Schumacher isn't a good driver.......

[Apac102]

I was just kidding, schumacher is a great driver, but he isn't the best driver out there. If you think about it, I would have to say WRC drivers are better then him..(well, the top ones like solberg). He has been racing over the same courses his entire life. They are exactly the same all the time for him! Yet, for WRC guys, they are different each year and each day with new terrain that they have to anticpate. I would love to see how well schumacher could handle the cars as well as the WRC drivers do.

[chipanggo]

you can't compare f1 drivers to wrc drivers. f1 racing and rally racing are different disciplines. they are both racing but they race in very different conditions. so it is very difficult, if not impossible to compare.

[stracing]

i reckon thats silly comparison. its ike comparing apples and oranges

[Apac102]

Fine then. Who would you rather be your limo driver while you are being chased by criminals that want to kill you?

[yg60m]

The same question can be asked : what would do a WRC driver on the track compare to Schumacher ?? Certainly not bad but not as good, as Schum would do.
Being a track driver doesn't mean you can't drive sideways, just look at Tiff Needell, he's a track driver (F3, F1, LeMans ...) but i would certainly thrust him, being chase by criminals.
Mikka Hakkinnen drove a rally car on snow/ice too last year and he wasn't bad.
Also Stéphane Sarrazin who was a Prost GP testdriver finally decided to go to french championship rally and he's the leader now.
Alain Prost raced in the ice championship (Andros Trophé) with great success this winter (finished second) and so ....

[Apac102]

good point. That was a quick topic :?

[sameerrao]

I was just kidding, schumacher is a great driver, but he isn't the best driver out there. If you think about it, I would have to say WRC drivers are better then him..(well, the top ones like solberg). He has been racing over the same courses his entire life. They are exactly the same all the time for him! Yet, for WRC guys, they are different each year and each day with new terrain that they have to anticpate. I would love to see how well schumacher could handle the cars as well as the WRC drivers do.


APAC102 -A bit of oversimplification don't you think?

"He has been racing over the same courses his entire life. They are exactly the same all the time for him!" - There have been new F1 circuits over the last couple years - Indy, Sepang, Bahrain, Nurburgring, Hockenheim (after the transformation). And on other circuits there have been changes over the last ten years wrt to adding chicanes, changing the corners, etc.

"Yet, for WRC guys, they are different each year and each day with new terrain that they have to anticpate." - The WRC drivers have pace notes for all the circuits and they are allowed to do recce sessions to get some familiarity with the new sections. And good chunk of the circuit that remains same from year to year.

It would support your point here if the WRC drivers went into each race blind - meaning no pace notes - but this does not happen.

As has been mentioned by the others, F1 and WRC are worlds apart and direct comparison is futile

I admit that WRC throws more variables at the driver - changing surfaces, drastically different weather from hour to hour, longer race durations - requires them to maintain 100% concentration for several hours.

So with all the above factors it is easy for one to immediately conclude that WRC is the best disciple around. However, I dont agree with this.

I think all these factors mean is that a newcomer will take longer to become a master in WRC than F1.

F1- It takes about 2 years for someone to become proficient in F1. It takes one year to learn the circuit and about 2 years to learn how to deal with the nuances of set-up and other aspects that make one a potential winner. However, all this does not make one a Schumacher. It takes skill, experience, car performance to win championships the way he did.

WRC - It will take several more years to become proficient here. Most of the drivers rgo through a couple years of the junior rally tier and even WRC learning the circuits before they can hope to be championship contenders. Thus the top contenders are much older than the equivalent F1 counterparts

However, once a person has the experience of a Petter Solberg I think it is the same challenge as it is to Michael Schumacher in his arena.

Petter will have clearly understood what it takes to succeed in snow, or gravel or tarmac and it becomes routine to him.

[amanthapar]

this topic is fucking dumb.....

u think schu cant drive sideways? or drift... those fucking f1 cars got traction control and plus if u didnt know on a tarmac which has more grip it is faster if u take the racing like and not drift or go sideways at all...

gosh man THERE ARE ALWAYS SOME DUMB PPL IN THIS WORLD WHO SAY STUPID STUFF...
compared to wrc... well... im pretty sure that f1 driving requires more skill than wrc.. and this can be seen into how much of electronics are gone into the car, and all new supercars are f1 technology today so i guess its a benchmark?

i sure that f1 drivers are more skilled, sure its a totally differnet scene with wrc and u need differnet straegies but f1 is just more challenging... and i heard that some f1 drivers make their way up from wrc f3, f2,f1, not neccasrily in that order though and lemans also..
if wrc was more harder, then why is not as much hype abt it than f1?
yes wrc is more competive that is because of the sheer number taking part, and is harder to work up to the top but, SHUM is the fastest driver on average..

now i feel like killing whoever started this nonsense.... sorry if i deviated from the inital topic... but yeah shum is the best driver in f1 and if he were to do wrc im sure he would arrive at the top their too with lots of practice..

