Another race, again NO OVERTAKING.

[caugb]

Despite being a rather interesting race, MS again won in the pits. Come on, how far can we go with this?

***edit*** by Toronto
changed the name
Sorry i don't want anyone to be upset, by knowing who wins b4 they watch the race 8)

[No.1]

There was lots of overtaking after the Hangar straight :wink:

Great to see Michael win... but Ross Brawn deserved it for an amazing strategy :D

Barrichello should have managed to leapfrog Raikonnen in the pitstops, but it wasn't to be :(

:shock: - Trulli's crash. A big ass acccident, but he jumped out of the car right away. Marshalls were quick to the scene (unlike with Ralf at Indianapolis) and cleared the car in a few laps :D

However... Renault were well off the pace... as were BAR... i expected a challenge from Button in his own country, but the car wasn't good enough :?

[mindgam3]

I reckon kimi would've been in the lead for the majority of the race if he hadn't had so much traffic among the first pit stops n would've had a much better chance of winning. His car ddint seem to be as good at the end compared to the strat though.

A good win for schumacher, nice strategy that nearly didnt work thanks to the safety car but he came good in the end.

Agreed, poor race from BAR and renault, jenson seemed to have the pace in the begining, but like kimi dropped off towards the end.

Good run from rubens too, and overall a good race ;)

[Toronto]

Big news in schumi's 80th win,
but it is even bigger new sato finished a race :D

I thought the race was good, I don't think silverstone is a good track for f1, just because it really only has 1 or 2 overtaking points (all in straights) so a good car can win you the race (not to say that schumi is a bad driver) Schumi just had the best car/strategy for the race!

[caugb]

Nothing against you all, folks, but I would like some comment from someone my age (35). Toronto, despite being 22, seems to enjoy F1 from the good old Senna days (like me and any other brazilian in my age). Do you really got used to "strategy" instead of "overtaking" or you never saw races like that to understand what I am saying?
No offense here, I really wnat to understand if you think a race like this (much better than average, I admit) is a GOOD race.

[sameerrao]

Nothing against you all, folks, but I would like some comment from someone my age (35). Toronto, despite being 22, seems to enjoy F1 from the good old Senna days (like me and any other brazilian in my age). Do you really got used to "strategy" instead of "overtaking" or you never saw races like that to understand what I am saying?
No offense here, I really wnat to understand if you think a race like this (much better than average, I admit) is a GOOD race.


I guess it is a question of re-setting your expectations for racing in the 2000s. I loved the dicing between top drivers in the 80s. But it hasn't happened to the same degree for a long time

The lack of overtaking the last couple of years are due to:
- circuit modifications - more chicanes, less passing zones
- carbon brakes reduces stopping distances, reducing the time to conduct an overtaking move
- too much emphasis on aero over mechanical grip - less overtaking there
- arguably less men of the ultra-top calibre - note I am talking Senna, Prost, etc...

Last year was a lot closer primarily due to Ferrari's mis-steps in the beginning of the year and Bridgestone being on the backfoot for the first half of the season.

This year Ferrari is too strong and Michael's driving is exemplary. He has shown that he can win from nearly anywhere - P1 to P6.

Overtaking in the pits is an easier option than overtaking on the track - less risk of damage, etc. So it is the obvious choice if one has the luxury if choosing

Overtaking on the track from the front of the pack will occur only if Mclaren, Williams,et al improve their car to challenge Michael on lap to lap basis. This will be occur only if Michelin can do something to cure their performance drop-off occuring towards the end of a race stint.

Enjoy the overtaking in the mid-pack - there is a lot of it....

[No.1]

^^^^

I see your point, but we have sort of accepted the fact that overtaking is becoming more and more rare. :?

When i say the strategy was great, that does not mean that i would prefer an overtake in the pitlane rather than one on the track. :wink:

It would have been amazing to see Schumacher challenge Raikonnen for the lead through Maggots & Becketts :shock: , but it seems that overtaking is becoming less common.

I would love to see some races fro mthe Senna era, but they are not on the TV and the DVDs are rare, expensive, and usually not very good :?

[caugb]

Even after all these years after Senna's death, I still get up early on Sundays (european races are usually 8:00am or 9:00am). I am angry on the terrible restart of Rubens after the SC left. The seconds he needed at the end were lost there. I still read magazines about all the details of F1 technology. And I agree that the race was very interesting, apart from the 1st place.
But I like motorcycles also (note my avatar) and MotoGP is 10 times more emotion than F1, mainly because of the many overtakings. I konw, it is easier, the bikes are smaller and they do not depend on aerodynamics, so the racer's skills can be seen in the slides and brakings. Is that the way to go? I don't know, aerodynamics are certainly an important part of the show, but is it constructors' or racers' championship?
In races like german DTM, there are some brands (not many), but most overtakings depend on some car damage. This is not possible in F1. So, what's the way to go? Less aerodynamics? Better circuit designs? Raise minimum weight, so cars can be stronger?

[HoboPie]

See I'm a little different in the way I watch F1. I certainly like passing, but by far the biggest draw for me is seeing the cars perform on that level. I actually enjoy just watching them lap the circuit.

I prefer a race over say watching practice, because this is all about competition, but I still get a huge thrill out of seeing the car do a lap and finding out it was the quickest lap at the track or even the quickest lap that race.

[fabro_s]

Wow, what a surpirse, MS won again, that is becoming a rutine.... :|

[Toronto]

caugb,

I see your point, the fact it that i have been watching f1 since I was born, my dad and my older brother are huge f1 fans, instead of watching sat/sunday moring cartoons i watched f1 races, I think the fact that stalking (schumi's current style of racing) is due to Flavio style of winning races, using the pits was never more important untill Flavio used them to his advantage.

In the early 90's most races i have seen, and there was plenty of passing it does seem that the sport did hit a wall with the death of Senna in 1994, but I still think it is exciting to watch,

also f1 decade over the past couple of years has let me re-live those races :) not to mention the dvd's i have

[caugb]

Interesting to note that Nelson Piquet started the "Refueling era", with pit strategy. But it was quite the opposite of today. He had to pass everyone, refuek and pass again everyone. But as today everybody does have the same strategy (almost), it is becoming boring. Maybe sealing the gas tank is the way to go. Cars will have to handle very different weights (start and end of race) and only pit for tires. Why not?

[SPAD]

I wish der was a way to make more passing without taking away from the tech that the sport is known for.I dont mind much though i LOVE F1 just the way it is.Also u have to think about wat J.P.M. said"ther is lots of passing in F1,its going on mid pack.This is verry true.

[Toronto]

caugb - true on using the pits as a strategy with Piquet being first, but he but in a few quick laps when everyone was on the race track, unliek the Modern strategy (Flavio) the driver put in quick laps when other drivers are in the pit, as seen in use by schumi's current style, most of his fast laps are done when other people are in the pits

[chipanggo]

they should bring back slicks so we can see more passing. cars nowadays rely so much on aerodynamic grip that they can't drive close to each other too much. with slicks, they have more mechanical grip so expect to see more wheel to wheel action and late braking maneuvers.

[Toronto]

^^^ slicks i think are claimed to have the ability to add 2-4sec + per lap (if they are put on modern f1 cars with all the auro work they have had done to them, if you look now cars a faster then what they where when they did use slicks, so i don't think that slicks would make the race have more passing

[stracing]

put on slicks and reduce aero efficiency. in the past cars would follow behind and be sucked along when they're 30-40m behind. today you would have to be right on their gearbox to get any slip streaming. prett easy really, on the rear section, place another element that punches a big hole in the air