota.com) has a really nice turbo kit (i have had it before)

and www.raceeng.com has pistons and rings and rods for the 5sfe

to get cams, go to www.webcamshafts.com, they have stage one and two cams

the 5sfe is a gooood motor, i like it

i have a ton of pics of the 1990 alltrac and my 1988 ill post later
and maybe a video or two of the 1990 model at the track, where in the 1/8th mile, completely stock (except for a trd spec turbo) it ran a 10 flat on its first run

Hmmm...everywhere I've looked quotes the 1992 Celica 5SFE as producing 135hp/145torque...and some say as low as 130hp (which is usually quoted for the 1990 & 1991). I have never, however, seen anything as high as 140 or 145hp; I'm definietly not saying you are wrong, it just seems odd that I've never seen them quoted as being that high.

Maybe 140-145+hp for 1992 is for the domestic [Japan] market? Or maybe for other markets besides North America where I assume the emissions regulations are more lax, espeically 12 years ago when that engine was produced.


I looked into the Burien kit when I first got my car, and supposedly it is a pretty good kit (your opinion would be greatly appricated, esp since you've driven one!), but it is also quite expensive ($2500 w/o install) and that's too much money for me, plus I'm worried about the reliablity of the engine with the turbo.

It's my understanding that the 3S-GTE shares the same block as the 5SFE, but the 3SGTE has more oil pathways in the block(?) to help cooling, and some other differences (including smaller displacement) to cope with the stress of a turbo. The 5SFE, not being designed to handle a turbo does not have these features, and that makes me seriously doubt its ability to handle the stress of a turbo for long periods of time (25,000mi).

In addition to that, I have heard very mixed ratings of the 5SFE overall as an engine to be tuned. In stock form it is bullet proof, but once you begin to go past basic tuning it doesn't hold up very well, and some say heavy tuning equals a blown 5SFE...no matter how you do it. Can you confirm/refute that?


I took a look at the cams & pistons sites you gave links to, and thanks :D.
Those are some pricey cams...$632, or maybe I am just delusional about the cost of parts :P. About how much would it cost/how difficult would it be to change the cams on the 5SFE? Would there be that much of a difference in feel after changing the cams?

That's alot of questions I threw out there, so hopefully you can at least answer a few for me. :D

[DanielW]

i think the current celicas are stunning looking cars, but they lack any balls.

[PaulGT2164]

"I looked into the Burien kit when I first got my car, and supposedly it is a pretty good kit (your opinion would be greatly appricated, esp since you've driven one!), but it is also quite expensive ($2500 w/o install) and that's too much money for me, plus I'm worried about the reliablity of the engine with the turbo.

It's my understanding that the 3S-GTE shares the same block as the 5SFE, but the 3SGTE has more oil pathways in the block(?) to help cooling, and some other differences (including smaller displacement) to cope with the stress of a turbo. The 5SFE, not being designed to handle a turbo does not have these features, and that makes me seriously doubt its ability to handle the stress of a turbo for long periods of time (25,000mi).

In addition to that, I have heard very mixed ratings of the 5SFE overall as an engine to be tuned. In stock form it is bullet proof, but once you begin to go past basic tuning it doesn't hold up very well, and some say heavy tuning equals a blown 5SFE...no matter how you do it. Can you confirm/refute that?


I took a look at the cams & pistons sites you gave links to, and thanks .
Those are some pricey cams...$632, or maybe I am just delusional about the cost of parts . About how much would it cost/how difficult would it be to change the cams on the 5SFE? Would there be that much of a difference in feel after changing the cams? "


the burien kit is great, and you only need to go get small minor parts from the dealer ( a few non re-usable o rings and whatnot) and isnt that hard to install, and i had no issues running it at the stock boost level at all

the 3SGTE block and the 5sfe block are alot alike, the head diiference is donated by the "G" in the 3sgte meaning performance, and the "f" in the 5sfe denoting drivability/economy

theoretically it is possible to transplant the 3S series head on a 5S but i have never seen it done, and yes you are right, there are extra cooling passages. one day i will get around to seeing if they are important, i have alot of 3SGTE and 5SFE parts laying around.

the 5SFE is a great engine for low boost situations (no more than 8-9 psi) but thats at least an extra 80hp at that boost, which does make a huge difference, especially in rolling start acceleration. but anything more than that and you do have to replace the internals, unless you tune the engine to a knife edge, which is never good (one gallon of bad gas...) however if you want to be different, build a 5SFE turbo, with full internals...the torque is much better than on a similiar output 3sgte. the biggest problem with turboing the 5sfe to 16-25lbs boost is that the 5sfe doesnt have the oil squirters, and it runs hotter than the 3sgte at the same output, to counter this i used the intercooler from an audi S4, and later a Saab 9000 and an oil cooler, and converted to waterless NPG coolant and i didnt have any troubles besides lots of tirespin lol, and the stock clutch...yeah it goes pretty fast above 6psi if you drive the piss outta it


the price on the cams isnt that bad seeming they are low volume cams
i was very very happy with the performance of the stage two cams, the engine had a angry lope to it, and i could tell there was alot more power on top end, and the cams are not hard to install, if you have never done it, do it on a weekend or when you dont need the car for a day or two, there is nothing wrong with taking your time, especially when it comes to this kinda of money

i was just bored, and wanted someting other than a "run of the mill" 3sgte swap so i built a 5sfe, but given the cost, the 3sgte is more economical, but its really cool to pop the hood and see toyota knowledgable people gasp in amazment of your 300+ hp 5sfe

i ran the car for a while (45k miles) with the built engine, and had no problems running 14-16 psi boost most of the time, it was reliable, but i took lots of precautions too

now i am conteplating a rwd 1994 celica....i have a few untried ideas....but ill have to try it to see if it works, cause no one has ever done it, but the 6th gen 1994-1999 celica has a longer, wider wheelbase, and would be awesome RWD drift car, i figure the longer and more uderhood space would allow me to mount the 3sgte in a longwise posotion using custom mounts, and then using the transmission from a jap spec is300 (they use the beams 3s motor) a custom driveshaft, and the rear end outta a GT four it could work ;) lol

anyhows i could go on all day, i love toyotas, and celicas, and have owned 3 or 4 of them and they all were awesome

[sentra_dude]

Thanks for all the info PaulGT2164. 8)

[graywolf624]

Another front wheel drive car bites the dust(in current form)..

Forgive me if I dont shed a tear in the hopes that maybe the rwd that has begun at the american automotive manufacturers will rub off on the japanese.

[sentra_dude]

^^^I sure hope you're right...

I know one thing, I will never buy/own another fwd car.

[oldsnail]

i have a 5sfe in my motor.. and honestly, its reliable, but not worth modding.. it doesnt produce 150hp stock.. highest output was the final years on the 2000 camry which had 142hp.. replaced with a newer 2.4L w/ vvti in current gens..

i was thinking of modding my 5sfe... but after the intake and flywheel.. i gave up and just hope one day it will blow so i can put either a 3sge or 3sgte.. modding the 5sfe just cost too much, and with the money spent will not outperform a stock 3sgte..

if u compare the lastest celica gts fully loaded with sunroof/leather/stereo and all the crap, its still lighter than a stripped version of an integra type R.. something to think about.