[Apac102]

back the fuck up amanthapar. You didn't need to read this you queer. Settle the fuck down....ass

[SPAD]

I have always wanted to see schumacher race a rally car.

[Daggernite]

I bet any F1 driver could drift, it would be natural as you got to that standard. But I would have to say Rally drivers need abit more skill. Dunno if anyone has got the PAL version of GT4 Prologue, but on the extra DVD that come wit it, Vikki.B.H is the commentator, and she even states thats most the F1 drivers that tryout Rally, fail at it. But course F1 drivers can drift n beable to control cars without TC and that type of stuff.
Interesting topic actually.

[amanthapar]

hmmm.... well i would have if u dont say anything dumb, but u were joking (yea right)

[dropot2]

"Schumacher isn't a good driver..." good way to attract people to your topic LOL :D
________
Ktm 125sx (http://www.cyclechaos.com/wiki/KTM_125SX)

[trza2k]

Even comparing f1 to f1 drivers is like comparing apples to oranges. Unless you have every driver driving the exact same car with limited changes to setup allowed to them then you will never really know who really is the best driver.

[espen]

Well, rumor has it Shumi drove around in an F360 on summer tires, and was seen going very fast and very very sideways on minor roads in mid-winter snow at his cabin in Trysil, Norway this winter. (Trysil is a super wintersports area and is one of the most snow-rich areas in snowy Norway!) So I don't think he's utterly incapable of going sideways ;)

Or look at Walther Røhl - world rally champion turned track champion, and now Ringmeister. I think pure talent, hard work and a good car will get you far but in racing, progress is as much a question of economy as anything else. Thus if you have the talent, I think wether you end up doing WRC or F1 is more of a coincidence than part of The Plan(TM).

[mindgam3]

I agree that you cannot compare F1 and WRC drivers, although i would say it is much harder to compete in F1 than it is in WRC and drivers from both disciplines are amongst the best in the world. Look at Rossi though, he dosent even race cars and he was within a few seconds of Schumachers times at a test session, now thats talent

[stradale]

Well, rumor has it Shumi drove around in an F360 on summer tires, and was seen going very fast and very very sideways on minor roads in mid-winter snow at his cabin in Trysil, Norway this winter. (Trysil is a super wintersports area and is one of the most snow-rich areas in snowy Norway!) So I don't think he's utterly incapable of going sideways ;)


I remember a similar anecdote from, I think, Fritz Kreutzpointner. Before competing in F1 Schumacher raced at Le Mans for Sauber - Mercedes. He and his team mates (Kreutzpointner and Karl Wendlinger) were heading for a physical training facility somewhere in the alps in what I think was a BMW. Schumacher was behind the wheel and put his foot to the floor. They were not driving on an autobahn but on a curvy road through the mountains. The weather was bad, it was snowing quite heavily. That didn't bother Schumi though. He was driving at an incredible pace, overtaking cars all the time and drifting through the corners. Upon arrival at the training facility prior to the workout all three men's heartrates were measured for comparison during the workout. Wendlinger and Kreutzpointner's heartrates were well above what could be expected while Schumi's was normal. And he was the one that had been driving!

[fabro_s]

You cant compare, I read in a magazin that Shumacher stated that he had a lot of respect for WRC drivers he said that in WRC you need to have a lots of concentration and skill.....

[5vz-fe]

You cant compare, I read in a magazin that Shumacher stated that he had a lot of respect for WRC drivers he said that in WRC you need to have a lots of concentration and skill.....

I agree, becoz rally drivers drive at night and just counting on the navigator drifting in to a blind corner at insane speed. In F1, u dive into a corner and brake soooo late that it take stopwatch like timing, also finding the ideal line and setup for the car.....

just to name a some diff.........

[goose93]

Fun converstation, but fruitless. i have to agree that you cannot compare these two sports. The driving techniques are so very different and the style of competition is almost a reversal of the other.

I do think it would be interesting to see a brief exhibition swap of cars and drivers. I would love to see the respnses from the different drivers after the test.